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Attachment 190369
Todays game is who's mark is it. I have looked through some olds posts and have not found one the same. The two that came to mind for me right away were George Britain and Wade and Butcher. Neither of their marks look quite the same as this one. This one is a little distinct with the shape of the spades and the tight and long arc of the base. All input is always appreciated.
Thanks
Shaun
I posted a similar mark a year ago or so and nothing was set in stone then , this could get interesting and help us both in our quest ...
can we see the whole blade ? just out of curiosity ..lol
http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/u...s/IMAG3702.jpg
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I expect that it is a regrind from long ago and the plastic scales are new. They will have to be replaced eventually.
very nice ..thanks!!!
I have seen the same mark & there are some other makers who use an anchor but I agree, they aren't GB or W & B. I wish I could remember who else uses the anchor on their razors. Westor bros. uses an anchor but it is also different so it counts them out as well.
A few previous threads that are interesting, one looks very like yours ........... (bold text)
http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...tml#post955613
http://straightrazorpalace.com/show-...ml#post1105544
http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...ark-razor.html
there was another threa, it was just a list of names with no images though d on here also where there was almost 15-20 makers who used the anchor stamp/mark .. I will look for it again ..
In one of those threads there was a post by Martin103 showing an unusual mark on a Wade and Butcher with the anchor with no rope and the Wade and Butcher corporate mark. It was also talked about that in the later years of the Brittain family that the BG and Maltise Cross being sold as a mark, but not knowing what happened to the anchor. So we can guess that it may be either a later Brittain razor or a Wade and Butcher, or a maker that has not yet been identified. It looks like in many of the posts that there are very similar marks on quite a few older wedges, which supports my theory of mine being a very old regrind. The general build is a little different than Goosers with the tail appearing to be a little different and Goosers has a thumb notch. Looking at the blade in general Gooser are they fairly close otherwise?
the anchor appear the same except the line under the eye of the anchor has one side worn off( or not clearly stamped) , mine is a full wedge with a slight barbers notch and my tail is supper thin yet doesn't look like an older tail ...
http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/u...s/IMAG3706.jpg
Schmachtenberg Bros. Germany c.1887-1939 used the Anchor and sword as a trademark
There are a large number of manufacturers who used anchors in marks. It is obviously not going to be a modern company like Wester bros or one of the other German producers given the ages/styles of razors showcased.
To complicate matters, two different examples of this recently went through ebay (note the anchor here is fouled), marked with I. Barber.
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I ran into that razor as well, first impression of it that it was some kind of fake or somebody wanted it to be more valuable, the I Barber stamp is on the other side, and all the one ive seen were not, and its upside down?Quote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
And the Wade & Butcher look alike anchor.......
I have been looking at the anchors in threads and on google images and not many are very close. The fouled anchor or anchor with another character like flags or swords. There are some different shaped anchors too, like the length of the crossbar and the size of the arc on the bottom. The one gooser has seems to be the closest I have seen and the anchor on a Wade and Butcher that Martin103 had posted in another thread. It is pretty confusing.
the one u have is the only other one i have saw that was similar to mine , you are probably going through all the old threads and searches i just went through about a year or 2 ago as well as about a week ago in search of the elusive razor mark ..lol.. it can be fun yet frustrating at the same time ... but also in some of the older post you see the updated info in the modern .. for example i saw apost where W&B was said to have never used the anchor , then in another post a year later yu see the same ppl talking about the W&B anchor stamp !! its great that no matter what you know it seems the learning process always continues and the history continues to spill out of the closet ...Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
The anchor on this GB is very close:
Vintage GB Anchor Straight Razor Sheffield | eBay
Was wondering about fake as well, but if someone went to all the trouble to counterfeit that, why not go all the way and counterfeit it as John Barber? If I recall J Barber made a point to claim other 'Barber' goods without his mark as inferior.Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin103
Indeed he did, was advertise as such if i remember correctly.It really looks like a fake to me, even the anchor is stamped the wrong way?Quote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
That is correct. I was just reading up on this the other day too in my Tweedale's Directory because I was looking at a J. Barber on the bay.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
In 1825 an American visitor met Barber, whose wares were known worldwide & had become so celebrated as to induce others to counterfeit his stamp, & he informed that he spent an amount of money in advertisements to caution the public against these frauds, as the sale of goods under his name not only curtails his business but injures his reputation...........
His razors passed through his own hands before they received his mark.
I was also reading of another maker whose razors were being counterfeited, James Johnson but he has nothing to do with this. He didn't have an anchor marking.
Well, I. Barber razors themselves were fakes...Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin103
The fact that there's an I. Barber razor with the anchor got me looking around, and in fact various styles of anchor were used as masonic symbols, much like the square & compass that John Barber used.
(As an aside, by the 1820's the affect of using a capital letter I to represent a J had not completely died out, so the I. Barber stamp was several layers of misdirection).
All that said, I'm positive that the anchor marks were not marks that anyone owned.
here was the thread I saw the other day with a list of even more makers that use/used an anchor ..now to search them out to see there marks ..lol
http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...-hallmark.html
The fact that there's an I. Barber razor with the anchor got me looking around, and in fact various styles of anchor were used as masonic symbols, much like the square & compass that John Barber used.
Correct! Good call Zak.
J. Barber used the square & compass & also Wolf with the crown.
http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...tml#post809665
Looks like gooser got it nanoseconds before I did.
To be precise, yes the company used the Wolf & crown later, but it wasn't of his making, it was acquired in succession to the Shepherds.Quote:
Originally Posted by engine46
Attachment 190467
(From Pigot's directory, 1837)
It was pretty common for marks to change hands later in the 19th century. Zak could chime in here - was the Barber mark itself later acquired by someone else?
I could see that particular razor, the I Barber on the bay, being a sort of copyright infringement. Trademark infringement rather, I wouldn't call it a counterfeit. IOW, if back when the makers were contemporaries one of them stole the others logo and made some razors I could see that.
A person now making a one off counterfeit of an obscure brand I couldn't see. I've seen counterfeit Case, Remington, Winchester, and so forth, pocket knives with engraved stamps show up. Back in the early '70s, but a true stamp would cost the guy a hundred bucks, unless he was a machinist and made his own. So if it is a 'counterfeit' it is contemporary with the original in age. IMHO.
Yep! I just didn't go into too much detail. My Tweedale's Directory which Zak also has, shows a lot more. Thank you very much for the insight my friend. :bowQuote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
When I talk about fakes / forgeries and old Sheffield razors I also go under this assumption. Based on quotes / allegations it, or at least misleading, definitely happened at the time. I also wouldn't see much sense in someone going to the trouble to make a modern fake of old razors; they're just so relatively abundant and of low value that it probably wouldn't make financial sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
Yeah & i have a couple of old pipe razors that I believe are of good quality but they used the pipe, (slightly different) for the mark.
There was also a large variety in manufacturers using various pipe marks. http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...ml#post1262113Quote:
Originally Posted by engine46
I had them listed back in July here:Quote:
Originally Posted by ScienceGuy
http://straightrazorpalace.com/show-...ml#post1364623
