Str8 from 1k

The edge is our main weapon against wiskers. All the preparation and technique in the world can not overcome a lack for this most crucial aspect.

A well prepared beard, shaved with sound, confident technique will certainly make the task easier with any given edge. However neither of these can improve shave quality as dramatically as will a fully sharp, smooth razor.

There have been some good discussions lately examining the smallest details, far beyond necessity of practical matters. We think in terms of micrometers, even nanometers, just this side of nothingness.

We want the next highest grit, the best natural finisher, another strop to load. If you can stop for just a moment and re-boot, you may find yourself wondering; what is all of this for?

You may feel as though you already have the answer. You likely have strong opinions on what you need to get a good shave.

However I would like to submit for your consideration that shaving directly from 1k grit stone can provide not only a degree of sharpness that produces smooth touch with the grain, but will do so without irritation and burning.

It is not to be the end of the pursuit. But without this corner stone the rest of what follows, its necessity, its purpose can never be actualized or understood.

I have shaved off a 4k and an 8k. I could never get the edge smooth enough off a 1k. I guess I could if I spent 2 hours stropping.

I get your point and that some get obsessed with honing. I almost got there then I realized that I needed just a minimum for a setup and have stuck to that.

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Originally Posted by singlewedge

I get your point and that some get obsessed with honing. I almost got there then I realized that I needed just a minimum for a setup and have stuck to that.

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I think that the average member here or straight razor shaver elsewhere has come to the same conclusion you have and that is fine. For some of us honing is an end in itself and that is fine too. Different strokes for different folks ..... literally.

I shave off of the 8k or the equivalent with every razor I hone before I move up to a finer finishing grit. I've never thought of trying it off the 4k and certainly not the 1k. That would certainly be a test.

My skin is sensitive to the point that I am limited to 2 passes whether with a straight or a DE with a new Gillette Swede so I don't think I will be stepping up to the plate for that one but it is an interesting idea.

I think it is ok to be "obcessed" with honing. Of course being clinically, insanely obcessed is probably not healthy. Strops and straps are for later first we have to make a smooth edge.

What I am hoping you and others will do is simply revisit this issue next time you start a sharpening session. Let's explore a little what needs to happen in order to tame its reputation.

sometime in the future try again; see what has happened to your skills.

We can form our opinions early, we try a stone, a technique-- No Good. We move on expecting it to be always so, absolutely true.

I agree with Jimmy, if I had the coin to have some the rare and pretty stones that he has I would do it. But I realized that they would be too pretty to use so I stuck with this:

1k ceramic Global
3.5k Arkansas
6k King
12k Chinese
1 mic Diamond on balsa
.5 mic CRo2 on balsa
Strop and canvas.

Does me just fine.

I would like a Forest or a Water of Ayr, but that is not in th cards.

I've got the Forest but if I could just find a Water of Ayr I might could get my razors sharp. :shrug:

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

I think that the average member here or straight razor shaver elsewhere has come to the same conclusion you have and that is fine. For some of us honing is an end in itself and that is fine too. Different strokes for different folks ..... literally.

I shave off of the 8k or the equivalent with every razor I hone before I move up to a finer finishing grit. I've never thought of trying it off the 4k and certainly not the 1k. That would certainly be a test.

My skin is sensitive to the point that I am limited to 2 passes whether with a straight or a DE with a new Gillette Swede so I don't think I will be stepping up to the plate for that one but it is an interesting idea.

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Yes Jimmy. and we are gonna try to get you past that. Everyone has something: a thick beard of wire, sensitive skin, thin soft hair, jowls. I am not dismissing your condition, but let's see what happens.

Thanks for your point of view OS. I assumed from the start there would be more than a few who would not be interested for quite a number of reasons.

I have tried it before, as I have with all my razor hones. The result this time were much improved over that original first go round. Similarly, my first edges prepared on 8k left me with the desire for a finer hone believing that was all I needed.

I guess it's time for me to confess I've shaved my beard once with a 600 grit diasharp DMT-honed edge.

Irritation and burning resulted :mad:

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Originally Posted by kevint

Thanks for your point of view OS. I assumed from the start there would be more than a few who would not be interested for quite a number of reasons.

I have tried it before, as I have with all my razor hones. The result this time were much improved over that original first go round. Similarly, my first edges prepared on 8k left me with the desire for a finer hone believing that was all I needed.

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Ah so... the point being that with improved honing skills the shave improved. Very true and I for one am seeking to ....hone my skills ... and no pun intended.

Gentlemen, I submit for you, FIFTY Micron Chromium Oxide or..I shaved off of a 300 grit edge this A.M

I do have my doubts that the chrome ox mentioned in that post is actually and consistently as coarse in particle size as 50 micron. I was able to get a successful and comfortable shave, although on the lower end of that spectrum without irritation. I did shave slower than normal with short deliberate passes.

Lynn says it best when he talks about how many of us knowing full well that we don't NEED to use hones finest to the Nth degree, are in pursuit of that "perfect" edge. The journey even if it's not necessary is enjoyable. Kind of like a surfer continuously in search of that perfect wave I would imagine.

Chris L

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Originally Posted by ChrisL

Gentlemen, I submit for you, FIFTY Micron Chromium Oxide or..I shaved off of a 300 grit edge this A.M

I do have my doubts that the chrome ox mentioned in that post is actually and consistently as coarse in particle size as 50 micron. I was able to get a successful and comfortable shave, although on the lower end of that spectrum without irritation. I did shave slower than normal with short deliberate passes.

Lynn says it best when he talks about how many of us knowing full well that we don't NEED to use hones finest to the Nth degree, are in pursuit of that "perfect" edge. The journey even if it's not necessary is enjoyable. Kind of like a surfer continuously in search of that perfect wave I would imagine.
Chris L

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Ummmm I would prefer hearing about a 50 micron hone finished without stropping as such would then be relevant here.

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Ah so... the point being that with improved honing skills the shave improved. Very true and I for one am seeking to ....hone my skills ... and no pun intended.

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I believe improvement must begin at the foundation.

I used essentially the same techniques I described with the "bbw enough?"thread : one sided honing to set; straight and x strokes to refine. Here I finished with two laps of deliberate back hone strokes.

The same wet face and lather prep. Without dry shaving I gave every advantage to the beard. No stropping.

Now my barber tells me my beard is "kinda tough", my face is not rawhided, and I am not a wizard. If I can do it anyone can.

The point I am trying to make though is; how can one improve in skill, or evaluate the state of their honing if one does not first understand on a personal, intimate level what is possible; what is the potential for each hone in the progression to make improvement?

I've gotten a pretty decent shave off dmt-e, but I consider it an exception. I think I can pull it off with 0.3%-1% of my razors. If I were better at honing that may increase, but it will never be a very high number.

It's all a matter of what you're after. Most people have way more hone than skill, which is fine, any hone is way, way cheaper than skill.

Hi Kevin,
I never thought of doing a grit experiment in that direction. Counterintuitive in my head, but the idea is worth entertaining. Let me ask you, do you visualize a serrated edge or the same product when we go to the other end of the spectrum i.e. getting a extremely defined fine edge with no grooves, teeth etc. accomplished through technique. I mean you can drive a finishg nail home with a sledge hammer but that would be hard to do without collateral damage. Not saying you can't but it would be more difficult.
Mike

Skill takes time and practice. Doing stuff like this is a teaching tool for me.

I can tell where my honing is and what the strop is doing. If I only hurry to the end; and it is not good. I don't know what it might be. Or, if it is good; what was the key.

By the time it came to trying the 8k, I was back to the same 8k edge I had experienced before. Over doing it somewhat at 1 and 5k had no benefit in the long run

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Originally Posted by kevint

I believe improvement must begin at the foundation.

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This is the quintessential part of all skills, trust me I can go on and on about this, heck I am a Martial Arts Instructor after all, we all can get diarrhea of the mouth when it comes to talking about how true skill begins at the foundation....

I am going to try this on the next two razors I have to hone Kev, I wanna try pushing the edges on a Naniwa and a Shapton 1k just to see what happens...

I have always wanted to see if a honing expert could get a good shave off a 1k . I also agree with all that the best way to get the best shave possible is by using not a hone to the NTH degree but by having really good honing skills.

And I thought all this time I only needed a great set of stones. Who knew I actually needed skills and practice?

I would be afraid to do this......but then again, I am a newb.