Testing the New La Lune

I started out with two razors that were both German made although one was a hollow ground and the other was a near wedge. Both in the 11/16 size. I set the bevel on both to be sure I was getting the best results from the hone. The first was the hollow ground razor. I took it up to 10k and under the scope, I could see a very well-polished bevel and straight edge. A fine test subject. For the second razor, I did the same except I took it up to the 20k stone.
I stropped the 20k edge and had a test shave with it. Yep! Just as I like. The razor just wipes the whiskers away with no effort at all. Like a washcloth wiping off dust.

The first razor I went to the La Lune after the 10k edge and made a Slurry. I did about 20 to 25 laps adding a bit of water until it was very close to clear water. BTW, I started with a very thin slurry. At that time I rinsed off the stone and used Balistol and water. I did 12 laps on the oily mixture and cleaned it up. Stropped as usual. Then took the 20k edge and did 20 laps on a light slurry. Stropped as usual.

Razor number one with the 10k/La Lune edge I found about equivalent to an 8k edge. HHT was very low but it was cutting hairs. It shaved but with a little pulling. The 20k/La Lune razor felt like a little more than an 8k edge as it did shave and with a very little pulling. HHT was about the same as the first razor. Still not as smooth or keen as I like. I finished up my shave with this razor. The closeness on my neck is nowhere near what I like, but it shaved. I will have plenty of whiskers to shave tomorrow.

I will need to do some more testing. I'm hoping that after a 20k stone the La Lune on oil with only a few laps might put a bit of comfort in the 20k edge. But I'm also afraid it may just bring the keen level down quickly too.

The color is a little purple and it makes slurry without too much effort. Not as easy as a Cotie or Y/G Thuri but easier than a Dk. Blue Thuri or Zulu.

I did manage to get the label sealed so it's safe forever now. I hope I can find what will make this stone work well for me. Keen is what I enjoy and I've recently figured out how to add an Arkie as a finisher after the 10k. Keeping a level of keen but adding more comfort. Time will tell what I can get out of this stone as a finisher.

Hey Gasman! What does it mean when you say you got the label sealed?

Good write up Jerry and thanks for taking us along for the ride. Good luck with your quest and let us know what you find. I'm eager to hear how that works and is best used.

BTW, welcome to the cult of the Ark. Of all the new edges from new stones I try and think are grand I keep going back to the black or trans and say find it's my favorite, at least with the American steel.

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Originally Posted by Johntoad57

Hey Gasman! What does it mean when you say you got the label sealed?

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I sprayed a clear coat on the side of the stone where the label is. This way if the label was to get wet (although I was told it's waterproof) it won't get damaged. Here is a picture. You can't see much but the two sides are different colors now. You can see a slight line on the side of the stone about a third of the way down.

I just like to protect hone labels when I can.

Attachment 345225Attachment 345226

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Originally Posted by Gasman

I started out with two razors that were both German made although one was a hollow ground and the other was a near wedge. Both in the 11/16 size. I set the bevel on both to be sure I was getting the best results from the hone. The first was the hollow ground razor. I took it up to 10k and under the scope, I could see a very well-polished bevel and straight edge. A fine test subject. For the second razor, I did the same except I took it up to the 20k stone.
I stropped the 20k edge and had a test shave with it. Yep! Just as I like. The razor just wipes the whiskers away with no effort at all. Like a washcloth wiping off dust.

The first razor I went to the La Lune after the 10k edge and made a Slurry. I did about 20 to 25 laps adding a bit of water until it was very close to clear water. BTW, I started with a very thin slurry. At that time I rinsed off the stone and used Balistol and water. I did 12 laps on the oily mixture and cleaned it up. Stropped as usual. Then took the 20k edge and did 20 laps on a light slurry. Stropped as usual.

Razor number one with the 10k/La Lune edge I found about equivalent to an 8k edge. HHT was very low but it was cutting hairs. It shaved but with a little pulling. The 20k/La Lune razor felt like a little more than an 8k edge as it did shave and with a very little pulling. HHT was about the same as the first razor. Still not as smooth or keen as I like. I finished up my shave with this razor. The closeness on my neck is nowhere near what I like, but it shaved. I will have plenty of whiskers to shave tomorrow.

I will need to do some more testing. I'm hoping that after a 20k stone the La Lune on oil with only a few laps might put a bit of comfort in the 20k edge. But I'm also afraid it may just bring the keen level down quickly too.

The color is a little purple and it makes slurry without too much effort. Not as easy as a Cotie or Y/G Thuri but easier than a Dk. Blue Thuri or Zulu.

I did manage to get the label sealed so it's safe forever now. I hope I can find what will make this stone work well for me. Keen is what I enjoy and I've recently figured out how to add an Arkie as a finisher after the 10k. Keeping a level of keen but adding more comfort. Time will tell what I can get out of this stone as a finisher.

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I have a vintage Lune and when I tested years ago the lune would improve the edge from a 20k Gokumyo ( I used water only) but a minimal number of strokes had to be used. Say 10-15 max.
This would keep all the loving qualities from the 20k but would bump up keenness a tad.
You never mentioned how the edge looked under the scope after the Lune.
I don't believe slurry is beneficial with the lune especially if you are all ready at a 10k edge.
Just my opinion.

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Originally Posted by stoneandstrop

...I don't believe slurry is beneficial with the lune especially if you are all ready at a 10k edge.
Just my opinion.

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That's an interesting point. I would be curious to hear how it takes an edge from 4k with slurry though.

I will sometimes go to a Coti for about 10 dry strokes after 12k to take some of the prickliness out but leave the crispness.

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Originally Posted by stoneandstrop

I have a vintage Lune and when I tested years ago the lune would improve the edge from a 20k Gokumyo ( I used water only) but a minimal number of strokes had to be used. Say 10-15 max.
This would keep all the loving qualities from the 20k but would bump up keenness a tad.
You never mentioned how the edge looked under the scope after the Lune.
I don't believe slurry is beneficial with the lune especially if you are already at a 10k edge.
Just my opinion.

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Thank you for your comment. I will try this next time. Hard to believe minimal strokes on water would bring the keenness up from 20k. I will be looking forward to testing this. This alone would make the buying of the stone worth it.

As far as what the edge looked like under the scope after the La Lune...
I was a little surprised as it had the same look as a Jnat puts on the bevel. Really! No BS. I will have to check this again but this is what I was seeing. Possibly if this was what I was seeing it might actually smooth the edge out more and give more keenness.

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Originally Posted by PaulFLUS

That's an interesting point. I would be curious to hear how it takes an edge from 4k with slurry though.

I will sometimes go to a Coti for about 10 dry strokes after 12k to take some of the prickliness out but leave the crispness.

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I'm not sure as i didn't try it.
I find - generally - that using a slurry on a fine finish stone from a relatively coarse start (1-4k) never produces an edge that you can get through a better and thorough progression. Jnats being the exception.
It can certainly be done reasonably well but for me its ALWAYS been better stepping up more gradually.
Some stones are just better for final finish only. As a matter of fact I think all stones have there place and range so trying to get them to work outside that range is rarely beneficial.
Sure, it can be done but never as well. My opinion anyway.
Its why we all keep a number of stones at the bench, they each have a purpose.

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Originally Posted by stoneandstrop

I'm not sure as i didn't try it.
I find - generally - that using a slurry on a fine finish stone from a relatively coarse start (1-4k) never produces an edge that you can get through a better and thorough progression. Jnats being the exception.
It can certainly be done reasonably well but for me its ALWAYS been better stepping up more gradually.
Some stones are just better for final finish only. As a matter of fact I think all stones have there place and range so trying to get them to work outside that range is rarely beneficial.
Sure, it can be done but never as well. My opinion anyway.
Its why we all keep a number of stones at the bench, they each have a purpose.

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Well,... respectfully, I have to disagree about being able to get a stone to perform past a specific range. The only kind I really know well enough to say my opinion is worth seriously regarding are arks and those I can use 2 or 3 stones (depending on the stones) to go from bevel set to finish, this using stones with different lapping on either side which achieves the effect of 4-6 stones.

Also, from my limited experience I find that using slurry on a slate or Coti takes the potential back much farther than finish only; really back at least as far as mid level.

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Originally Posted by PaulFLUS

Well,... respectfully, I have to disagree about being able to get a stone to perform past a specific range. The only kind I really know well enough to say my opinion is worth seriously regarding are arks and those I can use 2 or 3 stones (depending on the stones) to go from bevel set to finish, this using stones with different lapping on either side which achieves the effect of 4-6 stones.

Also, from my limited experience I find that using slurry on a slate or Coti takes the potential back much farther than finish only; really back at least as far as mid level.

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I never said it couldn't be done, I said the opposite. It CAN be done but not with the same quality result.
I absolutely agree about slates and Coti's (Escher excluded) The stone at its finest state is not strong enough to get it back efficiantly.
You could go from 1k to finisher given enough strokes on any stone. Many have tried. The one stone fad.
It just doesn't produce the same quality of edge as something worked up.
Again, just my opinion.

Fair enough. Sorry if I misinterpreted what you said and I would agree that it is definitely easier to do a progression and maybe better also. It is definitely faster to do a synthetic progression than a full ark progression. Sometimes I know I do things for the sake of seeing if it can be done. Whether it is/was a fad or not I don't know but I have toyed with the one stone method "because it was there" as George Mallory would say.

Also, sorry to have highjacked your thread Jerry.

I prefer my Arkie edges.

A lot of people don't like arks because they are "slow" but if you are willing to put a little time into it you can get a fabulous edge from them, my favorite for some things. I discovered a method that works surprisingly well and doesn't take that long really. I posted it somewhere.

One thing that I have discovered about them as a broadly general rule is that the ones sold at least 40-50 years ago are better rock than the ones sold more recently. At least that's my experience.

I have a collection Arks, the finishers, True hard a beautiful stone, hard Black , Translucent a Blue Black any of these produce an excelant edge however the blue Black might be the best.

Ooh nice! Blue black is one I do not have, in fact I have never even seen one in person. I inherited a bunch from my dad. Most of them circa 1960-70. I also have a few trans, a couple of blacks including a surgical black, a calico washita and a Pike No.1 plus a few others.

Oh! I also have a boxed one I believe may be a butterscotch but I got it at an antique store and they coated with some glaze crap to make it shiny like they do with wrenches. It's probably museum wax. I just haven't gotten to that one yet.

Its been a while but today I got somw time to do some honing. When its in the Sub-0 temps outside I cant do much else. LOL

I reset the bevel on this razor and took it to 20k. Then did 20 laps on the LaLune with Clear Water only. Here are a couple micro pics...

20K bevel
Attachment 345634

Lalune
Attachment 345635

The same area of the bevel, I didn't change angles or lighting so this should be as same as possible. With all the extra stria I have a hard time believing this will make for a smoother edge, But I haven't test shaved, and as we all know that is the real test. I will put it on a pile of Leather but the test shave will be in a few days as I just had my shave today and have things to do.

You need to change the background for photos to show the edge better.
Try black, Robins egg blue, even white might be better.
The right lighting and background makes a HUGE difference.

Sure. Why not. I can change colors next time. I think I have some colored cardstock around here somewhere.

I can see there's more striations but the edge looks cleaner off the La Lune. It's pretty good in both pics but I think maybe a hair tidier in the after pic.

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Originally Posted by Gasman

Sure. Why not. I can change colors next time. I think I have some colored cardstock around here somewhere.

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You have my sympathy with taking pictures.

Well actually, it's looks better with the 20K instead of the Lalune to me. More scratches from the Lalune or so it seems to me. As long as my razors get the job done (and they do), that's all that matters to me. But what the hell do I know about high price stones vs marble plates with diamond compound? If it works for you Jerry, that's all that matters!

Yeah it has more scratches on the bevel plane but look at the very edge. To me it looks cleaner at the apex.

That's because the 20K photo is out of focus a little. Nah, just wanted to pull your chain! I see what you are talking about now. You know, I just never paid attention to stuff like that. I only paid attention to if I get a great shave or not.

Shaved with it tonight. It felt like a cotie edge. The Natural feel but only 8k sharp.
I will go back to the stones and try again another day. I have to try this a few times before I can say anything for sure.

BTW, I did find some nice blue card stock so any future pics will be different.

today I took this razor (BTW it is a Robeson Cutlery made in N.Y.) back to a 4k stone. Lightly run the edge over the corner of the stone then reset the bevel. Checked it with TNT as that is my standard test.
Attachment 345752

Went to 10k. BTW I'm using my Shapton Glass Stones.
Attachment 345753

Then 20k...
Attachment 345754

Cleaned everything up and did 10 laps on the New LaLune...
Attachment 345755

Stropped with 100 laps on leather...
Attachment 345756

Testing...
Doing a serious HHT with hair from my grandaughter that I test with it wouldn't cut any. Not even a grab on a hair. For the standing arm hair test, I got a couple of hairs that grabbed but not much.

The shave felt like more than 8k keen. And a level of comfort/smoothness. I'd have to say it was better than a Cotie edge in keenness. I will give this a bit more time on the leather but I'm not feeling very positive about this stone.

I'm open to any other ideas to see what more I can get from this stone and I will try this all two more times before I call it a doorstop.

The old purple lunes are pure oilstones, no slurry, low laps, under 20. They are a rare natural you can overcook an edge on... Honestly, if it is the same material it should be bumping the edge way higher than ~8k level as far as sharpness.

I was hoping for this also.
I had more than one person tell me it could bring more out of a 20k edge. But I'm not seeing it yet. Maybe the difference is this is the New LaLune and not an older mined stone. :shrug:
My next test will be oil only. Maybe the viscosity of the oil it will make the blade lay on the stone softer and give better results. It's possible and worth a try.

Lead into it with a sub 10k edge and just use oil.

Have you burnished it.?

Try burnishing, then oil, no slurry.

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Originally Posted by kcb5150

Lead into it with a sub 10k edge and just use oil.

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8k edge then oil. Sure. I will give it a try. I have a couple of ideas to try to see what I can get from this stone. I will add that to the list.

I could Burnish the stone. I checked to see if it was flat with a straightedge and it looked good so I didn't change the surface any. I can see burnishing might smooth out the stria it's leaving.
Another test to try. Thanks, Mike.

I can see slurry is not an option on this one. Wonder why they sent a rubber with it?

One of the ideas I had was just the opposite of Burnishing. I've found that a 1k surface on an Ankie stone gives a great shaving finish. I was thinking of this too. The Stria I'm getting from this stone makes it look like it's not a finishing stone at all IMO. But a few more tests to see.
Thanks. Any other ideas from the group.

@Viergedefer from 1stone posted this...


Do not hesitate to use it this way after an 8K (coticule or others) :

Passage X with slurry, then dilution until clean water + stone and at the end a stroke with oil / glycerin and a few passages also .

The result will be better with a softer edge.

It's up to you !!! and thanks to you

Nicolas

So this will be my next test after an 8k. I did this to a point but not completely. So stepping back to the beginning seems like a good idea for now.

BTW, I took the Razor back to the 10k then finished on the 20k and had a nice full shave. So its not my Bevel Set or Blade.

Background is a little better color, try even darker next time.
The most contrast is best. If you can get enough light on it then try black.
Too bad the edges are not better yet. I have an old "very fine"Lune.
As kcb5150 says the older ones with water(for me) and under 20-25 laps should make it ridiculously sharp.
Off the 20k it will improve sharpness and retain smoothness if laps are limited.

Try the PHIG I gave ya. You can finish on that, then smooth it out with the Lune :roflmao

I've honed a few for Jerry, he's an oddity when it comes to the edge he likes/prefers.
Never keen enough, he said. So I fixed him up with an edge so crisp it was deemed..too sharp. That, came from the PHIG with water alone.

I try to get wedges feeling as much like a metal squeegee as possible. It became more of a challenge when my beard went white and got harder. If I just wanted insane sharp and nothing else I would take a razor to an old special stone only for good razors and then strop it generously.

I do still have the PHIG Mike. And have used it. It does great but has no level of comfort.
I like an edge that is keen enough that it feels like a washcloth wiping the whiskers off with no effort at all. But I've found in the last few years I can get a level of smoothness along with that level of keenness. I was hoping this stone was going to give this to me. I'm not giving up yet. I like the 20k edge, and with a little smoothness on top of that will be just right. I'm just trying to find an easier way to go about it with another stone and not all the CROX or CBN or time on the strop.

Mike did make an edge that was too much for even me. It's hard to believe. Then he sent me the stone that did this as it was way beyond what he likes.

Wow, I haven’t checked in, in a while, but I have 2 of the modern purple La Lunes, they give me an incredibly close shave. And red dots, lol. Incredibly sharp edges that require care with shaving technique.

Bring the edge up to 10k Shapton Glass or 12k Naniwa, then 10-20 on the PLL with oil, dishwashing detergent, or glycerin.

You know what you might like Jerry is some of joamo's quartzite "bacon strips."

https://sharprazorpalace.com/hones/1...ml#post1941961

I have a couple which I have not totally deciphered yet but they make an edge that is keen and yet comfortable. I would imagine he has more.of them. They are a little slow like an ark and hard like them too but don't seem to make an edge quite as prickly as the hard arks can.

Might be worth a try.

I havent been in the mood for honing lately hope to get back at the Lune soon.
Not sure I want to go through l the work ofapping one of those pieces of bacon, Paul. Its a nice looking rock and sounds right up my alley. If he still has some it could be a fun stone to try. But Id have to buy the SIC powder too.