Some thoughts on "Learning to Hone"

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11-13-2009, 06:23 AM
IanS

If you create a sharp blade through practice and a great deal of time and experimentation, trial and error, and USE that blade, hold it, maneuver it, polish it, and just look at it for a long time before bringing it to your face (or your board), you're going to have a great deal more understanding of what it's going to do, how it's going to do it, and how you need to handle it than if you had purchased it, swiped it a few times on a strop (or steel) and got down to business.

When I started my current job, I never really felt comfortable with the knives there until I'd taken each one to the stones and gotten very familiar with the edge that they had. And when someone else gets their hands on them and screws with the edge... I feel it immediately upon using the knife and it's not as comfortable for me to use until I can fix it.

I feel the recommendation to buy a shave ready and then another certainly makes straight shaving much easier to get started, but I doubt it makes the experience as a whole better. I think we can presume that if you need a razor, you are old enough to not require immediate rewards, that you understand the reward of study, practice, and work... and know that doing these things will pay off.

Now if someone comes in wanting to shave with a straight tomorrow to save money, yeah... the ready to go razor is obviously a better choice. If someone wants to shave with a straight for life, I can see the benefit of having them learn the finer points of care and feeding for the razor before they become attached to using it as a tool.
11-13-2009, 07:17 AM
holli4pirating

I'm late coming to this thread, and I don't want to read the whole thing, so I'll just throw out my two cents.

Find some beater razors, find someone who knows what they are doing to set the bevel, then hone them the rest of the way.
11-13-2009, 02:14 PM
JimmyHAD

Quote:

Originally Posted by holli4pirating

I'm late coming to this thread, and I don't want to read the whole thing, so I'll just throw out my two cents.

Find some beater razors, find someone who knows what they are doing to set the bevel, then hone them the rest of the way.

Good advice, and if you can be looking over the honer's shoulder while he is working on it even better. :)
11-13-2009, 04:30 PM
gssixgun

Quote:

Originally Posted by IanS

I feel the recommendation to buy a shave ready and then another certainly makes straight shaving much easier to get started, but I doubt it makes the experience as a whole better. I think we can presume that if you need a razor, you are old enough to not require immediate rewards, that you understand the reward of study, practice, and work... and know that doing these things will pay off.

If you were to go back in the archives I bet you could find almost the exact same statement from me...

I learned different, Honing straight razors is not a science, but if you start from a known beginning point it becomes slightly less esoteric and much more of a sclence...
Anyone who believes as you do I have one piece of advice for, Go to a meet up... Watch and learn how hard it is for people to learn how to hone when you have experienced Honemiester sitting right there next to them at a table, after that you will see why we recommend getting at least a shave ready razor...

Some people have the aptitude for it, they have the essential skill set and are just naturals at it, all they have to do is learn the tricks...But even those people need a benchmark blade...
11-13-2009, 05:04 PM
richmondesi

You know, I could imagine that it would be harder for me to hone a razor with you, Lynn, and Max watching me than it is for me in my little office where no one really is critiquing me. Meet ups don't strike me as the easiest place to practice, although there wouldn't be a much better place if a person could get over himself and just soak in the information.
11-13-2009, 05:22 PM
IanS

Very good point, I absolutely agree that a sharp blade is necessary to compare against... unless you have plenty of body hair and a high clotting factor. ;)

I can tell a sharp knife on first pickup, usually on first glance... certainly by watching it in use (anyone can tell a sharp knife by using it). But I'm still not convinced I'll be able to tell if my razors are shave-worthy without testing them on my arm, chest, etc or immediate comparison. That's why I purchased a shave-ready off classifieds. I look forward to developing a feel for a razor edge, but I don't think it will ever be instinctual. And from reading other's who claim to have HAD... the process is this. Shave with what you have, thinking it's the best... buy more stones/pastes/strops and try them out, decide if it's better and if it is, welcome them into the fold and evolve. That's why I certainly can appreciate the popularity of the easy intro (2 shave ready's, $20 strop, 4k/8k, use em till comfortable, then expand). I personally am a very deep end sort of person. I learned computers by disassembling one at age 9, rebuilding it, then building my own from the board up a year later. I was installing networks and replacing caps and resistors on components in my mid-teens for spending money. In all fields that hold my interest, I've met a lot of people who prefer to learn like me, and it does take someone who is stubborn as a mule and curious as a monkey who's owner wears a yellow sombrero.

However there's really a third option, that I see a lot of people taking that I really can't see an upside to.

"Hi, I just bought this $250 razor, this $400 set of stones, this $150 shaving kit, etc, etc... because I heard they were the best... how do I use them?"

That just demonstrates an irresponsibility I can't comprehend. I mean if they do stick with it, yes they're set up like most of the experienced guys probably wish they'd started (knowing what they do now), but more likely they're the ones who'll try shaving, cut themselves... blame the equipment and say "Even with the best, this sucks!" then storm off.

When you work with a trashed out razor (good steel but in need of TLC), repair it into an excellent razor, and in doing so develop the skills to really understand Straight shaving at a depth that would take much more time to develop any other way then put that to your face and build on your understanding of the design of a razor with understanding of the application of a razor, I feel you are going to be more aware in your use of that razor, to notice things that otherwise you'd have to come back and recognize later. But I am just applying my experience in other things to make an assumption here. I'll let you know how my method pans out if anyone is interested. I did actually buy a digital camera to produce before and afters of my first repair job, my first shave (with a shave-ready) and my first shave (with my first repair job).
11-13-2009, 05:37 PM
shooter1

Quote:

Originally Posted by richmondesi

You know, I could imagine that it would be harder for me to hone a razor with you, Lynn, and Max watching me than it is for me in my little office where no one really is critiquing me. Meet ups don't strike me as the easiest place to practice, although there wouldn't be a much better place if a person could get over himself and just soak in the information.

I would not only welcome you looking over my shoulder Glen, I would even pay for a one on one session with you using my hones on my razors.

The notion of having one on one instruction from an experienced honer has been mentioned numerous times in this post as one of the quickest ways to decrease the learning curve and reinforce proper technique. Sooo, any honmiesters near Lebanon Oregon want a student?
11-13-2009, 05:42 PM
IanS

If anyone accepts, you should make him wax and buff your car. Tell him it's part of his training.
11-13-2009, 06:16 PM
gssixgun

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1

I would not only welcome you looking over my shoulder Glen, I would even pay for a one on one session with you using my hones on my razors.

The notion of having one on one instruction from an experienced honer has been mentioned numerous times in this post as one of the quickest ways to decrease the learning curve and reinforce proper technique. Sooo, any honmiesters near Lebanon Oregon want a student?

April 24th-25th in Portland, meet me there :)

http://straightrazorpalace.com/get-t...-together.html

http://straightrazorpalace.com/get-t...-together.html

It looks like baring any emergency, I will be driving into that one..

:beer2: Look forward to meeting ya having a beer and talking razors...
11-15-2009, 03:06 PM
GeauxLSU

Since my last post, I've made some strides in honing. I got the Chinese 12K and tried it in a 1K, 4K, 8K, 12K progression. The subject was a Greaves razor that wouldn't cut arm hair.

I went slow, minding my form and after some time was rewarded with a sharp razor. A light stropping on balsa with .5 diamond paste then on both linen and leather on a hanging strop finished the task. A test shave showed no pull and ATG was without effort.

I found that one can read and watch all of the videos you want, but until you hone a razor it's all academic.

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