Arkansas vs Norton

Hello!

I'm quite new in this "profession" and very new at this forum. I have come to the point where i want to buy myself a hone and improve my razor. Here, in Sweden, i have read in a few old forums about honing-stones like the Arkansas blanck Bench stone made of novaculite and the Norton water stone 4000/8000.

I'm getting a bit confused when to decide wich one to buy. Up to now I have figured out this far (correct me if i'm wrong):

- Arkansas stone is an oil-stone and very hard. It needs to be lubricated with a small amount of oil and it takes more strokes to get that really sharp edge of the razor. It's considered to be like 8000 grit.

- Norton stone is a water-stone with the combination, where you can use a lower grit to repair an edge and the higher grit to polish it. It's not as hard as the Arkansas stone and you need to soak it in water when using it.

I have read and watched some forums and videos on the internet about honing, so i feel there is only one thing left for me before i start practicing. A hone, and i dont know what kind of stone to buy... :thinking:

As a beginner, noob, newbie, whatever in this matter, I get the feeling that the Norton stone is easier to use and better for the beginner. :hmmm:

Regards,

Rikard

Although I was able to find an Arkansas stone in my stash that works well, I would have to recommend the Norton. The problem with recommending an Arkansas is that there are so many variations out there and some of them may damage your blade. The Nortons are safe and pretty consistent.

The Norton is a synthetic hone.

The Belgian (yellow) coticule is a natural hone.

The coticule will do everything the Norton will do and has the advantage that it polishes the edge a little better than the Norton.

You need to purchase a rubbing stone with the coticule so that you can create a slurry.

The coticule with slurry is equivalent to the 4K side of a Norton combination stone the coticule with just water on the surface is equivalent to the 8K side of the Norton.

I think if we did a pole, the more experienced users on this forum would vote for the coticule.

This said, size for size, the Norton is cheaper, but size as they say isn't everything.

You can buy coticules direct from the source.

Ardennes Coticule - natural sharpening stones from Vielsalm Belgium. - Home

from what i can find the black arkansas is around a 6k stone, the transparent is between 8-10k. i only have a black arkansas and i don't use it as it is very slow and i am still learning so i may come back to it some day. the transparent arkansas stones (from what i have read, as i was looking to buy one at one point) are just as slow and quite pricey. my norton works great and for $80 i couldn't go wrong. i have had some really good results so far and i am still learning.

i would stray away fromt the arkansas stones as starters as mine was a little frustrating and like i said, very slow. not much fun to lap either.

my progression also includes a 12k chinese hone and a CrOx strop and i wouldn't go without them as i have tried right from the 8k and notice a big difference. there are lots who go straight from the 8k though.

my norton has been great and i have absolutely no regrets about getting it. you won't be disappointed if you get one. just remember you have to lap it before use, i used a piece of glass and some 600 grit wet/dry paper, it worked good.

In my opinion, the Norton 4K/8K is the most consistent hone for a new person to learn on. It is a fast cutter and there are several methods of honing that can be utilized with it. I used to use a Coticule after coming off the 8K at first with slurry and then without before going to any paste if needed although I mainly use my Escher or Nakayama for finishing these days. The Coticule is still a decent finishing hone. Starting from scratch on the Coticule, depending on the razor for me was a lot longer process and required many more strokes of varying numbers.

Good Luck,

Lynn

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lynn

In my opinion, the Norton 4K/8K is the most consistent hone for a new person to learn on. It is a fast cutter and there are several methods of honing that can be utilized with it. I used to use a Coticule after coming off the 8K at first with slurry and then without before going to any paste if needed although I mainly use my Escher or Nakayama for finishing these days. The Coticule is still a decent finishing hone. Starting from scratch on the Coticule, depending on the razor for me was a lot longer process and required many more strokes of varying numbers.

Good Luck,

Lynn

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+1
I completely agree based on my experiences with all these stones.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reaction

Hello!

I'm quite new in this "profession" and very new at this forum. I have come to the point where i want to buy myself a hone and improve my razor. Here, in Sweden, i have read in a few old forums about honing-stones like the Arkansas blanck Bench stone made of novaculite and the Norton water stone 4000/8000.

I'm getting a bit confused when to decide wich one to buy. Up to now I have figured out this far (correct me if i'm wrong):

- Arkansas stone is an oil-stone and very hard. It needs to be lubricated with a small amount of oil and it takes more strokes to get that really sharp edge of the razor. It's considered to be like 8000 grit.

- Norton stone is a water-stone with the combination, where you can use a lower grit to repair an edge and the higher grit to polish it. It's not as hard as the Arkansas stone and you need to soak it in water when using it.

I have read and watched some forums and videos on the internet about honing, so i feel there is only one thing left for me before i start practicing. A hone, and i dont know what kind of stone to buy... :thinking:

As a beginner, noob, newbie, whatever in this matter, I get the feeling that the Norton stone is easier to use and better for the beginner. :hmmm:

Regards,

Rikard

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The Norton is easier to use and better for razors period. I use A hard white Arkansas stone for keeping my soft carbon steel kitchen knives up to snuff but it is rated at only about 1200 grit. The Black or Translucent only get to about 5000 grit. The Arkansas stones are much slower cutters, and they just don't give you as nice an edge as the Norton does.

Check out the Norton Pyramid Honing Guide from the Wiki for the easiest set of instructions on how to get started.

Thanks very much all information :tu

From what i have read on my own before and your information i will get me a Norton 4000/8000 waterstone. I have only one razor yet :o, but will get anoter when ordering the hone. Better have a back-up when learning to hone. My first razor wasnt so expensive so i guess it's ok, it's a Dovo Solingen carbon steel blade with ebenholts handle. Bought it from GB for approx 50 £.

Still, i think i will continue my crusade against my beard. Shaving has become fun and im always looking forward to next time i will have a shave. Can't do it to often though, my skin gets a bit irritated. Maybe the razor isn't sharp enough.

Will probably have more questions in the matter of shaving etc...:D

Regards,

Rikard

Here i am again!

Have ordered a Norton 4000/8000 stone now and expect it to be delivered in a few days. At the same time i ordered a back-up razor. Can never tell if im gonna make a success or failure :fim:

So my next question is if i have to prepare the stone in any way? I guess i shouldnt start without doing something with the surfaces of the stone.

There is probably somewhere on the forums i can read about it, but there is so many posts done with different threads, so i really cba searching, sorry :bow

Regards,

Rikard

i used a piece of glass with 600 grit wet/dry sand paper to lap mine as i asked the same question you did. the easiest way to know when you have it is to draw a grid in pencil on it and lap it until the whole grid is gone. the first time it may take a bit to get that grid off but after that it is quicker.

So, the surface is to coarse on the stone to start use it on my razor then, hmm...

With a 600 grit paper (wet or dry), i get a decent surface to start honing. I guess it that is done for both 4000 and 8000 grit sides? Is a lead pencil ok to make the grid on the stone? I guess the lead is the softest and shows the surface best while preparing it.

I was thinking of putting the sandpaper on a plane surface and then, with light pressure, rub the stone circular until the grid is gone. Should i continue with a fine sandpaper after that or is it enough?

When you used a piece of glass, what kind of glass did you have? I'm a bit worried i will get "hills and valleys" on the stone when i start preparing it.

Regards,

Rikard

it is really just about using a flat surface. for me glass was the flatest i could find and easiest to use. some use tiles (slate or something) from the hardware store. you can also start a lower grit and work you way up. i guess i should have said that since this will be the first time the stone is being lapped. the first time i lapped mine i went 320 to 600 to 1500 which was OK but i think the 1500 left some grit embedded so i went back to the 600 and left it at that. these weren't exactly high end paper brands though. since then i have used 1000 grit norton paper and it worked good. between 600 and 1000 is fine as far as i have read and used.

any pencil is fine as you will be sanding it off anyways, pens tend to soak ink into the stone apparently, i didn't try it.

what do you mean by plane surface? just out of curiousity. again it just needs to be as flat as possible, the glass i use was a piece of tempered shelf glass i had sitting around.

good luck. i'm sure it will work fine. :D

Hi again!

Thanks for your informative post :tu

With plane i dont mean Aeroplane :D, its just my bad "englsh". Sometimes i have hard time finding the right word. I guess 100% flat is the correct word to use....:gaah:

Hope i haven't messed you up :w

Soon my stone will arrive from GB and by then i will be prepared.

Regards,

Rikard

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reaction

=With plane i dont mean Aeroplane :D, its just my bad "englsh". Sometimes i have hard time finding the right word. I guess 100% flat is the correct word to use....:gaah:

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no i thought you meant the platform on a wood planer. ha! i was way off. but hey as long as its flat right.

so now you are playing the waiting game eh? well there is lots to read on here in the mean time. good luck!