New Guy, New Razor, Same Old Story!

Just thought I'd introduce myself. I've been interested in straight razors for a few months now and I finally took the plunge last night. I know most of the experienced guys will say I went about it all wrong - I bought a "shave ready" ebay razor. It's a F.W. Engels "Special". I paid about $35 shipped (OK deal?) Hopefully it actually IS shave ready, but if not, I don't mind getting it there.

There's NO way I could convince my wife that spending $100 on a razor is a good idea. BUT, if I buy a $35 one, then nickle and dime her to death getting it in good condition, she won't really notice. ;) Plus, I'm a big DIY guy, and I really like old stuff. I also have quite a bit of sharpening experience, and even a little knife-making experience. I've also done a fair amount of leather work, and I plan to delve into the strop-making threads more later.

So, speaking of old stuff, does anybody know much about this model razor? From what I can gather, F.W. Engels was in business from 1909-1943ish. Do any of you know when the "Special" was manufactured during that time period?

I have never owned one but have heard really good things about them. Some, maybe the 'Special' have been called 'Singing Engels' due (I think) to the fine grind of the blade. Its a German made razor and Germans are known for making quality items. Depending on condition of your razor it should turn out to be a good one but without pics its hard to tell. If you can post some pics others will chime in with info. Here on SRP we Love pics!

Big word of caution. Despite ANY of your sharpening experience, razors are to knives like the distance from Earth to Alpha Centari. Read the Library section on honing and better yet, find a Mentor near you that can give you a one-on-one session on shaving and honing. In the search box at the top of that page enter Local Help and click on the first post listed. By states and countries are the Mentors listed.

If your razor shows up shave ready and in good condition you will have been very lucky. Honing is best left to those who already know for a little while. Hopefully you will be able to figure out if you do have a shave ready blade. I would start by watching a few videos, and member check to see if any of the members are near you. One on one is worth while. Happy shaving!

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Originally Posted by DoughBoy68

Here on SRP we Love pics!

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Here's some from the ebay listing (Credits to
johnloc1 on ebay):

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Originally Posted by Razorfeld

Big word of caution. Despite ANY of your sharpening experience, razors are to knives like the distance from Earth to Alpha Centari. Read the Library section on honing and better yet, find a Mentor near you that can give you a one-on-one session on shaving and honing. In the search box at the top of that page enter Local Help and click on the first post listed. By states and countries are the Mentors listed.

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Don't, worry, I'm not going to jump and and start grinding on it any time soon. I don't even have a suitable stone. IF I get around to doing my own honing, I'll have done lots of research, and only if I feel comfortable in my ability to to it will I proceed. I'm new to razors, but I'm very much a perfectionist. And I like learning new things.

the over all condition looks ok. They are not the most revealing pictures. I would try some non destructive sharp test when it arrives. I guess what I'm trying to say is avoid things like the thumb nail test. Check to see if you can waft off some arm hair with touching the skin. If it can do that you should be off to the races. Truly shave ready razors off eBay does happen, so you may be very lucky. We have all made fun of ads for "shave ready" that obviously were not.

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Originally Posted by RezDog

We have all made fun of ads for "shave ready" that obviously were not.

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I'd done enough research beforehand to know that the "shave ready" part might be a stretch. I bought this one because, from what I'd read, it's a decent razor, and it appeared to be in good enough condition to be salvageable (to my untrained eye, at least).

Anyway, I know just enough to know that I know nothing about razors. And, I'll reiterate about the honing, I won't do it unless I feel comfortable. After my research, if I decide it's over my head, I'll have it professionally honed.

Looks good but how will "you know it's shave ready "? That's why everyone is saying to get it honed by someone who knows , knife sharp and razor sharp are night and day, if your going to shave with it you need to be a perfectionist in technique so give yourself a chance at success ,, you'll be way ahead starting right , after that then learn how to hone walk before run, a perfectionist would do it that way. Good luck. The razor should be a good one. Tc

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Originally Posted by tcrideshd

Looks good but how will "you know it's shave ready "?

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If it won't shave, I'm going to assume it isn't shave ready. Haha.

Seriously guys, I've got this. I'm reasonably intelligent. If the razor won't shave, I'll figure out if I can hone it, or I'll find someone who can. I've been watching honing videos, and frankly, it looks pretty straight forward. I've done enough to know that learning the technique (pressure, etc.) will be the trick. If I have to, I'll go to a junk store and find a junk razor to practice on. And, I'm not above learning from others.

Anyway, honing isn't really even my concern yet. I have a million other things to learn. Once the razor arrives, I'll go from there.

eminart,

eBay is notorious for lofty descriptions and false claims of "shave ready." By Jove, I have yet to find a straight razor on eBay that is actually shave ready. I bought an eBay razor that the seller described as in "mint" condition and shave ready. I knew that to be far from the truth, but I wanted that specific razor.

When it arrived, as I had guessed, the razor was neither in "mint" condition nor shave ready. What's more, the edge had chips and nicks up and down. I wrote the seller and pointed out the problems with his razor, adding, "Didn't you examine the edge under a scope while honing?" He said he didn't, but insisted that his razor was shave ready.

Whatever . . .

So you see, in some circles, shave ready is a lofty statement with no support.

F.W. Engels is a fine razor, and yours looks okay, but I can only guess from your opaque photos.

If I may suggest, forget about honing now and concentrate on honing your skill with the straight razor. Also, learn how to strop properly. Send the razor out to a professional to hone and start on the right foot.

Hey, Em.
Welcome.

The finest extra hollow shave I've ever had was from an Engels 'Leader'. It was fantastic. So even if you have to buy some experienced help - it will likely be well rewarded.

When I started here, I was skeptical about how consistent the recommendations were for getting pro help on edges. That led me to do as you suggest - roll my own. This is how I got the name Pinklather - no explanation needed. Shaves could be done, but a bloodless shave was the exception. It was not a relaxing experience, but a challenge. When I tried my first smooth edge, it was a game changer.

Disrespecting your prowess w/ a knife edge isn't involved. I guarantee you have forgotten more about a knife edge than I'll ever know. But a knife edge only has to be sharp. A razor that is *only* sharp is a recipe for carnage - or pinklather.

To investigate and believe your own eyes, take another razor (not that wonderful Engels) and a kitchen scale that you can zero w/ the weight of a stone on it. Lay the blade on the stone while holding the blade at the shank, just ahead of the scales or pivot. It'll prob. read 5/8-3/4 oz. If you can consistently stroke while keeping the entire edge in contact w/ the stone with your highest spike of pressure staying under 1.5oz (3/4 oz blade weight + 3/4 oz honing pressure), you stand a chance. You'll find it easier said than done. You'll get there - and surely alot faster than I did. But it won't be today.

4 yrs & 470 blades later, I'm not skeptical about what I was first told. You'll find the guys WANT to help you fall in love w/ your shaves. If I can be of help in that effort, pls. let me know.

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Originally Posted by pinklather

Hey, Em.
Welcome.

The finest extra hollow shave I've ever had was from an Engels 'Leader'. It was fantastic. So even if you have to buy some experienced help - it will likely be well rewarded.

When I started here, I was skeptical about how consistent the recommendations were for getting pro help on edges. That led me to do as you suggest - roll my own. This is how I got the name Pinklather - no explanation needed. Shaves could be done, but a bloodless shave was the exception. It was not a relaxing experience, but a challenge. When I tried my first smooth edge, it was a game changer.

Disrespecting your prowess w/ a knife edge isn't involved. I guarantee you have forgotten more about a knife edge than I'll ever know. But a knife edge only has to be sharp. A razor that is *only* sharp is a recipe for carnage - or pinklather.

To investigate and believe your own eyes, take another razor (not that wonderful Engels) and a kitchen scale that you can zero w/ the weight of a stone on it. Lay the blade on the stone while holding the blade at the shank, just ahead of the scales or pivot. It'll prob. read 5/8-3/4 oz. If you can consistently stroke while keeping the entire edge in contact w/ the stone with your highest spike of pressure staying under 1.5oz (3/4 oz blade weight + 3/4 oz honing pressure), you stand a chance. You'll find it easier said than done. You'll get there - and surely alot faster than I did. But it won't be today.

4 yrs & 470 blades later, I'm not skeptical about what I was first told. You'll find the guys WANT to help you fall in love w/ your shaves. If I can be of help in that effort, pls. let me know.

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Hahaha.

I don't mean to seem as if I'm dismissing any of the advice. I'm not. I believe all of you. I'm also very stubborn and overconfident in my abilities, usually. Plus, I like the process of learning new things more than having learned new things or HAVING new things. But, upon looking at the prices of 4k/8k/12k stones, I very likely will subcontract out at least my first honing, assuming (likely) that I need one.

We'll see. Right now, I'm just excited to be getting new stuff. I'm not even that concerned about shaving with it yet. Hell, I rarely shave anyway.

There's alot of fun to be had, Eminart. 'Good to have you.

Hi and welcome. Shaved on the weekend with a Engel for the first time. Was a small wedge and wad a great shaver. Hope yours works out well

Thanks for the replies, everyone. My razor and supplies arrived today.

The razor will indeed shave, and the edge looks good to me - no visible nicks or anything. But, it's not "shave ready" as everyone suspected would be the case. I had to try it out, of course. I learned three things:

1. Shave ready is undoubtably more comfortable than not shave ready.
2. Wet badger hair smells like wet badgers.
3. The shave soap I got free from my wife's friend who makes soaps isn't going to cut it.

I really had planned to do more studying before attempting to shave but the razor arrived a day earlier than expected along with my brush and soap bowl. So I had to give it a try. I keep a full beard, so I was mostly shaving neck area, which I know isn't a beginner's area. My soap dries too fast. And my edge needs some work. But I managed to scrape off quite a bit of hair without cutting myself. So, I consider day one a success even if I did finish up with a Mach 3.

A shot of my new gear.
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The brush odor will go away. Faster is to shampoo it. The soap might need more working with more water added a little at a time. Sounds like it should be whipped up in a bowl, or big coffee mug or soup bowl. (I hunt Goodwill for fun bowls/mugs to lather in - my addiction).

Type Local Help in upper right search box,Click on first post shown. List of Mentors in the States and countries around the world. Any Mentor near you would be happy to help you get a shaveable edge on the razor.

Ask questions and read the FAQ section in the Library for answers you didn't know you needed.

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Originally Posted by pinklather

Hey, Em.
Welcome.

The finest extra hollow shave I've ever had was from an Engels 'Leader'. It was fantastic. So even if you have to buy some experienced help - it will likely be well rewarded.

When I started here, I was skeptical about how consistent the recommendations were for getting pro help on edges. That led me to do as you suggest - roll my own. This is how I got the name Pinklather - no explanation needed. Shaves could be done, but a bloodless shave was the exception. It was not a relaxing experience, but a challenge. When I tried my first smooth edge, it was a game changer.

Disrespecting your prowess w/ a knife edge isn't involved. I guarantee you have forgotten more about a knife edge than I'll ever know. But a knife edge only has to be sharp. A razor that is *only* sharp is a recipe for carnage - or pinklather.

To investigate and believe your own eyes, take another razor (not that wonderful Engels) and a kitchen scale that you can zero w/ the weight of a stone on it. Lay the blade on the stone while holding the blade at the shank, just ahead of the scales or pivot. It'll prob. read 5/8-3/4 oz. If you can consistently stroke while keeping the entire edge in contact w/ the stone with your highest spike of pressure staying under 1.5oz (3/4 oz blade weight + 3/4 oz honing pressure), you stand a chance. You'll find it easier said than done. You'll get there - and surely alot faster than I did. But it won't be today.

4 yrs & 470 blades later, I'm not skeptical about what I was first told. You'll find the guys WANT to help you fall in love w/ your shaves. If I can be of help in that effort, pls. let me know.

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That's a good idea, and one I have never heard before. Good thinking pink.

It COULD also be a bit of technique, not saying definitively as the edge quality could be questionable too.

Ed speaks the truth. Proper prep, lather, stropping, blade angle and technique should be mastered before any razor is pronounced not shave ready. Be sure you have the I's dotted and the T's crossed before you pronounce judgement. We have seen many here complain of a bad experience with professional edges. Some from those we know. Gotta do the homework! Many sellers on Ebay provide excellent shavers. Honing the razor is one thing. Using, quite another.

You guys are gonna have to make up your minds. First the razor will almost definitely need a professional hone job, then when I agree, you decide it's probably just my bad technique. :D

But, no, the razor needs some stropping at the very least. I've been shaving long enough and dealing with blades long enough to know when one isn't sharp enough for the job. I'm going to do some reading before I decide my plan of action.

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Originally Posted by eminart

You guys are gonna have to make up your minds. First the razor will almost definitely need a professional hone job, then when I agree, you decide it's probably just my bad technique. :D

But, no, the razor needs some stropping at the very least. I've been shaving long enough and dealing with blades long enough to know when one isn't sharp enough for the job. I'm going to do some reading before I decide my plan of action.

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Keep in mind, you asked,. My mind has no need to be made. This is yours' we speak of. Only YOU know of your technique, certainly no one else. Don't ask if you have it handled. Just do it! You obviously know what is best! Best of luck! :gl:

Congrats on taking the plunge. I hope you will enjoy everything about this craft. I just trim in and out of the beard now and I really enjoy this stuff. You sound like me in several ways as far as wanting to do everything on your own. It is very satisfying when done right. One small tip I will give you is to take it very slowly. Enjoy the ride and DO NOT try to catch your razor if you drop it and let wife or whatever know when you are shaving, because if you jump or jerk, well... you can guess what happens. Good luck and be careful and I hope you enjoy it.

Sorry for the confusion on shave ready/not ready, there have been countless posts from new users who get shave ready razors and complain their first shave was terrible only to come back several shaves later with much better shaves with the same razor. Angle, prep, pressure and stropping are all learned tasks and it takes a bit to bring it all together. If it will cut hair above the skin it is probably in the ballpark. You will get there, usually somewhere around 15-20 shaves it will start to really all come together

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Originally Posted by eminart

You guys are gonna have to make up your minds. First the razor will almost definitely need a professional hone job, then when I agree, you decide it's probably just my bad technique. :D

But, no, the razor needs some stropping at the very least. I've been shaving long enough and dealing with blades long enough to know when one isn't sharp enough for the job. I'm going to do some reading before I decide my plan of action.

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I don't think I was in the blunt razor camp actually. And whilst a lot of the supposedly shave ready ebay razors are supposedly not I am sure that all aren't.
So how is your technique?

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Originally Posted by sharptonn

Keep in mind, you asked,. My mind has no need to be made. This is yours' we speak of. Only YOU know of your technique, certainly no one else. Don't ask if you have it handled. Just do it! You obviously know what is best! Best of luck! :gl:

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First of all, I'd like to say, that I don't think my light-hearted tone and jokes are coming across well in writing. I do appreciate all the advice here. But, actually, no, I DIDN'T ask. I think the only question I've asked in this thread is if anyone knows anything about the razor I bought. I realize that the answers to all my questions are probably already here on the forum. So, when I have a specific question, I'll search for the answer. And I know I have a lot to learn. But, you guys are assuming I'm asking questions, which is fine. Just don't pretend it's me that isn't listening.

Again, I don't want to come across as a know-it-all newb destined to fail. I think everyone here has been generous and courteous in their advice. I'm happy to get it. So, thanks! But, I have to research before I know what my questions are.

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Originally Posted by edhewitt

So how is your technique?

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Fantastic! LOL.

I'm sure it's not perfect, but I think I'm in the ball park.

Hold the razor at about 30 degrees, one inch strokes with the grain. Razor grabs and pulls and cuts a hair or two on each stroke - about like my pocket knife would.

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Originally Posted by eminart

First of all, I'd like to say, that I don't think my light-hearted tone and jokes are coming across well in writing. I do appreciate all the advice here. But, actually, no, I DIDN'T ask. I think the only question I've asked in this thread is if anyone knows anything about the razor I bought. I realize that the answers to all my questions are probably already here on the forum. So, when I have a specific question, I'll search for the answer. And I know I have a lot to learn. But, you guys are assuming I'm asking questions, which is fine. Just don't pretend it's me that isn't listening.

Again, I don't want to come across as a know-it-all newb destined to fail. I think everyone here has been generous and courteous in their advice. I'm happy to get it. So, thanks! But, I have to research before I know what my questions are.

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True! Stick a smiley in there, then! :D I suppose the general feeling around is sellers who sell on ebay advertising a good shaving edge are all falsely advertising. All it takes is for someone to buy one and have a bad experience and they come on the forum complaining about the edge and not a peep about the prep, lather, and technique (not that you are!;)!). In fact, many guys who sell there also have web sites and are quite good with lots of good feedback. I hope you bought from someone who knows how to hone. We are just trying to help! A good idea is to go to the forum home page and click 'beginner's tips'. Reading through them gives lots of info!
Good to have a new member who knows how to search first and then ask.
Sorta rare! :) If I can help getting it properly honed, PM me!

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Originally Posted by eminart

Fantastic! LOL.

I'm sure it's not perfect, but I think I'm in the ball park.

Hold the razor at about 30 degrees, one inch strokes with the grain. Razor grabs and pulls and cuts a hair or two on each stroke - about like my pocket knife would.

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Ok, well if you were using a cartridge razor before (note the IF, i am not sure of what you previously used) , the technique is quite different, you will need to stretch the section of skin you are shaving, for a start, this will most likely entail weird contortions along with a bit of pulling with your spare hand, ideally you want to stretch in the oposite direction to the grain, this will get the hair standing up.
I would experement with different angles too, start flatter than you are and work your way up.
You will most likely need a wetter lather than you think too, again not sure what you have been using previously.
Lastly it usually takes around 3 months of regular shaves to get proficient, so be patient.

In the 1980s I used to hang out in barber shops collecting old straight razors and picking old time barbers brains about razors, hones and what not. Most of the old guys, cutting hair 30-50 years, liked the dubl duck and the FWE best, though they said any Solingen or Sheffield razor was "good too." FWE is a very well respected marque and that is a good razor by any standard.

Indeed, Engels razors are top-notch. Finely ground and great shavers. :tu

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Originally Posted by eminart

You guys are gonna have to make up your minds. First the razor will almost definitely need a professional hone job, then when I agree, you decide it's probably just my bad technique. :D

But, no, the razor needs some stropping at the very least. I've been shaving long enough and dealing with blades long enough to know when one isn't sharp enough for the job. I'm going to do some reading before I decide my plan of action.

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One of the catch 22's of begining SR shaving is this exact quandry, which is why we suggest a "Very Reputable" honer to do the edge so there is no question - BUT- here is a vid that might help you determine where the edge is at and what a Shave Test is

Basically if you can't do that simple stroke then the razor most likely needs the edge adjusted/tweaked/honed

http://straightrazorpalace.com/video...-test-vid.html


It is the best we have hehehe it ain't foolproof but we try hard :)

Well-said, Glen. Also, a 'benchmark' edge is the best tool for a newer shaver and especially to someone learning to hone one!