I just got a "new" Bengall straight and I was hoping someone could tell me how do I clean the scales? I know to soak the blade in barbarcide but I guess this will not work on the scales... suggestions ?
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I just got a "new" Bengall straight and I was hoping someone could tell me how do I clean the scales? I know to soak the blade in barbarcide but I guess this will not work on the scales... suggestions ?
What are the scales made of? If it is a 20th C Bengall they are most likely plastic. If you could post a picture or give a bit more information that would help target the advice.
Having said that, I've had luck with just a damp rag (maybe a bit of polish) and a bit of elbow grease on scales. It really depends on the state of the scales and what they are made out of as to what might be required.
James.
James I will post a pic as soon as I have the razor (eBay). However, thank you for the tip
How do you approximate when the razor was made?
I have Bengalls with horn, bakerlite & celluloid scales
Age is as far as I understand in that order also
I use this eBook Standard Guide to Razors 3rd Edition - General Reference Antiques & Collectibles EbookQuote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
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These were the pictures on eBay
A little razor info, mostly from Geoffrey Tweedale, perhaps one of the most learned historians on straight razors (or open razors as we prefer to call them this side of the Atlantic) ever:
"The Cadman line goes back to the 16th century. In the 18th century they turned to cutlery and razor making. Thomas Radley Cadman's branch of the family began with Luke Cadman. Luke's second son (another Luke) moved to Sheffield in 1740 and became an apprentice, gaining his freedom in 1748 and being granted the 'Bengall' makers mark in 1749. At one point in time (1820s) Hannah Cadman the widow of Peter Cadman, was listed in Directories as manufacturer of Bengall razors. After her death in 1828 the firm passed over to her son Alfred, who in turn passed away in 1841 leaving his wife Mary to run the business. In 1871 Thomas Radley Cadman, one of Mary's sons, took over the business, Mary passing away in 1877. The business was located in St. Marys Road, and remained there until 1938. Thomas died in 1917, before which Edwin Cadman (the founders great grandson) was running the business. Edwin died in 1921. By 1933 the firm had branched into safety razors and pocket knives. At the beginning of WW2 the company moved to Matilda Lane, where it remained til it ceased business in 1965. Despite having employed over 100 men in it's heyday, when the company ceased trading only two remained".
Guessing the age is not easy - I have honey horne scaled ones that look ages old. mid 1800s, until you find a cutlers manual of offerings featuring this same razor - the catalogue I have goes back to the 1920s, so by guesstimate you would be 70 0r more years out.
It is pretty safe to presume yours is 1930s - 1950s, somewhere around that point. The company had used a number of scale materials, but I don't think they ever used plastic. The ones you show appear to be a mixed medium with some sort of resin and powdered horn. All the ones I have had like yours (a hundred or so) give off that distinctive horn smell when abraded. Sometimes, once polished, you can even see a slight pattern, which leads me to think that the earlier versions were 'double heated' horn - this type was in a mould and the first heat was to mould and cut it, the second to make the horn hot enough to flow and virtually ose all its horn-like qualities.
Whatever, if you sand it with fine paper to get rid of any dry fibres or knows, then use tripoli aand oil on it, you will get a high sheen.
Regards,
Neil
Oh - I forgot to say, that like Kropp, these are one of top line makers that are sometimes disregarded. I have had many, many razors, and a good Bengall will perform as well as or better than them.
NEIL, THANK YOU that was very helpful, and informative! Last question, I promise, if the scales are as you say "horn and resin" will it hurt them to place them in Barbarcide with the blade for cleaning?Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Miller
I think the scales are plastic. Why not add liquid soap to water and fill a glass with this.
Soak only the scales, keep it there for an hour or less, and you probably have clean scales.
Do not soak the scales. Over the years they have dried and any moisture will get into them.
The earlier models were a mixture of horn and resin - no matter what anyone tells you.
All you need is very fine sandpaper or 0000 grade steel wool - you dont to re-shape them, just to make the surface even - it will look a matte colour when you have finished, you could perhaps enhance this with a bit of micro mesh.
Lastly polish them with tripoli paste - on a loose, soft grinding wheel is best, then finish with a wipe down with linseed oil or other oil. Left overnight and buffed in the morning, they will look like black glass.
Regards,
Neil
Neil, I presume I can do all of this with the blade still "attached"? Also I use the same sandpaper or steel wool to take any pitting or marks off of the blade correct? Will semi chrome work in place of tripoli paste? Sorry for all of the questions ....
Yes, you want 600 or 800 and 1000 - for a very fine finish.
Not sure about semi chrome - if you go right up to 1000 grit paper, it might well do it, especially if wiped down with oil and left for 24 hrs before buffing.
Any gunge can be removed from between the scales using those those wooden sticks ladies file their nails with. I have used them with just the sandpaper on them (as they come) to file hard deposits, you can also wrap a bit of fabric round then to make a good tight fit, and either wet the fabric and/or put some some wax on it to make the inner surfaces shine.
Regards,
Neil
So I have acquired both 600 and 1500 grit sandpaper... waiting on the razor ...
Start with the fine stuff. Might work out just fine. Maas and other polishes work well for me on those. Would be the ticket for the blade as well, I think! In line with Neil's advise, I like to smash a q-tip with a hammer and apply polish, go in between the scales. Go light before going heavy. You may be pleasantly rewarded! You can always sand after trying, if needed. Lotsa work! Bengalls are great!
Here we would say buffing wheel or you might call it a buffing mop of cotton or other fiber. Lightly charged with compound. Tripoli is amongst the best for luster on natural materials. No a hard polish at all but a sheen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Miller
~Richard
PS, a pipe leaner is great for between the scales work and is thin and flexible enough to not crack most scales.
I was just planning on using a microfiber cloth, also is this correct? Dico® Tripoli Buffing Compound (531-Tc6) - Buffing Compound - Ace Hardware
Yes, it has pumice in it. Use a very loose buffer wheel and very little pressure after you have sanded to at least 1K or even better 2K.Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
~Richard
Here are common cheap tools that I have used for a few years:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/works...storation.html
I have used pumice powder from the hardware store by hand with a bit of liquid soap to achieve a nice finish.
Would just buffing by hand not suffice? I sadly do not have a buffing wheel...Quote:
Originally Posted by Geezer
Get some light metal polish. Will work on the scales and blade. Blue magic is the lightest, on to Maas, and semichrome.Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
Auto parts/hardware store! Get some of those thick 'shop towels' paper towels. Cut little squares out for use in applying and rubbing. Full towel to wipe all off and shine.
Watch those fingers and mind the direction you are going. Away from the edge! With the edge. Just never toward the edge. Top to bottom on the blade and anything goes on the scales.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geezer
Quite right Richard, a polishing mop, not a grinding wheel. My mistake! I use a close stitched cotton mop, 100mm dia by 65mm wide.
Regards,
Neil
So the scales were in fact plastic... I guess aftermarket, not bad tho. I have finished sanding, polishing, and sterilizing the razor... Now I just need to send it out to be honed
Pictures? ......Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
Attachment 192864Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
This is the only one I took when I finished... It is a bit worn down at the end and there are a few small "chips" on the side of the blade but I think it is in decent shape overall... thoughts?
Looks great! sometimes, less is best! :tu
any chance you can recommend someone who can do a really good honing/very light restoration on it for a reasonable price? I need the scales taken off to remove a very small rust spot (it appears to just be topical).Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
Where are you located? Try little dental floss things with polish on them to work around the pivot area.Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
Well I know I would have to ship it no matter what so that is fine I just will wrap it VERY well.. lol ... but the dental floss might just work.... sadly I do still need it honed needs a bevel set etc...Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
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Figured I would add a few more pictures of the razor.
As I said in an earlier post, the early Bengalls were not housed in plastic scales - at least not until after the 1920s, give or take a decade or so, and even then I think that the 'plastic' used was some sort of plastic with an unknown filler added, a bit brittle and stiff, not like the modern day 'floppy' plastics that seem to have little strength/integrity but a lot of flex.Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgc7d
However the main reason I am returning to this post is that I have recently acquired a very late production, near mint Bengall and guess what - it does have plastic scales! It even has the original 2" by 1" 'rust preventative paper' in its red and see-thru plastic sleeve. The scales are white plastic with a curious wedge - it looks white (-ish) but it is also kind of semi (or less) translucent. The blade does not have the decorative punched collar that most Bengalls have. It has 'Bengall, Sheffield, England' on the front of the tang, applied by some sort of mechanical etching apparatus like a pantograph and the back is blank, which is unusual. The plastic sleeve also has 'Bengall - Sheffield, England, in gold-foil printing on it.
So, I expect we have to determine the age of the razor as best we can. Thomas Radley Cadman died in 1917, leaving his grandchild Edwin Cadman in charge of the company. Edwin died in 1921. Here, the decline set in - the inter-war period was lean, leading to the making of safety razors and pocket knives around 1933. At the end of WW2 they tried adding scissors and dissecting blade, but things were getting worse. The firm finally ceased trading in 1965 (not 1953, as others have erroneously posted in the past).
That leads me to believe that plastic was used some time after 1930 and gained ground in the 1950s.
My razor appears to come fro the 1950s or later.
So we get a rough lineage of scale materials:
- Horn (into the 1920s, surprisingly, with quite a light hollow grind usually).
- An amalgam which is either hard rubber (not soft like rubber, but stiff and slightly brittle and prone to chips, with a filler that makes it smell like burnt horn if worked so probably powdered horn) or some other hard form of plastic with horn filler. These were the scales to be found on most of the better Bengalls, probably from the 1900s to the 1940s, give or take a decade or so. They had 'Bengall' moulded into the top scale, which was then gilded.
- Plastic - late production pieces, probably from then mid 1950s give or take a little.
I have seen them with three-pinned scales, bone scales (v. early - quarter hollow blade with 'cast steel' on the tang) - I think I have had ivory scaled ones too.
One thing I will say is that the ones made from acrylic/plastic/powdered horn filler are surprisingly like plastic, and it takes a bit o getting used to them to know - really dense, no striations or markings or grain, very high, glossy shine.
Regards,
Neil
