Are these inclusions?

First off let me say that this is not a complaint towards the person I got this from. I know the members here are very stern about wanting people to contact the sellers first, which I have. My question is purely about what I'm seeing, and will it effect the stones ability to hone.

Let me say also that the stone is a coticule and it did not come like this, the spots started to show after I lapped it a couple time. And now, here are the pictures.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...Picture023.jpghttp://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...Picture019.jpg

If they are going to have a negative effect on the edge of the razor I think you will feel it when you hone. If the substance is harder then the coticule around it you might have a problem otherwise I don't think so.

Whatever it is may be lapped away as the stone is flattened in subsequent lapping. :shrug: Since it is a natural stone, sedimentary rock, no one can predict what you will run into when the stone is lapped.

Dont have anything like that on either of my yellows, but as jimmy said, try using it, if there is a negative effect you may have to relap. I would contact the seller and ask them about it, show the same pics in an email if possible, that way they know about it and can give you any appropriate advice.

I'd have to see closer pictures, but I think you're going to be fine. I have cotties with swirls, some small inclusions, etc and they're no problem.

If you purchased it new from a vendor, if it bothers you I'd return it. If you purchased it "used" and as you said the inclusions were not visible to you or the seller on the surface of the stone when you bought it, then I think you should keep it as is and use it. How can a seller predict whether a natural stone has inclusions that are not visible on the surface of the stone?

Chris L

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Originally Posted by Chris L

How can a seller predict whether a natural stone has inclusions that are not visible on the surface of the stone?

Chris L

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I thought it was required for sellers here to have x-ray vision. :gaah:

I agree completely Chris, that's why I wanted to stress I was just curious about their effect on the edge. I'll give it a good lap this weekend and see how it looks. Either way I'll just keep using it until I notice something.

It seems the general consensus is that it shouldn't be an issue which does make me rest easier.

For what it's worth the coticule as a whole is hard as all get out, zero slurry when I hone unless I use a stone on it first. It's like glass.

With any coticule I've owned that had inclusions, I've found the inclusion material to be very soft. One one example, I viewed an inclusion under my stereo microscope and poked at it with a pin. The material within the inclusion (inclusions looked just like the ones on your stone) was extremely soft and yielded to the point of the pin which pressed into the inclusion with almost no pressure. The cottie worked just fine.

IME these cottie inclusions are not a harder imbedded grit like some natural and synthetic stones can have. It gives the stones character.

Chris L

Great, I like character in my hones. On the down side, now I can't wait to get home and start honing.

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Originally Posted by Chris L

With any coticule I've owned that had inclusions, I've found the inclusion material to be very soft. One one example, I viewed an inclusion under my stereo microscope and poked at it with a pin. The material within the inclusion (inclusions looked just like the ones on your stone) was extremely soft and yielded to the point of the pin which pressed into the inclusion with almost no pressure. The cottie worked just fine.

IME these cottie inclusions are not a harder imbedded grit like some natural and synthetic stones can have. It gives the stones character.

Chris L

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I have to agree with Chris L. In fact I was fortunate enough to get my finest coticule from him. And it has CHARACTER.:D And hones like a dream....:tuhttp://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b3...79125690_o.jpg

Those tiger stripe coticules are rare and beautiful. :tu Here is one that had some inclusions but is bad to the bone for honing.

I assume you mean "bad" in a good way. If that's the case I feel a ton better, my inclusions are nothing compared to that.

And I have seen pics of that tiger stripe, simply amazing.

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Originally Posted by JCitron

I assume you mean "bad" in a good way. If that's the case I feel a ton better, my inclusions are nothing compared to that.

And I have seen pics of that tiger stripe, simply amazing.

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Yes "bad" = great in this instance. Good luck with yours. It will probably be just fine.

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Originally Posted by Lt.Arclight

I have to agree with Chris L. In fact I was fortunate enough to get my finest coticule from him. And it has CHARACTER.:D And hones like a dream....:tuhttp://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b3...79125690_o.jpg

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I'm glad you like it, Lt. You're right, that's a great stone because it's not only nice to look at, it's a smoooooooth one. What you guys can't see is that other than the darker stripes there are two wider bands that are almost the color of the stone. I can see them because I owned the stone prior to Lt., but they're on the surface. One is right by the two water drops that are sticking to side of the cottie layer. I bring it up, because they're bands of inclusion and have no ill effect on honing with that stone whatsoever as I'm sure Lt. will agree.

All in all, you have nothing to worry about with virtually all cottie inclusions.

BTW guys, contact Rob at Ardennes Coticule and ask for tiger striped coticules (suitable for honing razors) and if he doesn't have any in stock, I'm sure he'd notify those that are interested in them. I don't think they come around that often, but if they do, he knows where to find them.;)

Howard Schechter at theperfectedge.com had a few somewhat recently, so he'd be a guy to contact as well.

Chris L