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I have a razor that I suspect might be a re-grind. It is a hollow grind Sheffield that has some scratches that are perpendicular to the edge. I don't really care, as it is a good shaver, but I was curious as to the typical signs of such a blade.
What are the typical indications that a blade has been reground?
One might be if it's hollow-ground, with a barber's notch.
Picture??????
Usually where the blade and the tang meet looks out of proportion. I've got a W&B regrind for sale on ebay now. If you have a look at the pictures of it, you'll see what I mean. The tang looks to be from a thick wedge but the blade is a hollow grind.
Wade and Butcher Straight Razor Shave Ready | eBay
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmrson
Here's the best photo I was able to take. The top razor shows a little what I'm talking about, vertical scratches that are 'mostly' buffed out. They both have them, despite what the pic might show.
Do not care what the experts say,IMO is no way to tell if a razor has been re-ground
Those scratches can come from sanding i.e. restoration , not necessarily a regrind.
The Rodgers is hard to tell, it looks newer and may have come hollow. The WB is most likely reground. That particular type would have had a shallower grind new. Without seeing it in hand it's hard to tell buffer marks vs grind marks. There's a small discussion that's related over on this thread: http://straightrazorpalace.com/show-...air-ivory.html
I am not an expert, but a little common sense does tell you if it's a regrind or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by pixelfixed
Grinding a razor while technically demanding is not particularly complicated. We're talking production razors here, not customs where one could grind at this or that angle to get something special.
On a production razor there is a wheel, that creates a hollow and there is the geometry of the blank. As a result from the simple hollowing at few angles there are obvious lines where two surfaces meet.
So, first look at the top razor - at the tang there is a diagonal line below the stamp. That line originally went all the way to the spine, and the transition between the spine and the tang was sharp, not the present rounded corner. Plus the shank is way too beefy for a blade that narrow and that hollow. This was originally a wedge and looked like say
http://straightrazorpalace.com/srpwi...s%22_5/8_Wedge
Same with the one below, during the regrind they left a shoulder but you can see the exact same issues. Here's what a factory hollow ground rodgers looks like:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/srpwi...rg_Ring%22_5/8
Notice the sharp angle where the shoulder meets the spine and how the size of the shank is commensurate with the blade.
So, yes, regrinds are usually easy to spot and usually because the execution is sloppier than the original factory production, especially on top brands like rodgers. And most restored razors are equally sloppily done and the sharp original lines are all blurred from excessive rounding.
Good question OP,,,,I've been waiting myself to see the answers to this thread.
To add to this with some photos. It is, often, quite easy to tell a regrind. There's also different degrees of regrind - sometimes the razor was modernized and given a full hollow grind (and sometimes had a shoulder cut, which is seen on some 1700s razors that wouldn't have had shoulders originally), and sometimes it was just a light touch to the wheel to get rust off and make a new shiny surface.
This one shows characteristic rough grind marks, as well as a non-straight line. Very unclean, obviously not the factory work:
Attachment 145400
This is a very well done regrind, but the razor is from the early 1800s and would not have been hollow ground. You can see here also the shoulder has been ground in to make it more pronounced:
Attachment 145401
It's hard to see in the photo, but this Wostenholm had a touch of crocus (mirror) polish left that the grinder missed:
Attachment 145402
From a changeable-blade set, this one has the same thing; where it's hard to get into the shoulder area, the original polish is still visible. Note also, the change in angle of the grind along the height of the blade, visible as a change in shades as you look bottom to top:
Attachment 145403
This blade was originally a rattler or faux-frameback type; you can see the oxidized surface of the old grind, and also see how rough the job was:
Attachment 145404
Here's a few more.
Joseph Smith, note the irregularly rounded edges and characteristic rough grind marks:
Attachment 145405
W. Greaves and Sons, very rough grinding:
Attachment 145406
AUX, pretty rough job. This one has been disassembled and ground all over the tang and tail as well. You can see the finger-like rusting that often comes as a result of the deep rough grind marks:
Attachment 145407
Rayson, very rough job overall. Rounded all over except the tail and near the pivot, because it was not taken apart:
Attachment 145408
Note divots and changes in surface angle:
Attachment 145409
Overall, things to look for:
-regrind marks. Once you've seen them, you'll know. Very regular, very tight fine marks, but not an original surface finish.
-changes in angle that seem odd
-rounding accompanied by the grind marks
-spots where the surface finish is different, that the grinder may have missed
-anachronistic hollow grinding
-change in angle on the bottom of the tang (mostly for pre-1800 razors that have been given a shoulder)
If you see lateral marks, or grind marks that are not very regular and tightly spaced, then all bets are off. Could be sanded or buffed, but buffer marks generally don't really look like regrind marks.
For the most part razors were used and abused, and regrinding was VERY common to prolong the life of them. The regrinders often used one-grit wheels that left rough and deep (relative to factory) marks. It wasn't an original fine finish, but it got rid of old hone wear, got oxidation off and left the blade shiny.
Contrast this to a very clean original crocus finish:
Attachment 145410
Those are great examples. Here's my commentary on the one that is original
Attachment 145416
and the regrind that shows most of the typical tell-tale signs:
Attachment 145413
As a rule of thumb original blade has four main surfaces - the blade, the shank, the tapering of the shank - four if you count the spine. Any two of these meet at a straight line or if one of the surfaces is curved at a line with single smooth natural curvature. Of course some fancy razors would have more embellishments, but it is pretty clear when those are part of the razor design (symmetry/balance) and not a side effect from post-factory regrind.
Thanks for your detailed analysis and explanation.Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
As above, thanks so much.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
