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I am looking for a polishing hone. I was thinking a Translucent Arkansas would do the jog and even stand up to sharpening chisels and gravers, where a water stone would tend to grove. I can not find a comparison of behavior / performance of this hone and a 12000 / 15000 water hone. Can any one inform me?:thinking:
The translucent Arkansas stones are rated at approx 1200 grit.
Yes, twelve hundred grit. In the str8 razor world these are regarded as a coarse stone that is suitable for edge creation and minor nick removal. That is if you have the patience.
There are a few guys who actually shave with that coarse of an edge but since there are much better stones why bother with the Arkansas. A very hard natural stone that is in the 10K-12K
range is the Chinese blue stone available at Woodcraft for about $35. Another option is the Spyderco ceramic Ultra-fine hone for about the same price. The Spyderco is the hardest of the two but both will work for your needs. Be sure and knock off the high points on The Spyderco before using it on razors. That includes the edge of the hone also.
Hope this helps,:)
I am one of those that did use an Arkansas: I started straight razor shaving from scratch, had no reliable info. about anything until I joined SRP. I just bought a Thuringer and got faster and better results than ever with my surgical black Arkansas. I don't have a translucent Arkansas which I understand is a bit finer than a surgical black.
I won't be using the Arkansas any more for razors.
With all due respect, Randy, this 'numerical' evaluation is problematic for two reasons:Quote:
Originally Posted by randydance062449
1. The 1200 grit quoted above probably refers to the American CAMI scale. We here at SRP usually grade abrasives by the Japanes JIS scale. If you convert it, the Arkansas would be guaranteed to be around 3000 japanese grit or higher.
2. It just feels finer than 1200. My translucent Arkansas is smooth as glass. It feels smoother than my 4000 Norton for sure. Well, I know that my hands are no precision instruments, but they can give you a clear indication.
As for the edge it produces... well, that's the problem, I haven't done a proper comparison with other hones, yet, because I don't have the patience. It just cuts soooo sloooow.
Redwoood
On this site we use both the Cami/ANSI and JIS along with a number of other standards. The grit rating I used came from a Norton comparitive grit scale that is still floating around here somewhere. Yes, I know that the Arkansas stones are graded quite differently, I believe they use a specific gravity measure.
I have tried to use the Arkansas stones in the past and yes they do feel very fine to the touch but the edge that results from their use is not nearly as sharp.
I am obligated to try the Arkansas stones one more time in the near future just to satisfy another Str8 user who has used them for many years on his razors. I will post the results when I am done. However, I am not looking forward to the shave.
I brought my first razor up to snuff using a soft white Arkansas and finishing with a Surgical Black Arkansas. It took a LOOOOOOONG time. However, the edge produced is better than anything I've ever been able to produce with the 8K side of my Norton (not up to par with a coticule or pasted strop, but shave ready none the less).
Just another data point,
Ed
I have read in some of the woodworking sites that the arkansas stones produce a much more refined edge than the specs. would indicate. The major disadvantage that everyone mentions with the Arkansas stones is just what the Prof stated,'It took a loooong time.' Some woodworkers use nothing but the Arkansas stones as they 'claim' the edge cuts smoother and lasts longer. I couldn't say who is right yet. Just do whatever blows your skirt up. Let us know what works for you.
Rex
Like most SRP members, the majority of my newer customers are purchasing the 4K/8K waterstones for honing their straight razors, but sales of the 3x8 hard translucent arks are at an all time high. Prior posts are correct about the grit comparision confusion. The hard translucent ark is rated 4000 on the JIS scale but 2000 on the CAMI. You can access a copy of the Norton grit comparison chart on my website at http://vintagebladesllc.com/docs/Grit%20Chart.htm. If for some reason this link does not work, go to my home page at http://vintagebladesllc.com and look for the link there. Hope this helps.
Jim
I've got a 3x4 translucent arkansas on order that I plan to try with water, it should arrive any day now.
My current honing chain is 4k norton, 8k norton, 8k shapton, 15k shapton, then finish with the King barber hone, although obviously this whole chain is only really used for ebay treasures; ordinary refreshes are done with the King hone. The King hone is wierd, when I got it off of ebay it had a matte finish and looked like any other barber hone, but when I lapped it on 600 grit wet/dry it developed a shine, it looks almost like a piece of polished travertine now. It is a very slow cutter, I could probably skip the 8k shapton (which seems considerably finer than the 8k norton) and go straight to the 15k but I definitely can't skip the 15k shapton or the king will never finish. I'm planning to slot in the translucent arkansas after the king, and maybe as a replacement for the king if it works well and is fast enough. We'll see. So far, I get better shaves if I avoid the really fine grits; I fell in love with the king the first time I refreshed a blade with it instead of unlimbering the 15k shapton or paddle.
Ok, I got the 4x3x1/2 hone this evening. It is the fairly rare pink translucent which seems to have the reputation as the finest grit of the translucents. It feels very fine, much finer than my 15k Shapton, and somewhat finer than the lily translucent in my lansky kit and seems noticeably finer than the few blacks I've handled. The norton chart claims that translucent arkansas is approximately 4k JIS and 2k CAMI. Handamerican claims it's around 8k grit, but I have no idea where they got that information. Regardless, the arkansas has the reputation of punching well above its weight class as long you've got enough spare time.
I've been using the 7/8 Heljestrand all this week, and I gave it 30 laps on the new stone using water as lubricant. The King edge toppled arm hairs with ease before, and the new arkansas edge still does. I'll see how the shave goes in the morning. The King hone is capable of getting the razor sharper than I like: I normally dial it back a bit to reduce the odds of nicking myself at 6am. So it doesn't matter if this razor is sharper than it was before, though I really doubt that it's less sharp now. I'm more interested in how the shallow and wide serrations shave, and how the edge degrades over the next 5 or 6 days (some of the woodcarving guys claim that the arkansas edge is more durable than the waterstone edge). The 3" width makes it easier to use than the little 1.5x4 King hone which is also nice, and since the King hone is a very slow cutter the Arkansas doesn't suffer by comparison there.