Is my Yellow really a Yellow?

Gents,

I just received my first coticule today from xxxxxx. It's supposed to be a combination blue/yellow. I know that coticules very immensely in colors, but my "Yellow" sure looks blue to me. Check out the pictures... the small slurry stone is definitely a yellow. It really makes my big "yellow" look like a BBW. What do you guys think? Is it a BBW or Yellow?

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t...f/IMG_1474.jpg

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t...f/IMG_1475.jpg

Edit: removed vendor name, because I want to avod the "take it up in private" thing, and get you guy's opinion on this *before* I take it up with the vendor.

It is hard to say from the photo, but one thing I have noticed is that the BBW kind of "shimmers" whereas the coticule is more matt. It looks from your pic to be matt. :shrug:

The BBW also produces a purple-ish slurry. Maybe you should try to make a slurry and see what happens?

Also, if it is a natural combo I think you would have to expect some blending of the two rock types where the seams meet. Maybe you got one where the yellow is thinnish and the blue comes through? All that matters though is how it works. Try it on some razors and see how it goes.

James.

You're gonna get the whole "You should've taken this up in private" thing on this one!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ben.mid

You're gonna get the whole "You should've taken this up in private" thing on this one!

---

Vendor name removed. I would love to have you guy's input on this before I take it up with the vendor.

I think you will find out when you test it.Try it in almost shave ready blade and check the edge after 10-20 passes.Check the edge if it is brakes then not good coticule ,not brakes smooths edge then good one.Of course you will need to have small handy microscop.Color doesn't mean a lot .Good luck

Actually, is the top photo a side-on shot? Because I think I can see the blue and yellow transition in that shot.

But yeah, test it. Photos do not tell much of a story with any hone. How it works is the only test.

James.

It's a natural Coticule. Sometimes the transition between the Blue and the Yellow is a hard edge, sometimes it's a slow transgression. You might want to think that's not good, but for finishing you could be very pleasantly surprised. Usually Coticules that have a greenish shade, are slow slurry-cutters. But they have a good reputation for finishing.
You should definitely test is. Try finishing with water only. If you want to test it for slurry-cutting, raise the slurry with a DMT, instead of a slurry stone. That way you're only testing the slurry of the hone, and not the slurry of your slurry stone.
Should you find it on the slow side, use a "fast" slurry stone, and test again. On slower Coticules, the slurry stone can really make a difference.

If I had to pick one on merely seeing it, I would prefer this one over one that has the color of your slurry stone.
By the way, how does it smell (when you raise a slurry on it)?

Hope this works out for you,
Bart.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimbo

Actually, is the top photo a side-on shot? Because I think I can see the blue and yellow transition in that shot.

But yeah, test it. Photos do not tell much of a story with any hone. How it works is the only test.

James.

---

It is, but it looks like it transitions from dark BBW to light BBW.... being a total coticule newb, I don't know. The slurry the dark side produces is very purple. The slurry the "yellow" side produces is quite a bit lighter, but not nearly as light as the slurry the small yellow stone makes. I made the slurries with a DMT, btw.

This must be a natural combination stone, as the blue side includes all the way to the surface of the yellow. Also, the graduation from blue to "yellow" is very gradual, with strong demarcations in only a couple of places.

Is a DarkBBW/LightBBW natural combo stone a possibility?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart

It's a natural Coticule.

---

I guess that answers your question, then.

That said, the fact that there is a darker part on the other side really should have given it away?

I agree the color looks more grey than yellow, that's for sure.

you are getting confused yourself.Don't pay attention to colors.100% this stone is natural combo stone .Possible you have get better stone then usual people gets.No one knows untill you will test it .check this picture. i think you are expecting similar this stone? but you need to know how your stone acts that is all matter .if it is acts similar 4k then forget about if it acts same as 10k or more then you must be very happy.This is why you need to test it.use blade and sharpen it.then check it undo microscope see what happens to your edge?

Both natural combo
small one is light color then big one and small is a lot better sharpener.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart

It's a natural Coticule. Sometimes the transition between the Blue and the Yellow is a hard edge, sometimes it's a slow transgression. You might want to think that's not good, but for finishing you could be very pleasantly surprised. Usually Coticules that have a greenish shade, are slow slurry-cutters. But they have a good reputation for finishing.
You should definitely test is. Try finishing with water only. If you want to test it for slurry-cutting, raise the slurry with a DMT, instead of a slurry stone. That way you're only testing the slurry of the hone, and not the slurry of your slurry stone.
Should you find it on the slow side, use a "fast" slurry stone, and test again. On slower Coticules, the slurry stone can really make a difference.

If I had to pick one on merely seeing it, I would prefer this one over one that has the color of your slurry stone.
By the way, how does it smell (when you raise a slurry on it)?

Hope this works out for you,
Bart.

---

Bart, your ability to mind read is phenomenal. :) I was going to remark about the very "earthy" smell of the coticule in a write-up I was going to do later after honing a few blades with it. I loooooove the smell of the coticule! You've hiked the Ardennes region... does the air smell like this??

And you have the color nailed. It seems quite green in color. I'm glad to hear it has a good reputation for finishing, since that's really what I want it for. I want to pit it against the finishing ability of the shapton 16k. Although I must say that I also do plan on using the coticule *after* the Shapton 16k and 30k to see if I can retain the sharpness of the shaptons, but "refine" the edge (more comfort) with the coticule. So many things to test... so little time. :)

Thanks for the help, gents, I knew you guys would have this figured out for me in no time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

you are getting confused yourself.Don't pay attention to colors.100% this stone is natural combo stone .Possible you have get better stone then usual people gets.No one knows untill you will test it .check this picture. i think you are expecting similar this stone? but you need to know how your stone acts that is all matter .if it is acts similar 4k then forget about if it acts same as 10k or more then you must be very happy.This is why you need to test it.use blade and sharpen it.then check it undo microscope see what happens to your edge?

Both natural combo
small one is light color then big one and small is a lot better sharpener.

---

That was exactly what I was expecting, Bud, you nailed it. Thank you!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cornelius

I guess that answers your question, then.

That said, the fact that there is a darker part on the other side really should have given it away?

I agree the color looks more grey than yellow, that's for sure.

---

I don't know... is it possible to have a darkBBW/lightBBW natural combination? If the answer to that question is "no", then you're right: the fact that there is a transition in colors *would* give it away.

Pizza, you should have bought one from me...:shrug:

Did you check with Rob?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zib

Pizza, you should have bought one from me...:shrug:

Did you check with Rob?

---

After checking all over the internet, I found that Rob had a non-combo in stock for alot more money than I paid for the stone in this thread. *Alot* more, and I really wanted a combo stone. I haven't seen yours available for sale yet.... did you get them in?

You have a yellow/BBW natural combo stone. Test the coticule side and hone with it. I don't think you'll have any problems there and you'll be happy with what you've received.

I have an 8"x3" combo natural. In no way is the coticule side "yellow". It's an olive green. The transition line is virtually indentical to yours in that it's a graduation rather than a demarked separation. The coticule side of the stone I speak of is hard and produces no slurry on its own and therefore is a good (albeit a bit slower than some of my medium soft coticules) polishing stone. Ok, a great polishing stone.

Like someone else said, don't focus on color. Performance is why you buy a stone like that anyway.

Interesting side note regarding my stone: The BBW side is a bit lighter than any other BBW I have. The BBW side on that stone cuts less aggressively than a typical BBW.

Chris L

http://straightrazorpalace.com/attac...ment-a_b_c.jpg

These are all three Coticules. Actually the very first three that I ran comparative tests on, by honing up 2 groups of 4 Double Arrows (all razors from the same batch). The middle one comes form Ardennes Coticule, the top and bottom are picked up at abandoned mining sites. For finishing, there is very little difference. On the first test we finished a DMT-E / Belgian Blue progression with 100 laps on one of those three. The fourth razor, we left unfinished, for the sake of bare comparison. NO differences showed up in the shaves, that were performed blind (not blind-folded;)). We were only able to identify the unfinished razor. Later on, during another test, the bottom one was found to produce a slightly keener result when a sencondary microbevel whas created, by adding three layers of tape and honing a few laps on either one of those. That hone has a glassy surface.

Based upon how your pictures show up on my screen, I'd say that you're more without a real blue, than without a Coticule.

Bart.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris L

You have a yellow/BBW natural combo stone. Test the coticule side and hone with it. I don't think you'll have any problems there and you'll be happy with what you've received.

I have an 8"x3" combo natural. In no way is the coticule side "yellow". It's an olive green. The transition line is virtually indentical to yours in that it's a graduation rather than a demarked separation. The coticule side of the stone I speak of is hard and produces no slurry on its own and therefore is a good (albeit a bit slower than some of my medium soft coticules) polishing stone. Ok, a great polishing stone.

Like someone else said, don't focus on color. Performance is why you buy a stone like that anyway.

Interesting side note regarding my stone: The BBW side is a bit lighter than any other BBW I have. The BBW side on that stone cuts less aggressively than a typical BBW.

Chris L

---

That's exactly the way I'd describe the color of mine. Thanks, Chris!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart

http://straightrazorpalace.com/attac...ment-a_b_c.jpg

These are all three Coticules. Actually the very first three that I ran comparative tests on, by honing up 2 groups of 4 Double Arrows (all razors from the same batch). The middle one comes form Ardennes Coticule, the top and bottom are picked up at abandoned mining sites. For finishing, there is very little difference. On the first test we finished a DMT-E / Belgian Blue progression with 100 laps on one of those three. The fourth razor, we left unfinished, for the sake of bare comparison. NO differences showed up in the shaves, that were performed blind (not blind-folded;)). We were only able to identify the unfinished razor. Later on, during another test, the bottom one was found to produce a slightly keener result when a sencondary microbevel whas created, by adding three layers of tape and honing a few laps on either one of those. That hone has a glassy surface.

Based upon how your pictures show up on my screen, I'd say that you're more without a real blue, than without a Coticule.

Bart.

---

Glad to hear that... while I do want to have both a BBW and coticule, I'm much more interested in the coticule than the Belgian Blue.

My latest e-blade is going to go: Shapton 1k, BBW, Coticule tonight.

Hey Pizza, No, not yet, I'm just messin with ya....and still waiting on Rob. He can take up to 4 weeks to fill an order.

Do you know about the Coticule scratch test? You can test them with a finger nail scratch. With a very soft stone you can almost peel off the Coticule. With a hard stone +- nothing happens. A medium stone, is well, in between the two. This is the explanation I got from Rob.
Maybe he'll join in and give us some more info...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zib

Hey Pizza, No, not yet, I'm just messin with ya....and still waiting on Rob. He can take up to 4 weeks to fill an order.

Do you know about the Coticule scratch test? You can test them with a finger nail scratch. With a very soft stone you can almost peel off the Coticule. With a hard stone +- nothing happens. A medium stone, is well, in between the two. This is the explanation I got from Rob.
Maybe he'll join in and give us some more info...

---

Very cool.. I had no idea.. I'm gonna go see right now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bart

Usually Coticules that have a greenish shade, are slow slurry-cutters. But they have a good reputation for finishing.

---

Bingo.

You've got what I've always called a "green coticule."

They do look quite different from the traditional yellows.

I had one that I bought from Howard. I sold it because I got a Y/G escher that became my preferred finisher. I sort of regret it....

Keep it. They're super finishers. They are not cousins of the blue. They're their own thing. Send a thank-you letter to xxxxxx.

I have a solid yellow-type coticule and it finishes well.

I also have a greenish-veined coticule combo stone from Ardennes. It is a SUPER finisher. Really, really fine stone. I am a greenie convert myself.

Pay no attention to the colors, except to enjoy 'em. The blade finish is what matters. Right? ;)

I am gonna post some pics of them side by side it as soon as I get my computer hiccups figured out.

Now I want a green coticule, too! :gth

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sparq

Now I want a green coticule, too! :gth

---

Exactly! Sometimes I hate this site! :gaah: :rofl2::rofl2:


Jordan

And a new term has been hereby adopted: "Green Coticule". I agree with everything everyone has said in this post about them: hard, no slurry and great finishing stones.

Chris L

FloorPizza, that's a natural Coticule/BBW combination stone 100% sure.

I got plenty of these over here so don't worry :tu

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ArdennesCoticule

FloorPizza, that's a natural Coticule/BBW combination stone 100% sure.

I got plenty of these over here so don't worry :tu

---

Plenty?? Why did I suddenly have the urge to snatch them all up so nobody else could have them?? :rofl2:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ArdennesCoticule

FloorPizza, that's a natural Coticule/BBW combination stone 100% sure.

I got plenty of these over here so don't worry :tu

---

Hmmm. sounds very interesting........ Any for up for sale?

Here's a comparison shot of my two coticules. The bottom one is from Ardennes, and it's awesome.

Attachment 20305

I had to manipulate the colors a bit, so the white balance is a touch off since I took it with a crappy camera under bad light. I don't know my way around Gimp yet...:shrug:

If the sun comes out today, I will try and get some good shots under natural light.