Finishing with an 8K Naniwa

I have been experimenting a lot with my finishers and honing technique recently. I was using the 8K Naniwa SS as my main reference point, prior to the different finishers I was testing, when it accrued to me that I've never shaved with a razor that was only honed to 8K. I've always "felt" that the razor was shave ready coming off of the 8K, but had never actually shaved straight from it. As that 8K seems to be the "Bench Mark" or of shave readiness, I knew that this had to be remedied.
All I can say is WOW. It was a really Darn Fine Shave. I was very impressed with how smooth it was. Now, I normally finish with either a 12K SS, a Y/G Thuringian or a coticule and this was certainly not as nice as any of those, but it wasn't as far behind them as I expected it to be. I can honestly say that If I didn't have a hone any finer then the 8k Nani SS that I would still be able to get a great quality shave.
I will be shaving with this razor for a week to see how the shaves are. I have been meaning to get the Norton water stones but life keeps getting in the way. I should have them in the next few weeks and I'll then try to compare the Norton 8K to the Nani 8K. By the grit comparison charts the Norton 8000 is closer to the Naniwa 5K, does anyone know if the performance of these to is indicative of the grit charts?

BTW I felt an earth quake for the first time in my life as I was posting this. I live in NC and have never felt one before. It was the 5.9 that was 85 miles from DC. I thought the dog was trying to get his ball from under the couch until I saw him walking across the floor. I also saw the strops I had hanging under the mantle swinging back and forth slightly. Though it was very subtle it's still amazing as I live all the way on the coast.


Sean

On the subject of the norton 8k being closer to a SS 5k, i dunno, but the best piece of advice i had was to put the 12k away until i get a shave ready edge off the norton 8k, which i was (eventually) able to do, and that was a nice comfy edge, so the SS8k must feel very nice indeed

Putting this nicely...

The grit charts are pretty much useless :) so is comparing grit numbers between brands and sometimes even types of hones within a brand...

I do "Know" that a Naniwa SS 8k is more fine than the Naniwa SS 5k and less fine than the Naniwa SS 10k other than that I wouldn't bet a wooden nickel on the accuracy of any grit comparison chart I have ever read...

Even when you compare a Naniwa Chosera 10k to the Naniwa SS 10k I could not for sure tell you that the grit matches :(

As too the 8k shaves, yes that is a good benchmark to a finishing gateway, If you can produce a Comfortable shaving edge consistently on the Norton, Shapton, or the Naniwa SS chances are that buying a Natural or a High grit finisher is actually going to do you some good...

Congrats on achieving that :tu

I agree on the different "grit" rating on the various mfg's obviously being different. I do know that the Naniwa SS's, Chosera's, and Shapton GS's feel different on the stone. It would be interesting to their scratch marks under real magnification. Wouldn't change how I use them, but would be interesting none the less.

I too put my finishers aside at the recommendation of a master honer about a year & a half ago until I was consistently getting good shaves off the 8K of either of my sets of stones (Nani SS's & Shapton GS's). At the time it was only the Shapton GS's. Taking that step back did help me to focus & my knowledge/application to improve. These guys that have been at it a while seem to know a thing or two...

When I hone With my naniwas I always stop at the 8k and shave my sideburns area dry. If I get no irrataion and tugging there , I know it's in a good spot. Then usually finish with the 12k and some crox

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

Putting this nicely...

The grit charts are pretty much useless :) so is comparing grit numbers between brands and sometimes even types of hones within a brand...

I do "Know" that a Naniwa SS 8k is more fine than the Naniwa SS 5k and less fine than the Naniwa SS 10k other than that I wouldn't bet a wooden nickel on the accuracy of any grit comparison chart I have ever read...

Even when you compare a Naniwa Chosera 10k to the Naniwa SS 10k I could not for sure tell you that the grit matches :(

As too the 8k shaves, yes that is a good benchmark to a finishing gateway, If you can produce a Comfortable shaving edge consistently on the Norton, Shapton, or the Naniwa SS chances are that buying a Natural or a High grit finisher is actually going to do you some good...

Congrats on achieving that :tu

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by shooter74743

I agree on the different "grit" rating on the various mfg's obviously being different. I do know that the Naniwa SS's, Chosera's, and Shapton GS's feel different on the stone. It would be interesting to their scratch marks under real magnification. Wouldn't change how I use them, but would be interesting none the less.

I too put my finishers aside at the recommendation of a master honer about a year & a half ago until I was consistently getting good shaves off the 8K of either of my sets of stones (Nani SS's & Shapton GS's). At the time it was only the Shapton GS's. Taking that step back did help me to focus & my knowledge/application to improve. These guys that have been at it a while seem to know a thing or two...

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Thank you for the congrats. I never found the grit comparisons charts to be very useful either, as there are just too many variables from one system to the next with all the abrasives and the binders. I was actually taking photos (funny that shooter mentioned that) with my 400x veho and became curious about how the Norton and the Super Stones compared (or differed). I've only been honing straights since the end of last year. I started with diamond stones, 3M lapping film, and pasted strops for the first couple of months. I was able to get a "passable" shave after about two weeks. Not great, but not gouging my face either. My knife sharpening experience was a big help but I still had a significant learning curve to navigate. I lucked into finding a vintage Y/G thuringian in december and the quality of my shaves jumped up significantly. In february of this year I bought the 1, 5, 8, 12K Nani SS's and cHrOx. That helped me have a another increase in the quality of my shaves, but still felt that there was just that last little bit of "Keenness, smoothness, comfort" missing between the razors I'd hone and the ones professionally honed for me. I finally talked to Lynn Abrams on the phone one day, maybe three weeks later, for about an hour. If there was one quality piece of advice I could guarantee to help someone new to honing, it would be to talk to a real professional. This Great website helped me to hone a nice shave-able razor, Lynn helped me to hone a Great Shaving razor. Please don't misunderstand me, I don't believe my knowledge, experience, or consistency to be even remotely comparable to any of the more experienced Honers here (or anywhere). I'm just doing this for my own benefit, It's my hobby and It's my own face that I need to pay attention too. But I really, really enjoy honing and I also seem to be catching a case of HAD that my wife has managed to keep in check (barely). I have used diamond pastes and sprays all the way up to 1/8 micron, and though I really liked the results (except .0125") I just prefer either my Thuringian or Coticule as my finisher. I am really starting to like my Arkansas stones' finish here lately, but I know I still don't have them completely figured out yet. I do seem to love my natural stones but I am not prejudiced against synthetics. I will get the Norton's in a couple of weeks and then complete my Super Stone set after that, then I hope to get the full shapton ceramic on glass for christmas.
Though I'm very satisfied with my on abilities, I just can't seem to stop experimenting and trying to learn more. I just thought that it was pretty sad of me using all the different finishers I was and comparing them to each other when I had not even experienced and evaluated my own 8K finish. I do feel relieved that it was a good, close, comfortable shave. Today's shave was just as good too.

Glenn, I owe you a sincere thanks for all of your posts that I've read here. I've learned so much from you and others here on SRP that I would likely have given up on straights long ago without all the help.

Shooter, Here is a Picture of the 8K bevel before stropping taken with the veho right before my first shave.
Attachment 76725
After first shave
Attachment 76726
I know these pictures don't tell us a lot about anything, I just think they're cool. I actually plan on putting all the photos into a big post detailing what I was doing just because I love seeing pictures. Unfortunately it takes a little time to set up the microscope for every picture. When you are doing a hundred or more pictures it takes days or maybe weeks to find the time. But I will find it here and there, eventually.

Thanks for reading this far,
Sean

Cool pics and it sounds like you either are well on your way to being a good honer or already are and you're just humble. Either way, love your attitude. I know that I am learning continually from the new and old guys on the forum.

I guess what I was getting at was it would be cool to see two razors of the same mfg/steel, one honed on a shapton gs progression to 8K and a razor honed on a naniwa ss progression to 8K to see the difference in the scratch patterns between the two stones.

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Originally Posted by shooter74743

Cool pics and it sounds like you either are well on your way to being a good honer or already are and you're just humble. Either way, love your attitude. I know that I am learning continually from the new and old guys on the forum.

I guess what I was getting at was it would be cool to see two razors of the same mfg/steel, one honed on a shapton gs progression to 8K and a razor honed on a naniwa ss progression to 8K to see the difference in the scratch patterns between the two stones.

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Thank you.

I think I'm just well on my way. Though I can achieve an edge that feels the same "to my limited experienced face" as those that are professionally honed, I don't always get it the first try. And when it comes to problem razors that have those issues that complicate honing i.e. big smiles, funky grinds, warped spines it often takes me many tries to figure them out. Actually, I am trying to hone an old Wostie full wedge for a friend that keeps kicking my rear. I'm sure that a lot of guys here wouldn't have any issues with it but this thing just keeps wooping me. I do enjoy the challenge though, it's the only way to learn. If it all was just that simple I wouldn't have been interested I'm sure.

As to the Microscope photos, I was actually doing that exact thing with comparing all my hones and wishing that I had the Nortons to compare to the Naniwas Shaptons would be nice too. Nipper kindly offered to let me use his Norton 8K for comparison. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for my birthday in a couple of weeks before I take him up on that very kind offer. This forum really does have some of the kindest and most helpful people you could ever hope to know.

Here's the Naniwa 8K Super Stones and the Dragon's Tongue as an example of what I've been trying to do. I intend to start a new thread with all the photos from the different hones I used. I'm not able to actually glean a lot of information from them yet, and I may never be able to, but I guess I need to learn that too. It's still really fun to do it and that's all I need.
8K SS
Attachment 76810
Dragon's Tongue
Attachment 76809

BTW, Hurricane Irene is now forecasted to make landfall directley over my house on Saturday. We had an Earthquake on Tuesday and a Cat. 3 hurricane on Saturday. What a week ,huh? With the Toranado that half destroyed the subdivision 3 miles to the north in april, I just may need to consider moving. I'm not too woried about huricanes though. I grew up in florida and this is about the 15th Ive been through. It will be the 4th or 5th Cat. 3 I've been through. Unfortunately having kids changes things and I'm sending my wife and kids to Tennesse. Anything stronger than a 2 is where we draw the line when our children are involved.
Attachment 76811

Just protect your family, nothing else really matters...hope to hear from you on Sunday.

Stay safe,,, we want more pics :) I have got to get me one of those micro-camera dohickythingies :)

And BTW Big Ole Anything Wedges are just a ton of work, you have to work through all the old honing to sort out the edge if you want them right...