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This was my grandfathers. It is small 4"x2". Is it too much of a pita to use a stone this small as a finishing stone? By the way there is no stone to make a slurry with, but I have read that some people do not use the slurry. Thanks for all of your opinions.
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I doubt it, the line between them looks like glue, and as far as I know the belgian blue was never glued to a coticule for mass distribution.
Find an old blade that you can experiment with and see if the blue side sharpens the steel.
There are a couple of people here who have a Belgium combo that is glued, so it is possible that that's what you have! Looking just at the picture though I wouldn't know for sure.
If it is bluish or purplish in color it is likely a Belgium blue, on the other hand, if it is greyish it is not likely a blue but rather a slate backing for the coticule!
Huh, you learn something knew everyday.
Cuticule/Berlgian blues were glued as combo stones up until about 80 years ago, and hen they stopped doing it for some reason.
As for this stone, I'd lap the dark side. If the slurry you get is purple-brownish it's likely a belgian blue. Another thing is that the slate backing you get on modern coticules are generally a uniform dark colour, while belgian blues have a bit of a speckled look.
I've got a blue....and I've got a yellow...and that looks like a blue/yellow combo to me.
That's a blue-yellow glued combo alright. Very nice stone. You'll get used to 4x2. Maybe not ideal for serious elbow-grease honing but for touch-ups and finishing it's a great size.
Glued blue-yellow combos are relatively rare but they exist alright; I have one.
I just picked up a stone on E bay, looks just like your blue stone. I was surprised at how hard it was when I started to lapp it. The Norton lapp stone made very little headway. I thought coticles were soft. Have you lapped yours?
Thanks
Al
It appears the blue side's corners have been rounded.
For a reason, eh.
Coticules are quite hard actually.
Yes, there are glued combos.
This one looks a bit like slate, not Blue - but it may be just the photo or dirt. If it's purplish when you clean / lap it - then you are in luck :)
Not PITA to use at all (at least - not for me) - I'd cherish it! I'd also venture that the yellow may not be very hard, some vintage coticules are kind of soft
Cheers
Ivo
I have a glued combo and a natural combo. Looking very closely at the first picture I feel like I can see the garnet matrix in the side of the blue. However, the picture showing the break looks more like a cleave line for slate than my broken Belgian blue. Obviously this is not definitive in EITHER way, but I am leaning towards this being a combination stone. In order to tell, find an eye loupe or hand magnifier and have a look at it. If you see a matrix of inclusions in the stone, these are almost definitely going to be garnet, making it a Belgian stone. Of course the lapping test will work as well.
Once you lap it you'll know in about two seconds if it's a blue. Purple slurry = blue belgian, it's that simple. As for the color of the rock itself, that can vary – anything from blue to purple to just about black. I have a natural combo where the blue doesn't look blue at all, looks jet black. But somehow the slurry always looks the same, purple.
I agree with Ivo that vintage coticules are often softer. My finest coticule is actually very soft.
Thanks everyone for all replies. Dumb question but how do I lap the stone? Do I buy one of the little niigura(sp?) stones for the slurry or should I buy ne of the course DMT stones? Thanks again.
One clue might be the yellowish rock on the bottom. It looks like one of my naturals. It could be coticule vein on the other part of the blue.
To me the dark looks like slate though. It might be my monitor adjustment. Not sure due to the different factors. MikeB
it also looks more like slate than blue to me, but yes, lapping will tell you right away.
If you're cheep you get a wet/dry sandpaper in the (300-500 grit range) and a flat surface - marble, glass, etc. Then under a running water you make figure 8 w/o much pressure. You can pencil a grid on the stone and when it disappears, the stone will be as flat as the sandpaper on the other flat surface. You can then run it quickly on finer grit sandpaper, to get it a bit smoother, but I don't think it's necessary at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by proon73
Alterjatively you get DMT coarse (325 grit) and do the same. This hone is spec'd to be extremely flat and I find it works much much better than sandpaper. But it's more expensive.
As far as slurry stone, as you like. Depending how soft the stone it, the honing can prodice slurry on its own. Or you can use a junk razor to raise some. But that's the cheap-o version. Using a slurry stone is much nicer.
check out http://www.theperfectedge.com/belgian.shtml they sell these stones and have info on them
"These stones have a base of slate for added strength. They are not combination stones. The slate backing will not sharpen steel"
"Natural Combination Stones
We occasionally receive a natural combination stone from the quarry that is yellow coticule on one side and blue on the other. They are fairly rare and come from the spot where the yellow vein of coticule intrudes into the blue stone. To my knowledge, they are the only known naturally occurring combination whetstone. The 8"x3" size is $250 and the 6"x2" size is $130. We occasionally receive an 8"x2" and that is priced at $160. Call to check on available stock. "
Please note that in the above posts people already mentioned that combo stones DO exist.
Check the slurry on the darker side. If it's sortof Puple-ish then it's a belgian blue. And it'll be a combo then.
Personally I think it is...but then who am I to put myself forward :shrug:
+1.Quote:
Originally Posted by LX_Emergency
Looks like it to me also.
John P.
it is definitely a blue. The slurry from the lapping was purplish. Everyone here said that would definitely decide it. Thanks everyone. I used the yellow side to hone my Henkel's. I then went to the chinese 12k afterward. For my first honing job, I don't think I did too bad. I am trying to set a bevel on another razor, can I do it on he norton 4k? Or should I buy a norton1K? Thanks again.
in principle you can do it on the yellow as LX shows in his video.
the question is how much time do you want to spend doing that. At the end of the day it's just removal of the unnecessary metal. my preference has been to use a progression of coarseness, since it saves time, but you remove a bit more metal this way.
Sorry for my ignorance, but who is LX? Thanks
LX_Emergency is a member here who has a honing video posted with google!
Go ahead and give the blue side a shot before the yellow.
John P.
