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So im still trying to learn to hone. Everyone says " Do the HHT" TPT. Ok so what do you do when All of your shave ready razors wont pop your arm hair. I think my arm hair is too fine. It just lays down as the blade passes. So if my sharpest shave ready razors wont do it then how can i test my honing?
The shave test! :)
Seriously, thats the best way to see if a razor is both sharp and smooth.
Make sure you can shave arm hair at skin level off the 1k stone and then move up the grits, checking that you can shave arm hair at skin level after each stone. Once you come off your daily strop, test shave a very small patch of your face (no lather or anything) and see how the blade feels. Does it shave well? Does it pull or feel harsh on the skin?
If that test does well, lather up and do a complete shave and see how you go.
The HHT is really a parlour trick and is only any use when its been calibrated for your hair and you know what to look for using your hair.
My benchmarks are shaving arm hair at skin level off the 1k and being able to shave arm hair floating ~1mm above the skin off the 8k. I also use a loupe to watch the edge develop and I always make sure I can shave arm hair at skin level after each stone.
If you cant do that "1mm 8k" test I'd get an eye loupe, watch the edge develop using the loupe and rely on the test shave at the end to tell you how the edge is.
I always finish with a test shave of any razor I hone as thats really the only way to tell if you have a good edge. All the tests in the middle (HHT, TNT, TPT, arm hair tests etc...) just tell you how the edge is developing, but wont tell you how good the shave is.
+1 with what Stu said, shave and do not worry with HHT.
If it does not shave well then most probably the bevel is not set correctly.
On the contrary, knowledgeable honers whose posts I read, say that the shave is the true test and the TPT and HHT are honing aids but have little to do with where the rubber meets the road. For example I have a friend who was watching Randydance honing a series of razors at an SRP meetup a couple of years ago. Randy was running the razors over the hair on his forearm without touching the skin and hair was falling like rain.Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknbleeding
My friend is a competent honer himself, having honed many dull razors to shave ready for many members. He had never been able to pop arm hair like Randy was doing. So he asked Randy if he could try it with the razors Randy had been doing it with and did. The arm hair just brushed off of the edges without cutting. My friend felt a bit relieved that the inability to pop arm hair was due to his own hair and not because of his honing. :) So if you're getting a close, smooth, irritation free shave you must be doing something right.
That is my experience as well. Initially, I honed and honed, but could not cut arm hair. In desperation, I continued my honing and the razor shaved well!Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
I now use the HHT at the end of honing, and it is very useful. But, the arm hair test is useless to me.
It is my belief that if the HHT is useful for some and not others, that the arm hair test is in all likelihood useful for some and not for others.
Sorry but I am at a loss here. I am not aware that everyone here says to do the HHT. If you are talking about shaving arm hairs that is different.Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknbleeding
In the end the shave, as everyone above has noted, if the test that counts. Those of us that hone razors and try to explain the process to our SRP friends can only describe what works for us. Sometimes we just can't put into words the fine points of the process and working with someone in person really helps. If all of your razors shave you well you just need to find a way, that works for you, to identify when the razor is at that state and when it is not. The TPT, TNT, AHT and all the other tests are what has worked for different groups of people. When you find what works for you please let us know.
Good luck.
You can make a razor pass the HHT off of a DMT. With that said, once you have honed a few razors and know how a razor should react off various hones and when it is "Shave Ready"; it can be a handy dandy test.
I think the point has already been made, so I'll beat it to death.
Don't worry about the HHT. For beginners it causes more trouble than almost anything else. They get a razor that's been freshly honed. They try the HHT and it fails IN THEIR HANDS and then try to shave. Since they don't know how to use the the razor yet, they get an awful shave, but because the razor failed the HHT, they blame the blade (and the honer) rather than their inexperience.
BTW, I'm the guy Jimmy was describing. That's right. I admit it. I've got girlie-man arm hair.
The only test that matters is the shave test.Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknbleeding
Any other test is simply a tool that the person honing the razor
can use to aid in the sharpening process.
First tell us how the blade shaves and then
we can help you adjust it.
For any HHT test to return positive the razor must be sharp enough
and the hair has to permit the test to work.
I swipe long black hair from my girlfriends hair brush.
If I hold it one way a razor will pass and if I hold it the other way it will not.
If I oil the blade it will not. If she used a conditioner it will not pass.
Some hair under a microscope looks like the trunk of a palm tree
and some looks smooth and polished. It just depends
on your ancestors and how you care for your hair and skin.
Smooth and polished or moisturized will just bend.
So back to the key question. How does the shave go?
Thank you everyone. I had a feeling that my hair is too fine. That also explaines the shinny head. LOL!
(Joed) Sorry i didnt literally mean everone. Just some people i have talked to.
(utopian) Im not blaming anyone who has honed for me. I have been battleing a Henckles. Feels super sharp then test shave and BLAH!!! Depressing because i havent found a test i can use while honing. It cuts my arm hair at skin level. Feels really sharp on my thumb. But fails when shaving.
Yeah, when I wrote that I was afraid you might think it was directed at you. It absolutely was not. I just used that as an example of how a beginner can mis-use the HHT. My point for you simply was to not worry about the HHT. I'd suggest you try to perfect your TPT instead. If you don't feel any improvement as you move up the hones, maybe your bevel is not fully set. That's by far the biggest problem for getting the hang of honing.Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknbleeding
I agree with the common sentiment, the shave really is the only useful test but my question to most of the honers out there who do lot's 'O razors, how do you grow enough beard to shave test all those St8's????!!!! It seems to me that if you have a really stubern razor, you might run out of beard fairly quickly, wouldn't you???
Just a thought, may all your shaves be BBS!!
tinkersd of SRP!!
I lay out the razors and just do short strokes using the toe, the heel, and the middle for each razor doing both WTG and ATG strokes for each. I try to limit myself to 5 or 6 razors per shave. I'd love to watch Lynn do a shave test some time!Quote:
Originally Posted by tinkersd
For a stubborn razor, meaning if I find one that doesn't shave right, I set it aside for re-honing; or I shave with it again after testing all the others so that I can get a better sense of what's wrong with it.
I just bought a new sportbike. It won't break 200mph. I still know that it is fast though.
I like doing the HHT but only because it is fun. As someone else said, it is a good parlor trick. The test I use, which works for me and has less variables than the HHT, after polishing the blade I run the blade over my lower leg, at about 3mm off the skin, or about half way the length of the hair. If I don't get tiny little pings and cut hairs on the blade, it is usually not there for shaving.
YMMV on this. I have just calibrated this test to suit myself. The HHT will always depend on the hair, where I hold it, etc, etc. My leg hair doesn't change much.
shave ready blade not suppose to pop up the arm hairs.Quote:
Originally Posted by nicknbleeding
shave test is the best test.
gl
+1 on "a presidential shave".Quote:
Originally Posted by Utopian
It works at a lot of levels.
nicknbleeding,
I had the same problem with the first razor I honed (my Dovo Best).
I was driven to distraction with it; finally I said sod it, I am going to shave with it regardless !
Guess what ? The razor shaved perfectly :)
As the previous posters have said, there is only one ultimate test :)
Have fun !
Best regards
Russ
+1 on what Stu said. Can't add more to this
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stubear
I have no idea what you mean.Quote:
Originally Posted by niftyshaving
:thinking:
What the heck is a presidential shave?
If you watch TV video of Obama signing a bill into law you will noticeQuote:
Originally Posted by Utopian
that he uses a handful of pens. It makes for a choppy looking
signature but each pen is engraved and then handed to VIP folk
as mementos of the event.
I think the US presidential record pen count is 22 but
I could be wrong.
So any shave with multiple razors is a "presidential shave".
FWIW: I commonly set out two or three razors when I shave
because I happen to like a fresh sharp edge for the
difficult bits like my chin. Yes, I could just strop it but since
my current ready to go rotation has multiple razors it is
quicker to pick a couple.
Setting out a couple razors is also a working strategy.
When experimenting with honing tricks, a new hone
or strop I set out the experimental razor with a backup
or two. This way I cannot miss.
The beginners out there with one razor should feel that any
single blade solution can serve as a backup. That way they
can do a smooth systematic partial or single pass shave reduction
that is more of a lather removal (i.e. light touch) than anything.
Then tidy up with a lather friendly razor like a Yellow Handle
BiC tossable, a DE or even a Feather Artist club. Having
a backup takes the pressure off in multiple ways.... all puns intended.