Honing and micro-serations..?

Ok after some honing with a 4-5kish hone, then my barbers hone and some stropping I got a rough shave with this King mfg co. razor I had picked up in an antique shop.Rough as in it shaved my entire face but not nearly as close as needs to be.So I grabbed my eye loupe out of my tool box(had one from being a machinist, and cutting .002-.005 parting lines) and took a look.What a totally new view! I could see some dark spots on the bevel and some micro-serations, so I did a couple more passes on each hone and stropped again. I got rid of the dark spots, and got the micro-serations smaller. Here's the question. Do the micro serations ever go totally away?

Depends on what you call micro serrations. Even the finest edges have teeth, kind of like a saw, when viewed under magnification. That's how they cut.

If, however, you mean micro chipping, then yes, that is something you should to aim to not have.

Try to keep a light hand on the hone. That could be your issue.

James.

Not 100% sure I can discern the difference between micro chipping and micro serations. Did another alternating honing and stropping and got them smaller still, the edge feels really sticky on the thumb pad test.However I'm wondering if not having an 8kish stone to fill the gap in hone progression is what's holding me back.

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Originally Posted by Strikur

However I'm wondering if not having an 8kish stone to fill the gap in hone progression is what's holding me back.

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OOOOooooo and there it is my friends the ugly head of HAD rises up :)

But of course another hone will solve that problem and then perhaps a 10k or 30k to follow that and then you do know the natural stones leave a different finish from those nasty sharp synthetics right????

Muhahahaha yer hooked pal welcome to our affliction...

After getting razors honed by noted honemeisters and examining the bevels under a 30x stereo scope I stopped worrying about striations. I just feel for keenness and ignore the teeth. I still look for chips and unevenness but scratches in the bevel are inconsequential to me if the razor is shaving well.

A couple of pics of the razor I'm currently honing. Like I needed an excuse to play with the camera!

I agree with Jimmy.. the ultimate test is how it shaves. But... as you are a machinist (and so proably pretty precise guy) heres what i have found...

An 8K Norton leaves scratches (just finer ones than a 5K). Where each of the scratches intersects the edge you have a little valley. Typically, fewer scraches means smoother edge means smoother shave (for me with my honing).

It is certainly possible to get a blade polished to the point where all the scratches on the bevel are gone when viewed unter typical loupe magnification (10X or 20X). As a matter of fact the first time I saw this I was really confused, as all I could see were faint marks running parallell to the blade edge which I am now pretty sure is the grain of the steel. Anyway, choices, choices...to get there you just need to progress to finer and finer grits. If you choose to do this with hones you will get less rounding over of the edge, but will spend more $. But, its nice. Or, you can go from your hone onto progressivly finer polishing compounds on wood, leather or felt ( such as ferric oxide (red compounds(rouge)) followed by Cromium oxide (green compounds)). If you are brave, you can use coarser polishing compounds before the red (like tripoli (black)) especially if you have no 8K hone. Or, you can use the 1 micron microabrasive paper made by 3m on a sheet of glass instead of an 8K hone. Or you can use diamond polishing compounds. Your technique with pastes, rouges, honing compounds as well as the degree of firmness of the substrate that you put them on will affect how much the edge gets rounded over while its getting polished. I find that extremely light pressure can produce very nice polishing and minimal rounding.

Blade rust can be deceiving. Sometimes, a blade that looks worthless due to rust will take a good edge. Sometimes, a blade that doesn't look too rusty just won't take an edge. If a blade just won't take an edge, I examine it under 100x magnification looking for rust. What I look for most are pits of rust in the area of the honed bevel.

If you honed, and your edge wasn't optimal, it is probably due to honing surfaces and technique. But, it might be caused by the blade itself. Rust is a possible cause.