My favorite hone and a question

I have a three hone starting set from Tilly (great service btw, very nice lady). Being still a mere beginner, I find that I have troubles with the Lithide hone (the finest) and I seem to dull my razors instead of sharpening. On the other hand, the Gem is a very sweet hone to work with and gives me incredibly sharp blades that are a dream to shave with.

Should I even try to master the Lithide ? I'm pretty happy with my Gem, but it makes me think that I may be missing something. The feel of the Lithide is so extremely smooth that I think I just lose control of the blade. Did I go over the top when lapping ?

I wouldn't think you went overboard lapping it, but I won't pretend to know the answer. I would be willing to suggest that with a smoother hone you may not completely appreciate the need for enough pressure to hold the razor flat against the slippery hone, and be able to balance that with the need for a light touch...the techniques aren't easy to master. Atleast in my opinion. But it could be something else, also. You might try placing your fingers on the razor but not applying any pressure at all. It sounds crazy but its like a craddle effect, you prevent the razor from rising off the hone with your fingers. The technique worked for me before I learned other stroke methods. The other option I would use (but isn't easy to learn) is to just use a light touch and don't really try to stroke the razor down the hone, just hold the hone in the left hand and try to "wipe" the blade (FLAT ofcourse) gently along the hone, like your caressing the hone with a feather, that technique works well also. So your attempting to keep the blade flat for only about 1/2 inch down the hone, technically pretty easy for anyone.

I think that I am going to purchase one of tilly's 3 piece starter sets. Looks like a great travel set of hones. I have high hopes of the lithide.

I've got a set of Tilly's beginner hones - I actually emailed Tilly regarding the Lithide as I couldn't get that mirror like finish.Turns out It needed some more lapping ( I'm only a newbie so even lapping was a challenge ) once It was there I noticed a big differnce when using it , from reading the various threads I would summise it is possibly not unlike the black paste I here people mention for strops when passed a few times it gives you a lovely polished edge , however I did notice the slightest pressure on the blade will cause it to drag on the hone and the keen edge is lost ..
As I said Im only a newbie and I find myself spending most nights trying to develope my honing skills on some razors I've picked up on ebay ...
I've now got a collection of hones - Tilly's beginner set .. A Carborundum 102 , a Norton 4/8k and a Belgian Blue and a Yellow coticule ( the polygon ) , I'm still trying to find whats comfortable , so far I feel Im getting more control and better results with the little hones ..

Those are some wildly different hones so expect to experience different results. I suggest you stick with one kind (barber hones or water stones) to get the feel for working with that tool. Check the edge very frequently using the thumb test, like after every few strokes to see how it's progressing.

I have a Honemaster which is a very fine hone that cuts blazingly fast, like you describe the Lithide quickly dulling the edge. I have not looked through a microscope, but I think this very fine hone simply smooths the little cutting fins right away on me. I only do a few ultra light passes on the Honemeister in my honing to keep some of the teeth. Ease way back off what you have been doing and see what changes. And check the edge before and after going there to see how much is too much.

X

I think time will tell and help me find my niche with regards to the hones - I try ( as I did over the weekend ) not to combine the barber hones with the belgians ... ( I want a honemaster now it sounds great ) LOL ;) this great advice which I take home from work here and try out
Thanks .. Garry.

I also got the beginners set from Tilly. The strop and gem hones are great, but I can't seem to get the lithide flat enought to use so I just set it aside for now. Maybe later on I will get it flat enough to use and get a keener edge on my blades. But for now I find that the gem is sufficient. I get a good close shave with 2 or 3 passes little pulling if any. Mostly on dry wiskers that the lather neglects to catch. Really thinking about getting a yellow coticule instead of using the lithide. Any suggestions on this choice?

Keaton

I should have a Lithide in a few days to check out. I'm already disappointed that you guys don't like that one. Next I want to buy a Kimberly...ok so I'm cheap. Anyway, if I come across something insightful about the Lithide I'll let you know.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kvidoo

I also got the beginners set from Tilly. The strop and gem hones are great, but I can't seem to get the lithide flat enought to use so I just set it aside for now. Maybe later on I will get it flat enough to use and get a keener edge on my blades. But for now I find that the gem is sufficient. I get a good close shave with 2 or 3 passes little pulling if any. Mostly on dry wiskers that the lather neglects to catch. Really thinking about getting a yellow coticule instead of using the lithide. Any suggestions on this choice?

Keaton

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I'm a big fan of my lithide, I use it lots. If it were me, I'd keep trying to get that puppy lapped!

My first lithide is sitting in pieces on my desktop, and I am waiting for my second one...

Keaton,
How are you trying to lap it? I have one I have not used (I have one of everything Tilly sells as I am a pushover for a sweet lady <g>).

I lap the Belgians and other stones on wet or dry sand paper laid on a granite surface plate ($39 at Woodcraft). I can use diferent grits or paper depending on how much material I need to remove.

Tony

Lapping with 400, 800, 1000, 2000 on flat countertop in a figure 8. When I get a really thick slurry I wash it off and start again. I've almost gone through about half the stone and the colors have come together a bit but not significatly. I just think the middle had a really high spot in it and the edges are low.

Keaton,

Umm, by "half the stone" you don't mean half the thickness???

The Lithide should be close to flat to start with but most barber hones I have seem a little high right in the middle and again right on the outer edges.

I always use a coarse paper, maybe 400 and lap keeping the stone absolutely flat until the entire surface is showing scratches from the 400 grit. That is then flat, go to something a little finer to remove the scratches. Until the surface if level there is no point if going to finer paper.

Tony

Tony,

Yes I mean almost half the thickness. The center shows the scratches but the outsides really don't. One of the edges is coming in but that is about it. I started with the 2000 but wasn't really getting anywhere so I went with 400. Still really didn't get anywhere so now it is sitting on my kitchen table just stareing at me waiting till I get unfrustrated with it and try again.

Keaton

Well, here's my lapping experience with barber hones... I got both Itsapeech and Lithide hones from Tilly. Started lapping on 800 (or 1000?) and the Lithide laped fine, leaving thick black slurry on the sandpaper. I went quickly trough the initial surface, created matte, not glass like surface, and decided it's time to change to finer grit. The feeling on the sandpaper was like I'm taking off material fast, so I stopped lapping and decided I don't need the glass like smooth on the Lithide. Taking it off the sandpaper, it created such suction, it slipped off my hand and meet with floor tiles...
The Itsapeech was diferent story. The feeling on the sandpaper was like I am laping with acrylic hone on glass surface. Nothing. I lapped and lapped and... And I didn't managed to take the initial surface even after couple of hours on the 800. No slurry either. Then I decided to rough tings a bit. Slapped some 320, put large amount of force on the hone, and started doing 8-ts... This time it was a lot better, the material was sanding away, and I progressed with 400, 600, 800 and 1000 in 2-3 hours. After lot's of elbow greese and weared sandpaper, I am satisfied with the result. Not mirror finish, but quite smooth, and I know it could be better, but I don't have access to finer grit. Also, I don't know if Itsapeech is improving my N8K edges...

Nenad

Keaton,
To me it sounds like the hone must be rolling a little as you lap so you are never going to get a flat surface. Lapping is one of those things that needs to be visualized as you go. You are sliding the stone end to end,side to side, circles, figure 8's, whatever but the entire time you are thinking the stone is moving in a perfectly flat plane otherwise it rolls ever so slightly and creates a convex surface instead. Hours later you have half a stone just as convex as you started.

I always start by laying a steel straight edge along the stone first and sighting along it against a bright light. That lets you see what is high, what is low and by how much. I don't recall any of the hones I got from Tilly being more than 1/32" from flat. If that much of an eror I would go right to 400 grit at the finest and work till flat. Then maybe an 800 and done.

Tony

Well I got my Lithide and I found it to be an excellent finishing hone. I may even use it from now on. Lapping was a breeze, I used a Swaty to lap it and it performs perfectly. I think this hone alone will get my razors far sharper than I'll ever need.

Alan,

Good to hear you're enjoying that Lithide. It's one fine hone indeed. I've also got a "mini-me" Lithide hone that I keep in my wet kit when traveling. It's so small it will make you laugh, but it works great.

Hal