*razzle frazzle grumble* Warped Edge

Soooo...I got this razor, and it had a bit of a frown. Quite a bit, actually. I tried the method suggested somewhere here of using an "exaggerated rolling X" to hone down the heel and toe, and I got to where the edge was straight. So I thought I was golden....

Then I tried to hone, and after the bevel was there I couldn't get an edge set to save my life--it was all over the place. So under magnification, I checked and on the "front" of the blade, the heel and toe were being polished, but the center was not. Checking the back, the reverse was true (please see my crappy picture). I assume there must be a kind of bow in the center of the blade, though it appears flat when on a straight edge/flat surface....

If that is the case, I can see polishing the OUTSIDE of the bow with a rolling X....but what about the inside (The area marked NOT OK in my crappy picture)? The warp is too narrow to fit any part of the hone into, we're talking like less than a half an inch, I'd have to be honing right on the very edge of the hone to make any contact...is there another way? Some kind of selective taping or something?

Anything? Help!

I know it sounds terrible, but you may want to tape the edge and hone the spine until it is even... :(:shrug::confused:

Interesting , I think i'll follow- I'd like to know the outcome and possible solutions


thanks Garry

In an update, I tried to get a bit more "scientimific" tonight. The marker test? Ink totally worn away across the bevel in two strokes. But still no joy on getting an edge, and the scratches in those areas remain unpolished after several passes. WHAT GIVES??? Could it be bad steel?

Is there still ink at the very edge in spots after the two-pass marker test, and were they the same as your previous honing strokes? got a loupe? :)

The ink was gone out to the edge under 100x magnification. What I can't be sure of was the nature of the strokes...I might have been more careful, to be honest. I was getting a bit frustrated, and my strokes might have been getting a bit more uncontrolled there toward the end...

Are you sure it is actually straight lined along the edge and not a bit of frown remains?

I have a 9mm or so wide strip of stone scrap from hone sawing-been meaning to use it but have not. You could try your luck with a ripe stick.-- Abrasive embedded in a stick
or side sharpening with pressure.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kevint

Are you sure it is actually straight lined along the edge and not a bit of frown remains?

I have a 9mm or so wide strip of stone scrap from hone sawing-been meaning to use it but have not. You could try your luck with a ripe stick.-- Abrasive embedded in a stick
or side sharpening with pressure.

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Well, I checked by setting the razor edge down on the hone and it looked flat, but you're right, there could be a couple of micrometers there. I'll look into it...

And I have been contemplating the stick idea. I have some thin strips of wood, I could try putting some of my heretical powders on there and see how it goes.

I also just realized--the razor has a bit of a swayback. Would that effect the honing? Should I be trying to put a matching smile on this blade?

Sounds like a warped blade.

No real solutions for you, I'm sorry to say. The ones I've come across like that were brandy new, and as such I returned them to the vendor.

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

Sounds like a warped blade.

No real solutions for you, I'm sorry to say. The ones I've come across like that were brandy new, and as such I returned them to the vendor.

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I agree . I ran into this problem with a W&B Bow razor . After about 2 hours of honing on the 1k , I realized that there wouldn't be much left of the blade if I did hone it straight , so I set it aside and moved on .

if you repeat (a few or perhaps many times) whatever you did to remove the ink during the marker test along the length of the bevel in only two strokes, then I think I can say with confidence that your bevel will (with perseverance) set

but don't get sloppy or you can ruin the work you've already done. at least, that is my short experience with asymmetrical spines

OK, now I am freaking frustrated.

I decided to try something a bit different today, so I started with a taped spine. I did some exaggerated rolling x strokes, and used the marker test liberally, and I found that I was making progress. I set a bevel--it was feeling like a sharp pocket knife, like Lynn recommends, but not cutting any arm hair at that point. I figured "Don't push it, less is more, etc." so I moved to the 4K. Again, rolling Xs, marker test, making sure the edge was contacting...I was seeing slow but sure progress under the mag this time, so there was improvement over yesterday, but I wasn't feeling any gain in keenness...still the sharp pocket knife feeling. I tried a 4K/8K pyramid, again with marker test and the rolling Xs. The bevel was getting polished, the marker was going away, but NO GAIN IN KEENNESS. At the end of the pyramid, I have a nicely polished bevel under the microscope, and a razor that won't cut a damn thing. :banghead::cry::banghead::cry:

So apparently that bevel wasn't set at all.

Back to square one. :banghead::cry::banghead:

Yeah I don't think the bevel was set

I think "less is more" applies to post-bevel setting...

Anyway I don't know your arm hair - maybe red is often finer? Anyway when I set a bevel, it has to be able to cut hair before I'll move on to 4k or finer. Calibrated for my arm hair of course...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hoglahoo

Yeah I don't think the bevel was set

I think "less is more" applies to post-bevel setting...

Anyway I don't know your arm hair - maybe red is often finer? Anyway when I set a bevel, it has to be able to cut hair before I'll move on to 4k or finer. Calibrated for my arm hair of course...

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Darn my fine red hair.

Can you send me your arm? Left is fine, or whatever. I'll send it back good as new, minus some hair, of course.

I promise.

I give up. I give up i give up igiveupigiveup.

4 hours. FOUR HOURS of honing on this thing. I honed in a bit of a smile after reading Smythe's post here--this razor had a frown when I got it, and it seemed to have all the problems he described. Plus, it just made sense for a swaybacked razor to have a matching smile.

So I was making progress. I taped the spine because if I hadn't, there would be no spine left, and I got to where I was mostly hitting on points with my strokes using the marker test. Iwas using Lynn's 45 degree strokes, and after a while I was noticing some real progress. I got to where the heel was a really nice feeling bevel--popping hairs and sticky. But the toe WOULD NOT GET SHARP. I tried circles and back honing on just the toe, I tried extra tape on the toe. I tried toe-leading 45 degree strokes, and NOTHING HAPPENED. No change whatsoever in the feel of that toe. I have half a bevel, and a rapidly shrinking razor.

Enough.

I looked into my crystal coticule ball and saw that your away stroke is good, but your return stroke is missing good contact with the toe.

Fix it and you'll have a nice, sharp bevel from toe to heel

:w

I snagged a mint Genco Master Barber off ebay for $15 several months ago. It was beautiful. When I started honing it I was horrified to find it was warped. :(

I could see if I just kept it flat on the stones, it was going to have big scalloped bevels. I tried rolling X strokes off the edge of the stones and that helped, but I couldn't get it as smooth shaving as I wanted. Finally I tried diamond lapping film in narrow 1-inch strips. That worked like a charm. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hoglahoo

I looked into my crystal coticule ball and saw that your away stroke is good, but your return stroke is missing good contact with the toe.

Fix it and you'll have a nice, sharp bevel from toe to heel

:w

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You should go on the road! ;) Yeah. That was it in the end. It was, predictably, MY fault. The initial warp was eliminated by honing in a smile, but the final issues with the bevel at the toe were uneven strokes on the return.

I now have a very nice bevel, easily shaving arm hair along the entire length of the blade.

Thanks for the advice, guys.

O_S, it's not a known brand--a Japanese made blade called "Rongin."

Warped edges might be a problem, but it also could be an excuse to buy a narrow hone. That might work.


Skizzo