honing experiment re-visited

I was taking part in the honing experiment before the crash, and my e bay razor arrived today with the bevel set for me by David so here s my progress.

Upon getting the razor I had a look at it under the microscope, the edge looked very flat. Then tried shaving arm hair and it was popping them straight off, did the TPT and HHT both of which it passed.

lapped my norton and decided to do a small pyramid progression. 3/3 1/3 1/5.
Did the first 3 on the 4k side then did the 3 on the 8k side turned it over 1 stroke then back on to the 8k and as the blade slid over the stone I felt the sensation of grit on the stone. I stopped immediately and looked at it under the microscope.

The beautifully flat bevel David had set now has tiny little chips in the blade:cry:

OH NO .. So I stopped and scrubbed the stone and re-lapped it. I think it may have picked some grit up from the norton box it was resting on when I turned it.

SO I did the same progression again on the stone and finished on with 20 strokes on a coticule.

It shaves off arm hairs easily but did not pass the HHT . under the microscope the chips are gone but the edge does not look as flat as when I received it.
So i stropped it on my red latigo stroke for 30 strokes and took it for a test shave.

Well it seemed to take some of the stubble off but it was not a smooth shave and was slightly pulling. and now my face does not even feel like I have had a shave.

I figure that I need to go back on the norton but do not know what progression to use, and I do not want make it worse.

Any help is greatly appreciated

Just as a side note, whenever you do pyramids I would suggest always rinsing the hone AND blade between 4k and 8k every time you switch. Otherwise grit could be tranferred back and forth making the 8k useless.

That said, I never really use pyramids, so I will let someone else chime in since I don't want to complicate things for you.

since you have a microscope...

check for a really good bevel and then work for smoothness on the 8k

Chipping in the bevel...Ouch. I forgot to mention that you should have just stuck with the 8K. Going back to the 4K was not necessary, and it sounds like you left grit from your lapping stone in the stone when you honed it which chipped the very delicate edge. Hone on the flat and smooth (no grit left in it) 4K until the microchipping is completely gone and the razor is very sharp on the TPT and then just stay on the 8K for 10-25 passes. Strop and test shave.

ok. have scrubbed the norton and did a few pass s with an old junker. Grit seems to be gone.

started with the 4k side, checking it with the microscope and the TPT every 5/6 passes lost count of how many I did. the edge looks a lot straighter now but not as straight as when I got the razor from David. but it does feel really sharp on the TPT.

So went on to the 8 k and did 25 pass s it does not feel as sharp as when I did the 4k TPT but I guess its smoothness I m going for now. will strop and shave.

......................

stropped 10 linen and 20 leather also took my TI with me just in case.

Well it shaves better than the last time I tried, but its still pulling, had to finish the shave with the TI.

Im guessing I need to go back on to the 4k and really get that edge looking super flat??:hmmm:

well I went back on to the 4k for about 60 laps, the edge is starting to look a lot flatter and is shaving off arm hairs easily, then did 25 on the 8k and 20 on the coticule.

had a look at the edge on my honemeister blade to compare how flat should look.

Damn my version of flat is not as flat as a blade done by someone with experience.

stropped the razor on leather for 35 strokes and went for a test shave.
It does shave but does not seem to take all the hair off. ended up finishing with the honemeister edge again.

Thinking that their must be one or all of the following wrong

1 my technique
2 my stone needs a good lapping again
3 I should of stayed on the 4k for longer

Any advice is greatly appreciated

I don't know what you mean by flat, do you mean an even bevel width? The width of the bevel is usually determined by the grind of the spine not the skill of the honer, and is not indicative of sharpness. Whan a razor is not ground perfectly the bevel will usually not be perfectly even either. If the bevel is sharp all the way from heal to toe then move on and polish it even if it is not a perfectly even thickness. On the other hand the issue could also be from uneven pressure or a stone that is not flat.

David

Hi

I'm really sorry that it has taken so long to get back on to this.

This is a sketch of what i see under the microscope.
Line A is what I mean by 'not flat'
When I look at a correctly honed edge it is completely smooth all the way across line A. Not like mine which has very small nicks.

Thanks for your help hope my drawing can explain things a bit better.

simon

That helps a lot. I think the solution might be practice, unfortunately. It could be not using an x pattern, it could be using too low a grit, it could be overhoned. It could also be that your using too fast of a hone (this ofcourse is relative, understanding that the stone is honing too fast is easy to compensate for). And, I'm sure someone else will have another solution.

I will say that I've seen it often with people that are learning to hone, and not with people who have practice. I guess I'll provide that as an observation, because I know that isn't what you want to hear.

Consider the four ideas I'm providing in the first para, for now, along with any other suggestions.

After that I would consider honing it up on a higher grit or a slower hone to remove the problem.

Are you using slurry on the 8K?

no I m not using slurry on the 8k. I have a norton which I have read is quite a fast hone.
sounds like practice is the key.

thanks for all your help