Critique My Honing Method!

Hi SRPeople.

As some of you know from talking to me endlessly about it on the SRP chatroom (#srp on freenode.net) I have received my new hones and I'm learning how to hone.

I'm thoroughly enjoying the learning process and wanted some feedback incase I'm developing some bad habits as is so easy when doing something like this.

Part 1: YouTube - Critique My Honing - Part 1
Part 2: YouTube - Critique My Honing - Part 2

The video is a little long, but was necessary. Thanks for your patience!

Feel free to give advice on this forum instead of commenting on the video, either way will be gateful, but maybe more helpful to the forum if you post here. :tu

Thanks in advance!

don't know if your technique is perfect, but you're most certainly the best dressed honers out there :P
If the bevel is properly set, a few pyramids followed by a finishing stone should bring it right up to where it was before.

From what I've heard, the 12k is extremely slow and requires lots of passes like close to 100 passes.

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Originally Posted by Dups

From what I've heard, the 12k is extremely slow and requires lots of passes like close to 100 passes.

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I am going to follow this video up with me honing in a mustard stained wife beater

Thanks for sharing that video. I think many people will benefit from it. I sometimes have similar problems. Have you tried placing the hone parallel to your body (E-W instead of N-S)? It might be easier to control the razor (keeping it level). I know people do it both ways though, so if it works for you, stick with it.

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Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

I am going to follow this video up with me honing in a mustard stained wife beater

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:rofl2:

I dress well in shaving videos to make a point that not all shaving related videos need to be homoerotica with nudie boys :D

"Not going to get l**d on the channel."
:roflmao

I liked your running commentary, as it made the time go faster. Your x-stroke looks fine to me. It's clear that you are using a light stroke. Your comments indicate that you have learned a lot. As far as how to get the razor sharper, you already mentioned the bevel. It's possible that you're not quite there yet. Either try the aggressive pyramid or just do maybe 30 strokes on the 4k alone followed by another conservative pyramid.

I am completely dependent upon my stereomicroscope for edge assessment. It's a crutch I know, but it allows me to know exactly how my honing is going and it ensures that I don't waste time going up to higher grits until I have that bevel fully set.

Personally, I'm not a fan of the towel. I know that's how Lynn does it in his video but the towel is drawing water out of the hone and it has lint on it. Also, and really the only criticism I can think of, you are not clearing the 4k residue off of your blade before going back to the 8k. I don't recall if Lynn does that in his video or not, but I dip my razor into a plastic tumbler filled with water to rinse the 4k residue off before going to the 8k. I rarely do pyramids, but when I do, I only rinse when going from a more coarse to a finer grit and not in the other direction. That is, rinse after the 4k but not after the 8k when doing the pyramids.

Then again, it might be the cufflinks that are throwing off your balance!

I think you are off to great start as your video clearly shows how much you have learned. The sharp razors will come soon enough!

A few things I've noticed.

Granted, Iam not an expert honer or am I claiming to be ...

Of course, I mean no offense to anyone.

That being said ... here goes ...

Your form looks ok. I'll give you a solid 8.5, mainly due to the tie.:rofl2:

I think it's the grit progression you are using.

I've found that some blades really benefit from the pyramid method and some dont.

I do use the pyramid, sure... mainly for the necessary touchup after a few months of use.

IMHE, I've gotten the most sucess from the pyramid in this manner.

Try more laps on the 4k. You should be able to pass the hand 'shave' test off of the 4k before moving through the grits. The higher grits polish. while the 4k sharpens.


Great video, btw.

I thought your tecnique looked very good. Have you watched the heavy duty honing video it is realy good he holds his honein his hand i do exactly that and i find it much easier. I found my heals just did'nt get sharp i use slight roll most of the time. I would just stay on the 4k untill hole egde feel sahrp alter your stroke to rolling method if need be use black marker test once tpt is fairly god go 8k and then 100 ch12k strop and you wil get a good shave

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I dress well in shaving videos to make a point that not all shaving related videos need to be homoerotica with nudie boys

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Sorry, had to look that word up and after reading the definition, I couldn't bring myself to watch your video.

On a 3" wide hone, you need to keep the full blades edge on the hone for the full stroke.

You are letting the heel of the blade only receive part of the honing. The toe is being honed more.
Eventually, you will find the blade has a narrower width at the toe than the heel.

The X pattern stroke you are using only works on hones that are about 1.5 to 2" wide.

Secondly, I suggest you invest in a 10X jewellers loupe or some form of magnifying glass so that you can see if there is a clearly formed V on the edge.

The rest of what you are doing looks fine to me.

Hope this helps and good for you for having the guts to share.

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Originally Posted by English

On a 3" wide hone, you need to keep the full blades edge on the hone for the full stroke.

You are letting the heel of the blade only receive part of the honing. The toe is being honed more.
Eventually, you will find the blade has a narrower width at the toe than the heel.

The X pattern stroke you are using only works on hones that are about 1.5 to 2" wide.

Secondly, I suggest you invest in a 10X jewellers loupe or some form of magnifying glass so that you can see if there is a clearly formed V on the edge.

The rest of what you are doing looks fine to me.

Hope this helps and good for you for having the guts to share.

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Wait...I thought we had this argument before and X-Stroke was good on 3" hones too.....

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Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

Wait...I thought we had this argument before and X-Stroke was good on 3" hones too.....

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There has been an agreement of disagreement and it should probably be left at that!

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Originally Posted by kelbro

Sorry, had to look that word up and after reading the definition, I couldn't bring myself to watch your video.

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Wait, does that mean you are unwilling to watch a video WITHOUT such undertones?:w

Thats very light handed IMO
I'd always take the second hand to guide the knife better but without pressure
and use the beautiful wide stone for straight strokes like English said.

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Originally Posted by English

On a 3" wide hone, you need to keep the full blades edge on the hone for the full stroke.

You are letting the heel of the blade only receive part of the honing. The toe is being honed more.
Eventually, you will find the blade has a narrower width at the toe than the heel.

The X pattern stroke you are using only works on hones that are about 1.5 to 2" wide.

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Lynn and many other honemeisters would disagree.

Let's try and keep this on topic and help out a new honer here guys.....

He is using an X stroke, so help him from there....

IMHO he is also doing a very nice even light stroke...
Following all the prescribed rules for the stone, it seems that the razor just needs a little more 4k work I however can't feel the blade...
When the edge is popping arm hair from toe to heel at the 4k level or at the conservative Pyramid level then you are ready for 20 light laps 8k and on to the 12k if you wish....

Jigme: You might read through this thread about the same stone...

http://straightrazorpalace.com/basic...tml#post355832

i did watch first part of the video.
I think you are using pyramid method that is why you are moving from 4 to 8k and so on.
I am not sure what Lynn said exactly about pyramid honing but this is what i think
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1 st you have to set bevel. what i mean you need to work on 4k side until you get a good bevel
then you go 8 k side.
i think now you can do what you were doing.
Below is how i do hone

i work on 4 k side until i get bevel set then i move to 8 k .(I FIND OUT NEW NORTON 8 K IS PRONE TO OVERHONE AFTER 25 STROKES I KNOW WHY LAST 3 RAZOR I HAVE HONE I HAD OVERHONE PROBLEMS.)
Your strokes are excellent .
Some one already mention have loop at least 60 x and check the edge.it will help you on learning process.
good luck

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Originally Posted by Utopian

I am completely dependent upon my stereomicroscope for edge assessment. It's a crutch I know, but it allows me to know exactly how my honing is going and it ensures that I don't waste time going up to higher grits until I have that bevel fully set.

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+1 on the microscope. It is an important part of my honing arsenal.

Nice presentation Jigme . Not criticism but comparison, For one thing I find it easier to hone standing up. I also hone across my body from right to left rather then with my arm going away from my body and back again.

I found that letting my arm hang naturally from the shoulder my counter top is about level with the bend in my elbow. Less fatiguing. You mentioned going off of the edge of the hone at the end of the stroke going away from you. I wonder if honing side to side rather than back and forth would give you more control ? It does for me.

Watching your video reminded me of why I sold my combo and bought single grit Nortons. Much more efficient to do the pyramids. More $ but a lot more stone. I use a spray bottle rather then a cup. I am more liberal with the water than you are. I keep the stone wet with plenty of liquid at all times. That 4k drinks it up and a spray bottle is more efficient IME.

I also do the x pattern on 3" stones and so far so good. Like Utopian I wash the coarser grit off before going to the higher grit whether on a pyramid or progressive honing. I am honing in front of my kitchen sink so access to water is easy. I rinse he hone off every do often to clear residual swarf. Good luck with your honing.

Thanks for dressing up for the vid.

Your honing style looks good but you are starting the pyramids too soon, if that is the way you want to hone. Before you go to the pyramids you need to have a bevel that is cutting hairs on your arm clean and smooth before moving to a finer hone.

On your 4k hone (a 1 k would be faster) hold one side of the blade flat on the hone(if the blade is not warped - see marker test) and move the blade in circles for a period of time, like 60 seconds. Use a bit of pressure. Flip the blade over and repeat on the other side. Keep the hone flooded with water and keep the metal removed from collecting on the surface of the hone. Rub it off with your finger or lap it if it is stuck into the surface. Do around 10 strokes edge leading ( normal honing) then do a thumb nail test. Use very light pressure for this part. The edge should cut into the nail smoothly and evenly along the length of the edge. If not go back to the circles and apply a little more pressure on the area that feels smooth on you nail. Once you get the edge to 'bit' into your nail smooth and clean for the entire length go back and perform a few more circles, like 30 seconds per side to repair possible damage from TNT. 10 normal edge leading strokes and check sharpness by testing on arm hairs. If it needs more work do 15 seconds of circles then 10 strokes normal until hairs cut clean and smooth. The circles at this stage prevent a wire edge from forming. Once hairs cut clean and smooth you can go to your pyramid process to start polishing and refining the edge. Be sure arm hairs cut clean and smooth after the pyramid before going to the 12k. After cutting hairs at the end of your bevel setting stage you are just refining the edge to cut smoother. Good luck!

p.s. hope you dress more comfortably when honing off camera.

great videos!
loved the shirt and tie, we should all strive to be as classy as you, sir

wish I was experienced enough to help you out, but I'm still learning honing too

Hey look. I'm overwhelmed by the response I got from this. A million thanks to all who took the time to help me out here. :bow

At about 2:45am last night (well, this morning) I was on #srp and Slart-Work (aka, SRP furniture) gave me some similar advice about sticking on the 4k longer to set the bevel and I gave this a shot.

By 3:15, the razor was really getting somewhere and I think that's the best method. I tried some circles as well and had good results.

I've got a whiteboard marker I was using to check the bevel and there was a 1cm long section on the push stroke side which was not getting a bevel and I suspect had a burr from shonky x-pattern technique earlier.

I'm going to try, now that I've had 8 hours sleep, to work on the bevel today and lightly lap the 8k side, get it smooth as pants, then do 100 passes on the 12k, strop it and test shave.

Will post results..
Thanks again for all your help.


:OT
(Nearly off topic, but the stroke method IS important so I'm paying attention to the advice) Keeping the nearly political x-pattern vs straight stroke method on a 3 inch hone ethos out of the body of the post, from what I've read from experienced HMs is that the x-pattern, while it seems you're paying more attention to the toe, is the best way to maintain a consistant pressure along the blade.

I've tried both methods and I think the x-pattern seems to be getting the best results so far, but I'm keeping my mind open for both methods. YMMV and MMMV. Seems there's a thousand ways to shave a cat... :hmmm:

My heart is bleeding and broken:cry::cry:














;):roflmao:roflmao:roflmao Thanks for the laugh!

Great thread and style! ;) I've just started straight shaving (and with this I don't mean I have any history of shaving in a homoerotic sense. :D Good thing I can always blame being a non-native English speaker :D) and have the limited luxury of only owning two Double Arrows, a $2 combo stone from the hardware store, a Chinese 12K, besides the strop and soaps of course. It's quite helpful in picking kit and looking at some techniques.

Mate , you crack me up. Thanx for the entertaining vids. i can't offer any advice on pyramids even tho I was born in Egypt. :D
I think you're a fast learner:tu

Jigme, having seen your vids again, I notice I cringed when I saw you dry the blade. I got the strong impression you, although in a "spine-first" motion, wipe the whole blade, lightly but still, including the edge. Perhaps that's an issue?

In a few of your strokes I also had the idea that you pulled the razor spine-first off the hone, making that the edge might bend since it's still touching the hone. I might be wrong there, but the youtube stuff isn't always as clear. :)

Hiya,
I'll keep an eye out for rolling the edge at the edge of the stroke!

I'm going to try my other Dovo now to see how I go. I'm fairly confident I'm not touching the actual blade edge when I dry the razor though. It gets close, but it doesn't touch the edge.

I think I'm not setting the bevel enough.:nono:
Will report!

The razor is lifting off the hone. Make sure, especially when your finishing, that you curl your pinky under the scale so it can not in any way shape or form for even a second lift off the hone.

Any time you apply any pressure to hold the blade down your blowing it.

Because I can not see the stroke pattern from above I can not tell if your stroke pattern is perfectly symmetrical, but I've often found that guys that hone with the stone in a 12/6 orientation often screw up the away stroke's distance down the hone. You need to make sure your hitting the same point on the stone for every single stroke.

Nice video too. With patience and discipline you'll get it soon.

Thanks for all the advice, I'm keeping a keen eye out on how the razor is contacting the hone now as it seems to be something I might be screwing up.

I gave honing up my favourite razor a shot tonight an EUREKA!

It passes the HHT along most of the blade easily and the real test. IT SHAVES COMFORTABLY!

:y:y:y:y:y

Ok, I'm sure I'm smashing many netiquette rules in this post, but dang if it doesn't feel sweet-ass getting that first comfortable shave from a razor you once held in your hand in dismay after seeing it had rusted in the Australian tropics!

Thanks for the help, I'll continue to practice and experiement of course. I -did- learn one thing for sure during my honing experience. This is my experience though, and of course, due to your own technique etc yadda yadda yadda YMMV but the x-pattern is a clear winner for hitting all areas on the blade more evenly than painting the hone with your razor up and back.

I will try the 3o'clock to 9o'clock method as many people have said it's a winner so I'll give it another shot. Maybe it's a winner.

In short. Thanks, I'm on my way! GImmie 40 years, and I might get a great edge, but for now, my favourite razor is shaving again. :tu

Congrats! I use a 2/8 orientation personally. I always like the best of both worlds.

Urgh. It's lost its edge completely and is now officially an uncomfortable shave. :mad::rant:

Maybe had a wire edge, don't know how though. Too much pressure maybe. Either way, gunna give it a rest for a few weeks, else I'm likely to throw it out the window.
:chop:

Keep at it. Not all razors "play the game".
You have inspired me with you video !
I'll be sporting Harris Tweed sports coat, Van Husen shirt and a cravat for mine. I don't do cuff links though:rock:
This could be a SRP rule, - You must dress formaly for honing vids:D
M

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Originally Posted by littlesilverbladefromwale

This could be a SRP rule, - You must dress formaly for honing vids:D
M

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Hahaha, yeah!
Someone in the chat, probably markavery, the cretin, vowed to wear a mustard stained white wifebeater (how much do you wanna type "white whifebeater?) in his next video.

He says that like it's something he'll especially find and wear, instead of being the bulk of his waredrobe. :rofl2: