Here is the important difference between letting a razor and knife go too long between honings…Quote:
Originally Posted by mdeamicis
Only one of them is being dragged across your face!
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Here is the important difference between letting a razor and knife go too long between honings…Quote:
Originally Posted by mdeamicis
Only one of them is being dragged across your face!
Dragging sounds like there's some pressure involved? Am I missing something here. I thought no pressure was the big secret.Quote:
Originally Posted by Utopian
Yes, that was a lazy choice of words on my part. The razor should only lightly skim the face. The appropriate expression is that you should shave the lather, not the skin.
OK, the yucksters have taken over the forums, and more of the senior mentors and moderators are gone for this one.
I miswrote something and it flew way out of hand. I'm not going to quote my own miswritten line, but here's my last chance to ask my question correctly.
In the time when tape did not exist, were there any techniques that were employed to hone a razor that resemble what tape does when honing? Okay?
I was merely imagining the first guy that went to tape. The day before he used tape, was he wrapping the body of the blade with string? I found the measurements of coins. Did any shaver ever rest a blade on coins to push them? I know protractors have been around since Jesus' dad used 'em...so, you can "see" the 15-17 degrees - but were all the generations of men since, PERFECTLY steady-handed to not use anything at all to achieve a "perfect" shaving angle? More than likely not. They didn't use tape, because it didn't exist. ---> SO what do YOU think was employed to hone that "perfect" angle?
I actually think that they just honed them with the spine exposed. The thing is that back then razors were just tools, nothing more.Quote:
Originally Posted by ItalianBarber77
Today they have become precious family heirlooms. In addition back then they were not digging up 150 year old razors and trying to nurse them back to life. Also I think that many men would have bought their razors shave ready and then taken it to their local barber who simply refreshed them on his hone a couple of times a month rather than them being hobby shavers like we are today.
This is probably why, when we do find vintage razors they often exhibit signs of hone wear too.
A correctly honed good quality razor can be maintained with just a leather and linen strop for 50 + shaves in the right hands, one of the things that interested me when I started out.
A few laps on a barber hone, escher or coticule would quickly bring them back to shave ready, minimising wear on the spine.
Pastes for strops using compounds as various as lead, chalk and even ash have been around as long as razors themselves.
The reason for using tape is to preserve, maintain and be able to shave with what are quite often rare and valuable items.
Excuse my ignorance, but what's a yuckster?
As Porl said, most back in the day went and had their razors touched up by a barber. A man who knew how to freshen up an edge in a minute or two. But it was done on a higher grit stone. Hence no scratches on the spine.
The tape came along to protect the spine for us that are not professionals. So we don't leave deep hone gouges on the spine when we reset the bevel and work up through the progression of stones.
It keeps the angle in the proper degree area.
But it can also sometimes need to be a few layers. Depending on the degradation of the razor.
As to what was employed to hone that perfect angle, craftsmen with a TON of experience!!! Then as was said, just touching it up after that. There was no restoration back when they were made
My original comment, eluded to professional sharpeners, and they were everywhere, and some that traveled. They would repair razors that had been damaged, regrind ones that were badly worn, and do it all with minimal wear. If you look around here, you will find new guys that bought into the nomtape theory before their first honing, then stuffed one or more perfectly good razors trying to figure out how to hone. Without having training or jobsite mentors and using internet videos you can get on the wrong foot super fast. There is a lot more to the technique than rubbing a razor on a stone. It is kind of like playing a musical instrument, in that there is a little more going on than strumming and fingering a keyboard. Once someone really gets the hang of honing and understands torque and wear, tape is optional. Up until that point you are literally putting decades of premature wear on razors. It is not rocket science, but the is a little to be learned.
I truly appreciate your kind words and thank you for joining the discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Porl
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Thank you for coming back to the discussion and sharing what you have said. I'm not a honemeister, nor do I purport to be one, and I have been in the shaving enthusiasm for about 10 years...collecting good quality and vintage razors over that time...When I found the forums for discussions on all things shaving, I have simply never seen any discussion regarding the Pre-tape Era which has always interested my curiosity when it comes to restoration of the tool.Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
Thanks for your time.
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Really ???? never seen a discussion ???Quote:
Originally Posted by ItalianBarber77
http://straightrazorpalace.com/advan...honed-day.html
That is is just one, by simply doing a simple search on here you can find Dozens on that topic,, and 100's about Taping and the general aspects
Hence the "Dead Horse" emoji posted when it started again
Now if you want a re-hash that is fine, but trust me there are quite a few well done threads about it that will bring a ton of ideas to the convo
Aloha!
I'm a real babe in the woods when it comes to Honing as I've only just started. But from all the videos I watched and all the discussion I read about this subject here, there and everywhere on the internet, I decided to tape my razors EXCEPT for the Gold Dollar, my very first honing practice razor. Many of the articles I read and some of the guys I saw in vids recommended not to tape a Gold Dollar in order to get the bevel set correctly. And since I got the cheap Gold Dollar for free when I bought my travel strop (it was included as a free gift for buying the strop), what do I really care about the spine anyway?
So I'm taping my spines. I'm way too new to honing to worry about the nuances of tape VS no tape at present. Perhaps in a year or two I will have the honing knowledge to know what I don't even know I don't know now. :)
-Zip
As soon as I saw the title and noted the last post was from Glen...Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
I KNEW GLEN WOULD BE KEEPING IT REAL!
Wow. Honestly, I am a good deal embarrassed. Thanks for your help! I guess I was never putting in the right search words to come up with anything pre-tape.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
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Well to the troll, or whoever wants to know, tape is just a tool use it r not, but in the old days they just ground the hell out of their razors and we are fixing the geometry issue by using a tool at our disposal. And wth all the guys getting into the honing craze they tend to over home and he tape saves what is a nice razor , not to mention the custom razors that you would like to protect. In the old days they didn't have cars and planes either. It's called progress. End of explanation. TcQuote:
Originally Posted by ItalianBarber77
To add why I like to use tape when it is not really necessary.
Aside from protecting the spine, I like to feel and hear the edge on the stone and not the spine. Simple as that.
YMMV
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
I'm with Tom I tape everything and a pet hate of mine I really dislike the sound of a untaped spine on the hones I personally like and use the feedback I pick up from just the bevel.