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I normally shower before i shave (probably like most); however, in the shower i rub water against the grain of my stubble. typically i can feel a very significant change to the stiffness of my stubble after 10-15 seconds of doing this. right before i lather / apply soap i do the same thing in the from the sink.. doesn't take but 2-3 seconds with warm water to feel the stubble soften. I also start my lather in my scuttle (partly) and then face lather.
I do not shower before a have but I do splash cold water from the sink on my face before face lathering. Can't say that splashing cold water on my face softens my stubble any.
If you make/build your lather in a modern scuttle and then paint it on your face you are not face lathering but bowl/scuttle lathering. Oth if you are using an old fashion scuttle and loading your brush with soap, not lather, and building the lather on your face, then you are face lathering.
Bob
to be specific: i will load soap up on my brush.. I believe i have a modern scuttle. i have a small amount of water. i stir the brush into the water (couple drops) making a slight foam just enough to start impregnating the brush. then i take the brush to my face and build a more volume and slickness.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
I load my brush on a puck in it's container till I have a pasty proto lather. I then go to my face and build the lather to where I want it by adding a little water as I go from dipping the brush tips in water.Quote:
Originally Posted by Desolation
Normally you load a brush with soap and go to a scuttle to build your lather and the lather in the scuttle is what you will use. It then is just a matter of painting it on your face to shave with. All the making of the final lather occurs in the scuttle not the face.
This be face lathering, no bowl or scuttle used to actually make the lather.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4zESTQWDuw
Bob
I use a bowl and sometimes build a proto-lather that is thinner and wetter than I would use for shaving. Then, squeeze out the brush, scoop up some of the bowl pre-lather and build the lather on my face. This gives the benefits of face lathering, without me slinging lather all over the bathroom.
Great idea! Although I Always enjoy watching the shaving videos with huge gobs splatting about and the slight disappointment of lost white gold.. 😂Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne1963
Understood: the technicality or distinguishing portion is where the lather is actually made. So I warm my soap up in my scuttle then face lather. I’m new so I’m sorry if I’m not 100% up on the Jargon.
I think that some people will make too much of something that is not necessary. In saying that, if you think that it makes a big enough difference in your shave, by all means you just go for it!
I'm a simple man with simple ways. Depends on my mood and time how involved I want to be in shaving. Sometimes I'm all in for babying myself and sometimes I just don't have the time and just hopeing I don't cut myself.
Shaving is just not that complicated. You just got to enjoy the ride.
Mike
Oh I was just sharing.. cause I was curious if anyone else did something similar.. It’s fun to warm up that soap and get some scents flowing and have fun.. I was also curious if anyone else did interesting strange fun routines. I’ve watched technical lather tutorials.. so I can make a lather.. I agree I have a different routine for non pampered days where function supersedes fun :)Quote:
Originally Posted by mglindo
Thanks for the support
No worries, nothing to sorry about. There is a lot of new jargon to learn when you start into this. It just helps to know the difference so everyone is on the same page when reading a post. Like everything else in this sport you do what works for you so I was not trying to change the way you lather just clarify how you lather.Quote:
Originally Posted by Desolation
Bob
Okay I’ll take back my “Sorry” 😛
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desolation
Just to be different I shower after...
For me there is a balancing act. Too much hot water (shower) softens my skin too much
and the razor then gives me a burn especially with a very sharp razor that is not "totally smooth"
like a new DE Feather blade. So I do not do the shower thing.
My strategy is to wash my face quickly with cold water then face lather enough to get the oils that
protect my whiskers from softening... I sometimes wipe that proto lather off my face and relather. While that quick
wash or proto lather works at hydrating my whiskers I work a nice lather in a bowl. A nice lather lets me see what I am
doing and it is stiff enough to not drool onto the floor.
First pass tells me if my razor, whiskers or lathering needs work. I am not averse to letting a thin lather
dry while I restrop the razor or even switch razors. Without shame I will switch to a DE from time to time.
Totally smooth for me -- not too sharp not too dull just right. I have caught myself jumping from one
grit to another too quickly and end up with a harsh edge. I have caught myself jumping to a finisher
too quickly and get a harsh edge that more time at 3K and 8K would have solved. My 1K hones sit
idle once I have an edge that shaves. The crazy fast Shapton 16K and 30K hones will sharpen a 1K
minefield into the sharpest face nicking saw imaginable. The slightest slicing motion will give a nick.
However serious attention to grit progression down to 8k or 10k with a light hand can get totally smooth.
If I get totally smooth I can go with sharper 16K or 30K but not with soggy skin.
Soggy skin... you know the wrinkles on your fingers after too much time in the pool or bath just not
that extreme.
So what works, works.
Wow. Very cool. Sounds like you spent a lot of time refining your routines. Some good ideas to play around with grit and other variables to improve your shave to smooth. I like the Idea of keeping a balance between sharp and comfortable. Thanks for sharing.
Human hair when dry has a tensile strength that is similar to that of copper wire. Would you want to use your razor to cut copper wire?
Surfactants such as the detergents (shampoo) and soaps can reduce the tensile strength of hair by 50% or more. Thus, I massage both shampoo and soap into my beard when showering before shaving. Then I follow up with a moisturizing hair conditioner that leaves my beard soft and my face slick.
If you do not shower, then at least thoroughly wash your face with soap before you start lathering. Apply lather and allow it time to soften your beard, just like barbers used to do when a shave and a haircut were two bits. Otherwise, you might as well be using your razor as a wire cutter.
Interesting.. do you leave the conditioner on and build the lather on that or do you whip/wash it off before lather?
The conditioner trick works for some ladies that shave their legs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Desolation
It is slippery and a DE or plastic tossable frame will slide on the skin.
It slows drying keeping all the happy hydration in the hair.
After soap water and a rinse, it can substitute for lathering.
It is handy in the shower.
The inexpensive stuff works.
Rinse well when done shaving... same as most products.
At least that is what I am told.
;-)
I normally rinse off most of the conditioner before leaving the shower, but I try to leave a thin layer on my face to kick-start the lathering process.Quote:
Originally Posted by Desolation
I usually shave the back of my neck while I am still in the shower using a cartridge razor. I do that right after applying conditioner. It is a wonderful lubricant for the blade.
What does tensile strength have to do with shaving? You're not pulling the hairs out. It's the hardness of the hair that matters as the blade cuts through them.Quote:
Originally Posted by RayClem
As far as prep goes I start with a clean face. The shave soap provides all that is necessary for a great shave. My experience of course.
Wouldn’t tensile stregth affect the wedge action through the hair making it less effort? I’ve also seen sem photos of hydrated and non hydrated hairs increasing in diameter which would decrease density.. allowing for more of the force of the blade to contact a greater surface area. I believe density likely has more affect compared to tensile strength..Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
A razor blade is one of the most basic of tools, a simple wedge. When you shave the apex of the wedge starts to penetrate the hair and then the wedge shape pushes the keratin molecules apart until the tensile strength of the keratin chains can no longer sustain the force applied by the wedge. At that point, the hair is severed. Thus, the tensile strength of the hair is very important. Keratin molecules have very little strength in compression, but have good tensile strength.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
Remember that tensile strength also depends upon the diameter of the "wire". Fine hair has a smaller diameter and thus a lower tensile strength than coarse hair. Thus, the coarser your hair, the more critical facial preparation becomes.
People have been shaving facial for who knows how long with some sort of sharpened tool. All kinds of routines and myths have evolved along with it too. Maybe we are over thinking the simple action of shaving. The only thing I would suggest is to try different routines to see if they work for you as everyone has different hair. All I know is that if your blade is sharp enough it will easily cut your hair.
Bob
I shave with or without prep, I don't really have a routine, nor the patience.
The only thing I often do is face lather and let that sit for a while, this soften things up nicely and gives a pleasant shave.
After my shave I usually take a shower.
If what you say were true then anything you cut with a knife would reflect that theory. To me tensile strength is when you take anything really and stretch it to the breaking point. Cutting has nothing to do with it. There may be some trivial stretching on a molecular level but basically the edge is just cutting through the hair. I doubt the molecular stretching is enough to affect the cutting action/result.Quote:
Originally Posted by RayClem
I guess you have to ask a physicist or engineer of some sort.
Well it’s off topic anyway.. it’s whatever works for you right? I’m gonna try a cold shave and try out some other routines.. the thread is just to get some ideas on different methods and share them.. not really argue about the physics:)
The comparison of whiskers and copper wire is an old one.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
Tensile strength many be an incorrect parameter to discuss but
for thin wire and common whiskers it is a fair match.
One news outlet reported:
"Dry beard hair, says an alarming Gillette fact sheet on shaving, is “extremely
abrasive and about as tough as copper wire of the same thickness.”
I cannot find the Gillette fact sheet. I did find this...
https://www.bruceonshaving.com/2010/...n-facial-hair/
And one important bit is we are all different. Not all of us can
scrape burnt dry oatmeal from a pot with our whiskers.
This seems to be better researched.
The Science Behind the Shave and How Wet Shaving is Better
..." the two scientists performed quite an exhaustive study that told us many truths about shaving. Unfortunately, they only looked at the tensile or stretching strength of hair. If you’ve ever heard that facial hair is stronger than copper wire, that myth comes from this study. Copper wire may break before hair when stretched, but in terms of shear or cutting strength, copper is far stronger than hair. Try slicing through a copper wire with your razor if you don’t believe me."....
I would add that water and whiskers change things.
Copper wire does not soak up water and get softer.
Yes, my routine is very similar to yours.
Hot shower, rubbing the mug.
Modified, face lathering.!
Like you, I build a partial lather in the mug, on top of a puck of soap, but too thick to consider as bowl lathering.
Then face lather, adding more water as needed to get it right. I like a wet lather, just not runny.
Bobs our tough guy. I think he would suffice with spit, if he ran out of cold water, for his shaves.:rofl2:
Shave on, gents.!