Hanging hair test question.

If a razor passes the HHT and provided it is not overhoned, is that a surefire way of determining whether a razor is shave ready?


I have honed a razor up to passing the HHT. The razor cuts the hair sometimes cleanly and other times it hits the blade and bounces slightly then catches and cuts on the next hit giving a ping sound.

After stropping the HHT is passed intermittently; sometimes requiring a few passes of the hair. The blade feels very smooth on the thumb pad moved across.

Is the blade shave ready then ?

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Originally Posted by razorhead

If a razor passes the HHT and provided it is not overhoned, is that a surefire way of determining whether a razor is shave ready?

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The only surfire way I know of is to actually shave with it, if it shaves without pulling it's shave ready.

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Originally Posted by razorhead

I have honed a razor up to passing the HHT. The razor cuts the hair sometimes cleanly and other times it hits the blade and bounces slightly then catches and cuts on the next hit giving a ping sound.

After stropping the HHT is passed intermittently; sometimes requiring a few passes of the hair. The blade feels very smooth on the thumb pad moved across.

Is the blade shave ready then ?

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My best guess is that you are pretty close to shave ready, it should pass the test on the first attempt, but then again sometimes I do find that different hair acts different in the HHT, try shaving with it and see how it feels.

My 0.02

Not necessarily. The HHT is a guide, not an end result. Some people can't pass the HHT and yet get good shaves, while others pass the HHT and get bad shaves.

There's actually been a tonne of threads on the HHT - unfortunately a seach on HHT won't work because searches require a minimum of 4 letters - try a search on "Hanging hair test" or something like that.

I'm not sure the thumb pad test (TPT) should feel smooth - did you moisten your thumb?

Xman wrote a blog on the various tests here.

Bottom line is that the tests can be useful, but the ultimate test is the shave. Try a shave and see how it goes.

James.

The HHT, for most people, is just a gate you pass through on the way to shave ready. If your really good at stropping you should be able to shave with an edge that passes, but most people can hone even better than that. Some people never pass the HHT and get good shaves (maybe they strop really well).

You need to do the HHT test with a hair similar to a whisker, like chest hair or eyebrow hair, or whatever. Some people use hair from their head which is a big challenge, since its so fine.

For me, I won't test shave until I pass the HHT. That is just to limit the abuse I put my face through.

HHT is really hit and miss for me.
And I don't have hairs to try it with, so I use a ball of hair I scavenged from my wife's brush.

I have been able to use the HHT as in indicator of whether it is time to leave the 8K norton and go to the coticule.

That said, these days I am experimenting with the TPT (Thumb Pad Test).
First I hone on the 4K until it passes the TNT (Thumb Nail Test), then I do 2 pyramids, do the TPT, and then repeat as necessary.

When the TPT is OK I go to the coticule. Number of strokes depends on the way the water reacts to the moving blade. Usually 10 - 20 laps with slurry, then 10 laps without.

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Originally Posted by Jimbo

Not necessarily. The HHT is a guide, not an end result. Some people can't pass the HHT and yet get good shaves, while others pass the HHT and get bad shaves.

There's actually been a tonne of threads on the HHT - unfortunately a seach on HHT won't work because searches require a minimum of 4 letters - try a search on "Hanging hair test" or something like that.

I'm not sure the thumb pad test (TPT) should feel smooth - did you moisten your thumb?

Xman wrote a blog on the various tests here.

Bottom line is that the tests can be useful, but the ultimate test is the shave. Try a shave and see how it goes.

James.

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Hi James, Thank you for the pointers on the search. It turns out there are quite a few HHT threads from varying points of view. Tonnes of reading :)

With the thumb pad test my thumb isn't deliberately wet but I am wetting the DMT hones every 5 strokes or so to wash away debris and keep it lubricated so my thumb isn't bone dry either.

What I do is move the thumb pad across the length of the blade trying to assess the smoothness making sure there aren't any rough spots. I also watch for 'catchiness' and after stropping for example I can see the blade cutting painlessly into the keratin epidermis on my thumb pad with ease and I back off or risk slicing my thumb. I move it across carefully checking for this along the blade.


I'm going to try my first full shave tomorrow morning after breakfast... wish me luck :)

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Originally Posted by razorhead

What I do is move the thumb pad across the length of the blade trying to assess the smoothness making sure there aren't any rough spots. I also watch for 'catchiness' and after stropping for example I can see the blade cutting painlessly into the keratin epidermis on my thumb pad with ease and I back off or risk slicing my thumb. I move it across carefully checking for this along the blade.

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You don't slice your thumb along the blade, do you?

Good Luck! :tu

James.

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Originally Posted by Bruno

You don't slice your thumb along the blade, do you?

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Hi Bruno,

I remember being horrified by watching 'plexuss' (the youtube straight shaving guy) during his honing tutorial running his thumb along the blade thinking he must be insane. I had routinely tested kitchen knives by 'plucking' the blade across the blade with my thumb to get an idea of sharpness, but never along the blade.

It was only when I started this whole honing thing that I tried this out and blow me, you can do it without cutting your thumb and it actually gives a great sense of how thin and smooth the blade is. It's a very very light touch.

Try it, and decide for yourself is what I think :)

For me, the HHT is just an indicator that a blade has reached a minimum level of sharpness. It shows that a good edge has been established and is ready to be polished. I can pass the HHT off of a 4K hone with ease and at times even off of a 1K hone. But you definitely wouldn't want to shave with those edges.

If parts of your blade are passing the HHT and others aren't, I'd guess you need to do some more work on the hones before you'll get a comfortable shave.

Have a great day,
Josh

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Originally Posted by JoshEarl

For me, the HHT is just an indicator that a blade has reached a minimum level of sharpness. It shows that a good edge has been established and is ready to be polished. I can pass the HHT off of a 4K hone with ease and at times even off of a 1K hone. But you definitely wouldn't want to shave with those edges.

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+1 Here
I think Josh really summed this up well......
I believe all 3 "tests" are just that, tests, they do not determine how good the shave is going to be (that would be the 'shave test') they determine the condition of the edge. The first test TNT tells you that you don't have any rough spots, wire edges, etc: Then you go to the TPT, which tells you that the edge is getting sharp... Then you try the HHT, which tells you that yes, you did get the edge pretty darn sharp, and it will cut hair, now get to work and make it smooth too.....

I agree with Glen in that no test is the be all and end all. They each give you some information about the edge, and you have to learn to interpret that information.

One other thing I should have mentioned is that if you're cutting hairs along parts of the blade but not others, you might have a wire edge. A wire edge acts like a really sharp edge until you get to the shave test, at which point it betrays you. :)

Others have written about the "quality" of the cut you get on the HHT, and that can be very telling. A little ping when the hair cuts might mean the edge is dull but toothy. A silent slice is a good sign. :)

Keep at it,
Josh

On the question of grabbing, dragging, or what ever you want to call it. Doesn't this also have a bit to do with how tough/thick the beard is? I know that on the sharpest of blade, I still get a bit of drag..

btw, also, does anyone agree with stropping the blade "While" shaving? For example, you do 5 or 6 strokes, rinse off the blade, strop 5 or 6 rounds and then resume?

thanks for your input.

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Originally Posted by MD11

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btw, also, does anyone agree with stropping the blade "While" shaving? For example, you do 5 or 6 strokes, rinse off the blade, strop 5 or 6 rounds and then resume?

thanks for your input.

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I don't know about that much stropping, but I do believe in stropping between passes.... An example would be: WTG pass, rinse, re-lather, strop 10-15 laps, XTG pass, repeat above process, ATG pass, rinse and done!!!!
Hope that made some sense :)

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Originally Posted by JoshEarl

For me, the HHT is just an indicator that a blade has reached a minimum level of sharpness. It shows that a good edge has been established and is ready to be polished. I can pass the HHT off of a 4K hone with ease and at times even off of a 1K hone. But you definitely wouldn't want to shave with those edges.

If parts of your blade are passing the HHT and others aren't, I'd guess you need to do some more work on the hones before you'll get a comfortable shave.

Have a great day,
Josh

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+1 This has been my experience as well.

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Originally Posted by JoshEarl

If parts of your blade are passing the HHT and others aren't, I'd guess you need to do some more work on the hones before you'll get a comfortable shave.

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This is very important. A very critical factor in honing is uniformity. The goal for the honer is to achieve, as close as possible, a perfect, uniformly honed edge from point to heel.

The HHT, as JoshEarl mentions above, is one way to quality control for this. And another way is, of course, the TNT (thumb nail test).

If you find that your razor is either sharper, duller, or even over-honed at different sections along the edge, you will never get that optimally comfortable, close shave.

Yes, more work on the hones is going to be needed, but...consider your technique first. An unevenly honed edge is a good indicator that something in your honing stroke could be a little off.

Scott