HHT = Shave ready? (and shave ready definition)

Hi,

I know a razor can be shave ready without passing the HHT because of all the different hair types there is, but can a razor pass the HHT and NOT be shave ready?

The reason I'm asking is mostly just because I'm curious but also because I'm wondering how much better my razors could be... I recently got an old "Klas Törnblom" when we were cleaning out my grandfathers stuff and got interested in straight razor shaving. So I bought some stones and a strop (and another razor, an old Erik Anton Berg) and started honing. I THINK I got the razors pretty good and shave ready, they pass the HHT with my quite fine hair and I can get a BBS shave (at least I think I can, I don't feel any hair or "ruffness" if i feel with my hand ATG and I believe that's the definition?) except for around the chin but that is probably not the razors fault :p .

Anyway... I guess I just should be happy if I can get (what I think is) a pretty good and comfortable shave. But because of the fact that I have never felt/used a professionally honed razor I'm curious how much better it could be.

I started tis thread to get an answer to a pretty simple question but it kind of turned out to be a long second question about the definition of "shave ready", but I guess I won't get the answer to that one until I get a professionally honed one...

Regards
//Marcus

(I'm sorry if there is any weird spelling or phrasing, I'm from Sweden so English is not my first language)

Sounds like you got the razor sharp enough to shave well ...

The only difference at the upper end of honing is comfort...
Sharp is sharp, sharp and smooth is another step :)

Things will only get better and better the more you practice....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

Sounds like you got the razor sharp enough to shave well ...

The only difference at the upper end of honing is comfort...
Sharp is sharp, sharp and smooth is another step :)

Things will only get better and better the more you practice....

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That's nice to hear and pretty much what I expected :)

But just too satisfy my curiosity... can a NOT shave ready razor pass the HHT in any way?

EDIT: When I think about it i guess that's impossible to say because "shave ready" means different things to different people...?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zippoo

That's nice to hear and pretty much what I expected :)

But just too satisfy my curiosity... can a NOT shave ready razor pass the HHT in any way?

EDIT: When I think about it i guess that's impossible to say because "shave ready" means different things to different people...?

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I think the short answer is that a not shave ready razor can pass the HHT. But the long answer is that that is true because there really is no "the HHT". The HHT is a very personalized, subjective test because we are all dealing with different personal hair types, ways of doing the test itself, and our perceptions of what passes and what fails. With the hair that I use for the HHT, I have not had a blade pass it that doesn't shave well, but that may not hold for you or anyone else because the hair that I use for the test is different from what you will be using, and what I see as a pass may be different for your judgment of it. The HHT is subjective because it is so personal based on hair types and our usage of the test. It is really not so much a "test" as a way of gauging the results of progressive honing. If you can find a way to use it that works for you, that is all that matters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zippoo

Hi,

I know a razor can be shave ready without passing the HHT because of all the different hair types there is, but can a razor pass the HHT and NOT be shave ready?
....snip...

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Possibly.
The HHT is commonly done with a hair from your
head. Whiskers can be much thicker and tougher.

Lathering helps a lot.

Edge quality can also change the shave.
.i.e a slightly different edge finish may shave
better but not do the HHT well. Fans of Belgian-Coticule
as well as fans of Feather DE/Artisin edges can add a lot
more.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ace

I think the short answer is that a not shave ready razor can pass the HHT. But the long answer is that that is true because there really is no "the HHT". The HHT is a very personalized, subjective test because we are all dealing with different personal hair types, ways of doing the test itself, and our perceptions of what passes and what fails. With the hair that I use for the HHT, I have not had a blade pass it that doesn't shave well, but that may not hold for you or anyone else because the hair that I use for the test is different from what you will be using, and what I see as a pass may be different for your judgment of it. The HHT is subjective because it is so personal based on hair types and our usage of the test. It is really not so much a "test" as a way of gauging the results of progressive honing. If you can find a way to use it that works for you, that is all that matters.

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In other words... it's the same as any other test, you always need experience with your own hair, thumb or whatever. That's the annoying thing about all this, until you get a professionally honed one you don't know what a professionally honed one feels like in all your tests. But I'm pretty satisfied with my shaves so far (I've only done 5 so far) so I don't know if I'm curious enough to buy a professionally honed one, I don't really feel that it's necessary. But who knows what the future brings :)

But now it's defiantly time to sleep (4 o'clock in the middle of the night here :P)

yes, there is no standardized absolute test. but if you're happy with how your razor shaves you it's all good. may be it can be better, may be not - at the end of the day it's just shaving and i'd argue that obsessing over it is the abnormal behavior...

A razor can easily pass the HHT and not be shave-ready. As mentioned, the most important variable is smoothness. Beginners have the toughest time maintaining sharpness as they move up in grit too.

The most common cause of this problem, for me, was always ensuring I spent plenty of time on my finishing stone. I was always short changing my finishing stone.

One day, out of curiosity, about 5 years ago, I sat down with a microscope and a Gillette Fusion, or something like that, and decided to spend the time analyzing the difference between my honed blade and one of the five Gillette blades. I figured if it is smooth enough to shave with five of the darn things running down my face, maybe there was something to be learned.

I was very surprised to discover what appeared to be a massive amount of smoothness and a massive amount of "stropping like" texture on the blade, that apparently (to my eye) looked like it was liquid molded.

That day changed a lot of my thoughts on honing and began my success at honing superior shaving edges. Not only have my edges been dramatically better since, but I have also learned that factory bevels aren't so bad and removing steel is a pretty dumb thing to do (although necessary until you learn what you really should be doing).

I took this whole journey out one final step a few years ago and discovered that it was possible to create a decent shaving razor with strop alone off a factory bevel.

Since that day, every time I hear someone pick up a 4K hone, from anywhere in the world, I cringe. ;) I still agree with the mantra to "set your bevel" but I would also add that it might be valuable to figure out whether it's really "unset" before you begin.

"That's the annoying thing about all this, until you get a professionally honed one you don't know what a professionally honed one feels like in all your tests."

No reason to be annoyed by that. If a professionaly honed blade is going to be your standard for sharpness, it's easy enough to send off a razor and have it honed for twenty bucks. Then you have a standard that will bring all the sharpness tests into focus for you. Having a standard is important. Without a standard it's like walking around eating Cheeseburgers all your life and wondering if they're really good just because you've never had a Filet Mignon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AFDavis11

but I have also learned that factory bevels aren't so bad and removing steel is a pretty dumb thing to do (although necessary until you learn what you really should be doing).

I took this whole journey out one final step a few years ago and discovered that it was possible to create a decent shaving razor with strop alone off a factory bevel.

Since that day, every time I hear someone pick up a 4K hone, from anywhere in the world, I cringe. ;) I still agree with the mantra to "set your bevel" but I would also add that it might be valuable to figure out whether it's really "unset" before you begin.

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+1. The above reminded me of what the great jazz saxophonist, Charlie "Yardbird" Parker is reputed to have said, "Master your instrument, then forget all that stuff and play." (he didn't say "stuff"BTW:o)

In the beginning everything I honed went 1k, 4k, 8k,whether it needed it or not. I probably did more strokes, with more pressure, than necessary. Now, with a new or close to it, razor, I will start with magnification. If there is no chipping I will go to a finisher and do light , weight of the blade, strokes and strop and try. Sometimes that is all it takes. Referring to a smooth shaving edge. May or may not get HHT with my hair. Some do some don't.