Can't get a lather

Hi everyone.*

I can't get a good lather. It'll be this very puffy almost aerated stuff instead of a nice thick lucious creamy texture.

I was using a synthetic cheapie Omega because I couldn't find a proper badger brush around here. I have L'Occitane shaving cream but doesn't give me a good lather in my scuttle. It'd be this pasty thing until I added water. Then it'd puff up nicely but apply thinly on my face. It'd be translucent as opposed to lush and thick. So I assumed the cheapie brush wasn't up to creating a good lather and finally found a Crabtree & Evelyn Best grade brush. What's frustrating is that I got the same exact results!

Goopy then runny/watery and translucent. I always make sure to add a tiny bit water. Drops at a time. I'm also making sure not to pump the brush when scrubbing.

I made sure to let the brush soak in warm water in the scuttle while I showered.*

I go in circular motions with minimal pressure. I did this in about 2-3 minutes.*

Whats going on :huh: :sad:

Thanks!


--------------

Solution


Success!!!!

Turns out I'd done everything appropriately except the water part.

I'd start out dry and then add water when it became paste-like. Here's the thing, I was adding too much water.

This time when it got pasty I added literally 3 drops. Then whipped it around for a good minute then added another 3 drops.

Previously I must've added a good 20 drops. Makes sense.

I was a bit drier this time but I can manipulate that easily.

I like to put the soap under water while I shower to soften it. Then I load the brush with soap for perhaps a minute of swirling, then I lather with no water except what remains in the brush after 4 shakes.

You may need to add a few drops to get the right consistency.

If you have hard water, you will have a tougher time getting good lather...and soaps are just plain tougher to get a good luscious lather with in my findings.

Perhaps you should try a cream from a tube...I am using Prorasso and finding it to be ridiculously easy to lather;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by unit

I like to put the soap under water while I shower to soften it. Then I load the brush with soap for perhaps a minute of swirling, then I lather with no water except what remains in the brush after 4 shakes.

You may need to add a few drops to get the right consistency.

If you have hard water, you will have a tougher time getting good lather...and soaps are just plain tougher to get a good luscious lather with in my findings.

Perhaps you should try a cream from a tube...I am using Prorasso and finding it to be ridiculously easy to lather;)

---

I should've added that I'm primarily using the shacing cream for now. Until I can get a firmer brush to tackle the soap.

So disregard the soap part.

You have great creams & now a badger brush.

Watch your water input; "circular motions with minimal pressure" ain't gettin it !

You gotta get in that bowl & Whip It !!
Whip It Good !!!

:gl:

hard water?

+1 to Hirlau, It's like trying to whip heavy cream into, well, whipping cream :rolleyes: Try this, put about the size of two almonds in your mug, instead of letting it sit in water, turn on your faucet, hold the brush under the water, and when it starts to sag give the fibers a light squeeze, hold it a bit longer under the stream, shake it until it isn't flinging water. Now take the brush make some swirls to break up the lump of cream, then mash the brush flat and continue swirling until the cream is bubbling up some. Now take it to your face and do up and down strokes with moderate pressure coating your face. Now start circling counter clockwise and push down until the bristles flair out, you don't want the handle grinding into your face, but the bristles should fan almost completely out. Alternate from counter-clockwise and clock wise until you get the consistency you want, if its goopy keep going, if it's drying some, don't dip the brush just a quick swipe under the faucet and keep going. I have hard water here, and had the same problems with soaps and creams until I started doing this, now I just face lather with this method. Sorry it's long, but it should be detailed enough to get you started.
Regards,
Josh

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by unit

hard water?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tiddle

+1 to Hirlau, It's like trying to whip heavy cream into, well, whipping cream :rolleyes: Try this, put about the size of two almonds in your mug, instead of letting it sit in water, turn on your faucet, hold the brush under the water, and when it starts to sag give the fibers a light squeeze, hold it a bit longer under the stream, shake it until it isn't flinging water. Now take the brush make some swirls to break up the lump of cream, then mash the brush flat and continue swirling until the cream is bubbling up some. Now take it to your face and do up and down strokes with moderate pressure coating your face. Now start circling counter clockwise and push down until the bristles flair out, you don't want the handle grinding into your face, but the bristles should fan almost completely out. Alternate from counter-clockwise and clock wise until you get the consistency you want, if its goopy keep going, if it's drying some, don't dip the brush just a quick swipe under the faucet and keep going. I have hard water here, and had the same problems with soaps and creams until I started doing this, now I just face lather with this method. Sorry it's long, but it should be detailed enough to get you started.
Regards,
Josh

---

Thanks Josh. Maybe it's hard water. Will soaking the brush in mineral drinking water remedy this? I'd really prefer to lather in a bowl.

If you go that route I would do spring water, mineral water has added Ca, Cl, and Na kinda like smart water. I would give the above a try first. Now you can still build the majority of your lather in the mug or bowl this way. You are building up your lather in the bowl or mug, but you will get your final uhhh...poofiness and cushion once you start applying it to your face.

Sounds to me as if it's more a question of being too gentle--not that the water quality is having no effect, but our water is hard too and I don't have that problem. +1 to the advice given above: wet the soap and let it sit for a few minutes, wet your brush thoroughly (once it's saturated, I give it one good squeeze), bear down with the brush on the soap when you're loading up, make sure you load up good, and lather on your wet face. By all means do use some pumping of the brush. And like Hirlau said, whether in a bowl or on your face you gotta whip it!

Ohh let me clarify. I whipped it like hell. But I was conservative on the pumping.
I think pumping too often would result in bubbles which is air which in turn will give me a puffy but empty,so to speak, lather because it won't be creamy and full (volume) it'll get built up based on excess air from pumping.

Otherwise I whipped it till my wrists felt like they'd fall off.

Maybe Posting a video is better?

Weeeeell, you could not really "pump", but raise the brush when swirling and slowly lower back into the bottom without stopping. You will need some air in the mix to get the volume, but you don't have to "pump" up and down. Try what I just suggested without stopping the circles. You hand will look almost like a drill press going up and down and spinning. Do it once or twice, but I wouldn't continually do it or you will introduce too much "fluff" for lack of a better word.

It should not be that difficult to make lather. Try skipping the bowl and lather on your face, and see how it goes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tiddle

Weeeeell, you could not really "pump", but raise the brush when swirling and slowly lower back into the bottom without stopping. You will need some air in the mix to get the volume, but you don't have to "pump" up and down. Try what I just suggested without stopping the circles. You hand will look almost like a drill press going up and down and spinning. Do it once or twice, but I wouldn't continually do it or you will introduce too much "fluff" for lack of a better word.

---

Did that too! I feel like an idiot not being able to get a good lather.

It's puffy in the bowl but applies translucent to my face.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IamSt8ght

It should not be that difficult to make lather. Try skipping the bowl and lather on your face, and see how it goes.

---

Yeah true but I'd really like to bowl lather.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hedonist222

I think pumping too often would result in bubbles which is air which in turn will give me a puffy but empty,so to speak, lather because it won't be creamy and full (volume) it'll get built up based on excess air from pumping.

---

Well, lather is a mixture of soap, water, and air--so simple but so important. By your own admission, what you're doing currently isn't working, so try something different. I'd say if you confident that you're loading the brush adequately, then it seems to me it's either got to be the amount of water or the amount of air that's lacking. I doubt the brush itself has anything to do with the problems you're experiencing. I shaved for several years with a synthetic brush and it did fine. Then about 10 years ago I switched to the best badger brush by Edwin Jagger that Crabtree & Evelyn had--no problems.

Some soaps require a lot of water, some don't. I don't know anything about Truefitt and Hill. But maybe trying less or more water to start with? It's a place to start, anyhow, and you'll learn something useful. Good luck!

the ticket: start with little water, max it out, and add a little bit until it gives you the consistency you're looking for. Also, if your lathering container is too small (like a coffee mug) it won't produce good lather either. Really, the scuttles that keep the lather hot are the best route.

Lots of great suggestions above. Can you handle one more?

Go out and buy some cheap Williams soap at WallyWorld and practice making lather. By practicing when you are not planning to shave, you will at least eliminate the frustration of not being able to get a good lather with which to shave.

Practice, practice, practice . . . using all of the different suggestions, your different brushes, and techniques. Once you are able to make good lather with cheap soap, you should be able to eliminate the mistakes, discover what works, and get to a good shave with your quality soaps and creams.

Thanks guys.

Ill try to take a video too. It'll help.

Many thanks.

I had difficulties with T & H cream, but a couple of drops of glycerin really helped. Glycerin seems to give it a bit more body and makes it last longer before collapsing. Don't add too much or it'll go sticky and the glide is lost. YMMV etc.

There's a misunderstaning above:

. . . If your problem is "hard water", the cure is _distilled_ water, _not_ "spring water" or (even worse) "mineral water".

It's the dissolved minerals in the tap water that may be giving you trouble. "Distilled water" has all those minerals removed, completely. It's available in the "household goods" sections of most supermarkets. It's used for steam irons, auto batteries, and other places where dissolved minerals are bad news.

I recently got some Truefitt and Hill soap (hard soap, not cream), and it gave me the best lather I've ever had. My technique is simple:

. . . Get the brush soaking wet;

. . . Squeeze out most of the water;

. . . Swirl the brush on the soap for 10 - 20 seconds (it may be helpful to put a bit of water on top of the soap, a few minutes before you start loading the brush);

. . . Pump-and-swirl, either on your face or in a bowl, until you get what you want. If the mix is too dry, add drops of water until it isn't.

Maybe you're being too gentle? The soap has to be _whipped_ into lather, not _coaxed_ into lather.

. Charles

Hi Hedonist,

Your description sounds like too much water. Don't have water in your bowl, you don't have to towel dry it, but don't have a puddle in it. Use your brush, just damp. Shake out the water after a little soak until most of the loose water is out and the brush isn't loaded with loose water. Start that way in your bowl. When that starts to build, add water a few drops at a time with your fingers until it has built to an amount and consistency you like. Takes some practice and experimenting, but it'll happen. I suggest doing this with your cream and it doesn't take a huge amount. Get it down and then experiment with the soap. Also, here's a couple of videos by Lynn Abrams that I think will help also. Good Luck!! :)

Lynn's SRD Videos

Regards,
Howard

Success!!!!

Turns out I'd done everything appropriately except the water part.

I'd start out dry and then add water when it became paste-like. Here's the thing, I was adding too much water.

This time when it got pasty I added literally 3 drops. Then whipped it around for a good minute then added another 3 drops.

Previously I must've added a good 20 drops. Makes sense.

I was a bit drier this time but I can manipulate that easily.

But I found most of the lather to be in the brush rather than inthe bowl.

Is that because my brush fans out a lot or the bowl was small'ish in size?
it was a regular cereal bowl. About 3 inches high and 5 inches wide.

Actually your bowl is too big. Use a small stainless mixing bowl about 3" in diameter, or one of the oversized tea cups or coffee mugs like they sell at starbucs ( I can't spell it, I don't drink coffee lol)

That huge bowl is allowing you to make really wide passes= lots of air into the mixture, smaller container=smaller swirls=less air and more room to expand up instead of out which will let the water settle out from the excess space when using a large container leaving you with a soupy mess.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hirlau

You have great creams & now a badger brush.

Watch your water input; "circular motions with minimal pressure" ain't gettin it !

You gotta get in that bowl & Whip It !!
Whip It Good !!!

:gl:

---

Devo - Whip It (Video) - YouTube

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tiddle

That huge bowl is allowing you to make really wide passes= lots of air into the mixture, smaller container=smaller swirls=less air and more room to expand up instead of out which will let the water settle out from the excess space when using a large container leaving you with a soupy mess.

---

Ohh yeah. Less real estate means less aeration.

You guys are great!

Yeah, I started w/ just a creal bowl at first 2 years ago, and my lathers would always come out "foamy" that turned to a water goo on my face, switched to a mug, and no problems since. Problem solved! :y