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I am thinking of taking the plunge on a couple of shaptons: the 4000 & 8000. How often do these need to be lapped? Do I need to get a Shapton Lapping plate? If I must get the plate I am not going to get the shaptons at all because of cost. If there is an alternative to the plate please let me know.
Thanks
There's talk that the polymer/s used for the Shapton ceramic on glass stones to bind the ceramic abrasives change faster than Uranium 238 can throw off alpha particles (Ok, Ok, a little sarcasm) so the manufacturer recommends a brief lapping before each honing session.
I agree I suppose, that mine cut a bit better when lapped prior to honing. After the initial lapping, a refresher lapping only takes a few passes on a lapping plate unless it's really coated with swarf.
You do NOT absolutely need a GDLP to lap the Shaptons; Repeat, you do NOT need a GDLP to lap the Shapton ceramic on glass stones!
You can use the DMT D8C (I prefer to follow it with the DMT D8E for a smoother finish, but you don't need to do that either). I've owned and used both the GDLP and the DMT plates.
Chris L
I also considered the Shapton stones; it seemed straight-forward: 4k, 8k, 16k, strop, done. But when I saw that you're supposed to hone them with that Shapton plate and that that costs 280, I understood why everybody else is using DMTs, BBWs and a coticule, so I went the DMT (coarse, fine and extra-extra fine) and coticle route. Seems to give you more honing material for the money. And I dislike having to buy products just to make products I buy work.
As Chris already stated you DO NOT need the GDLP from Shapton,
in fact the two most expensive parts of the Shapton system the GDLP and the 30k are not a must have....:nono:
Now break down the cost of the 1k, 4k, 8k, and 16k, the complete Shapton set for every type of honing that you might ever do, add in a DMT and you tell me if they are cost effective....:hmmm:
Also bear in mind the the Busiest Honemiester out there, Lynn is using them, and hasn't worn a set out yet, that tells me they will probably last quite awhile for the normal guy....:w
I have been thinking about trying the shaptons as well, lots of great reviews on them around here. Along the lines of lapping, is the norton lapping stone an absolute no-no as I already have one of those? I have a norton 4/8K and a chinese 12K so I am going to start with the shapton 16K. If the norton lapping stone is a no-no, I guess I will pick up a DMT as I too am not ready to fork out the bread for the GDLP.
Thanks,
URGLE.......<cough>......<gag>...... Chris, damnitall...... Now I gotta clean my monitor AND keyboard..... sheesh! :rofl2:Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris L
Kaptain "Coffee and electronic devices don't mix all that well!" Zero
The Norton lapping stone will "work" I used mine a few times before I finally choked down the price of the GDLP, but it leaves way too rough a finish on the 16k, whatever the DMT is that is 1200 grit, would be my choice, but maybe Chris can tell you better, he has done way more experimenting with the Shaptons then most of us...Quote:
Originally Posted by davisbonanza
I've never used the Norton lapping plate so I refrained from even speculating on whether or not it would work on the Shaptons. I wanted to say that I would assume the surface it would leave would be too coarse, but Glen came to the rescue on that.
Really a broken in D8C leaves a perfectly usable lapped surface on the Shapton ceramics. If one owns a D8E, you can fight the stiction and get a silky smooth surface using the D8E. Keep in mind, the finer grit Shaptons are very hard. Maybe it's going overboard, but I'd recommend a pencil grid after the D8C prior to finish lapping with the D8E. Even a variation of somewhere in the range of a thousandth of an inch between the D8C and D8E surfaces (assuming both surfaces are not the EXACT same flatness) means it could still take you longer than you'd think to lap that second set of grid lines off with the D8E. Just some thoughts.
Chris L
Frequently Asked Questions : ShaptonŽ Stones, ShaptonŽ Sharpening Systems
Their FAQ notes that their lapping plate is approximately 4k grit and while the old metal sandpaper on glass method can work the paper tends to clog very quickly.
IIRC the GDLP lists a grit range on the plate. Much coarser. Current GDLP owners? 250-325 grit if memory serves?
Chris L
From the FAQ at the Shapton site:
Q: Can Shapton stones be flatened with sandpaper on glass the way regular waterstones can?
A: The short answer is yes, they can be flattened with that method. There are some issues though. #400 grit seems to be the limit of the paper before it begins to clog. The engineers at Shapton want a smooth reflective surface on the stones from the #5000 up to the #30000. The fine grit powder that Shapton manufactures for the lapping plate is about #4000 grit. The best performance from the stone is realized when it is very flat and smooth. It will stay flat much longer this way because the cutting particles are supported by neighboring particles. If the surface is rough, the particles at the top of the ridges will come away very easily.
Doesn't this passage refer to the old lapping plate and not the GDLP?
edit:
According to this post, it's 325 grit
You're right Chris. They are 270/325 grit (54/45 micron).Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris L
I used SteveS Norton Lapping Plate when we had our Northern California SRP Meeting. It worked great. I was surprised at how off my two new Norton's were. The only trouble is it left both feeling very rough. I went back over the 8k with the 4k. Maybe not advisable, but it felt better to me after that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris L