I have a cheap set of cuisnart kitchen knives that need some sharpening. All I have to sharpen with is a norton 4k/8k is this hone good enough
to sharpen these knives with and what kind of method should i use to sharpen them?
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I have a cheap set of cuisnart kitchen knives that need some sharpening. All I have to sharpen with is a norton 4k/8k is this hone good enough
to sharpen these knives with and what kind of method should i use to sharpen them?
I think the real question there is, are these knives good enough to use on this hone? I don't think the blade will have the hardness to really be of any use if sharpened on the 8k side, even the 4k side will probably be too fine to put a new edge on these blades - depends just how blunt they are.Quote:
is this hone good enough to sharpen these knives?
You can try though, use an x pattern as you would with a razor, but you have to concentrate to ensure you are holding the knife at the right angle; you will feel more draw when you have the full bevel contacting the hone surface. The hard part is getting a consistent edge all the way along the curve of the blade. I'd just use the 4k unless you have a 1k, in which case I'd use that, then finish with a steel.
IMO if you want a knife that really hones well, you have to go for a Japanese laminated blade. The level of sharpness you can obtain with these knives makes me giggle like a school kid!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linc
I agree with this, there are certainly some kitchen knives which are the same as a Zeepk razor, the only way you can get them sharp is basically with a grind wheel. Give your knives a try though and if it don't work invest in some quality knives.
Its true Japanese laminated knives are great (I don't like Global though) but German knives hold an edge equally well. Some cheap quality German knives include Giesser, Victorinox (that might be Swiss) and F.Dick. Out of those 3 I prefer the F.Dick then Giesser haven't gotten attached to Vitorinox. I have several Japanese knives but 90% of the time I use German ones.
I'm a Japanese steel convert. Infact I'm packing up tonight for a weekend seminar given by Dave (sharpening guru for japanese knives). German steel is fine and all for some folks that don't demand much from their kitchen knives. Hold an edge to get dinner cut up, and that is perfectly fine. However some of us (nuts) like the finest edge possable that can making cutting a pure pleasure.... Ok the beer took over... getting back on topic...
Personally I think the 4k is to fine a grit for most german steel. German steel is just to soft (compared to japanese steel) to take advantage of that kind of polish. I don't take my only german (messermeister) knife past a 1200 King stone, it just doesn't hold up to or need the polish.
That siad it is your knife and stone, do as you wish to learn the difference and feel. You may be ok with the results, and that is all that really matters.
For the chef types - I enjoy working in the kitchen, trying new recipes and use Henkels. I am curious though - does anyone sharpen mandolin blades and if so how? I was going to ask this earlier but since my mandolin recently removed a chunk of my fingertip :cry: I figured it was sharp enough. :w
A dull blade can still remove chunks, if you didn't feel it get removed, it may be sharp enough...
most knives won't benefit from anything more then around 1000 grit, especially anything mass produced. Custom made knives on the other hand are a thing of beauty when taken to the higher grits, and probably shouldn't be allowed to fall below the 1000 grit sharpness.
but for your knives, I say no, don't use your norton 4/8. Especially when some pretty decent sharpeners are available for kitchen knives for around $20.
It would take forever/way-too-long to put your first bevel on knives with a 4k or 8k.Quote:
Originally Posted by matt
For years I have used a DMT coarse 325 to set a bevel, fine 600 mesh to get it "shaving" sharp, and an extra fine 1200 mesh on the very finest knives only. Most of the time, lately, I even do the first bevel with the 600 mesh.
My avatar shows the pocket stone I carry to maintain most of my knives at "shaving" sharpness.
Good Luck,
I bought my wife a nice set of japanese kitchen knives. These knives are hard, Rc of anywhere from 62-65. I use a norton 1000/4000 to keep them sharp. they slice like a dream.
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Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL
Why don't you like Global? Curious.
The next logical question is, of course, can the Norton get thrown into the same drawer as the knives?:shrug:
Inquiring minds are legion
Gosh, 1k is way too much for kitchen knives. I think your trying put a Briggs and Straton lawn mower engine in a Ferrari.
I finish all my knives on 8k including both my Gieser and F.Dick ones which are mass produced, stainless knives, but the sharpness is very much superior to that of coming straight off 1k hone. Still not as sharp as the carbon though. But since the OP is probably just using them for domestic purposes 1k certainly get you a relatively sharp edge.Quote:
Originally Posted by Russel Baldridge
Personally I think they're ugly and the metal handle isn't ergonomically friendly (to me anyway) also I used to work in a cold environment and the scales on a knife got cold enough without handling cold steel all day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Philadelph
I don't think they have been designed too well, since I have seen several chefs drop theirs and they snap between the handle and the blade because it seems to be too thin.
Of course this is just my opinion and what I have seen, everyone's different. I'd rather shell my money out on a decent carbon steel knife from Sakai than on a Global.
I sharpen my kitchen knives on up to a 4k. An 8k finish will yield an edge that will quickly dull and not cut as well. Personally, I prefer the belgian blue stones for kitchen knives as they are quick and the edge is phenomenal.
I recommend cross-training for honers (whetters) as a way to improve skills. You'll learn more about what's going on at the edge by sharpening a wide variety of cutting implements than through any other way. Your razor honing will improve as a result of your honing other things.
I have honed all kinds of kitchen knives, hunting knives, fishing knives, tools both woodworking and metal, in fields as divergent as agriculture and tool making. You'll develop a great life skill by doing all of this.
In general, for kitchen knives on a Norton, what angle should I be shooting for? Obviously the optimum amount of bevel on stone, but does anyone have a number?
I've mostly heard to go for the 30º range.
I like 23 degrees (centerline of knife to bevel). Fold a piece of paper or index card twice from the corner and you have your template. DMT recommends 20 degrees in their brochures, but it doesn't need to be exact at all. Buck Knives currently recommends 13 to 16 degrees, which I consider too fine for everyday use (the edge is slightly thinner and weaker, as in "straight razor"). 20 to 23 degrees will give you a nice sharp edge with a bit more edge retention. Your choice.
If you can't cut it with 23 degrees or so, it can't be cut.:D
YMMV
I like Global exactly for the way they look so obviously it's a matter of taste. With that in mind though, Globals aren't the most comfortable knives to use and I've had the blade snap off once. Luckily, it's lifetime warranty and they've exchanged it no questions asked. Still, there are a lot of other better knifes you can buy for the price.Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL
As far as sharpening, I think it might be over-generalization but I'd say majority of work is done using 1k stones. You can use higher stones of course but it depends on the hardness of steel, the angle you put and the intended use. I don't think there is a universal answer.
However, I've had japanese style knife (uneven edge) professionally sharpened and he used a progression of japanese stones all the way up to around 30k.
I never let my kitchen knives touch my razor hone. Saves my lapping time :)
I sharpen my kitchen knives (german steel) with Arkansas stones. I start at the soft then go to the hard white. Thats good enough for any kitchen task I have.
As you can tell sharpening anything is a personal issue. What works for one is poopy to another. I'm sure I'll be filed away as "one of those nuts" after you read this :p
As stated earlier I'm a fan of Japanese carbon steel. I use my 4/8k norton (only polish stone I have) for both razors and my kitchen knives. What some people END their sharpening rutine on is what I rarely go DOWN to. My kitchen knives stay sharp for weeks at a time on the line at a restraunt with heavy use, off the 8k stone. So yes you can have a good sharp blade past 4k. I plan on getting a shapton 12k soon for a final polish on my various slicers. You would be amazed at how sharp a good carbon steel knife can get, and it will keep that edge if done right. My 270 AS steel gyuto falls through lemons and I don't even feel the seeds as they shave off. Can you do the same with softer western steel knives, ya but not as easy and they wouldn't hold it as long. On that same note the softer steel would roll the edge instead of chip, so you end up with a trade off.
All of this is relative anyway. The quality of the steel, bevel, stone, user skill, idea of what sharp is, and SO MANY other variables will dictate what is going to happen when you sharpen your knives.