Question About Price of Straight Razors

I'll start of by saying: New straight razor guy, very old knife guy.

I've seen a number of statements, particularly by first time razor enthusiasts, conveying the general notion that because one razor, of current manufacture, by a given maker costs more than another razor by the same maker, then the more expensive razor must, therefore, be a higher quality razor. I'd like to find out if there is any truth in this statement.

With knives, there is a wide range of prices from less than 10 bucks to many hundreds of dollars. The differences in prices can be traced directly to:

1. Country of manufacture
2. Method of manufacturing
3. Steel used
4. Scale material
5. Custom features such as engraving and/or inlays
6. Customer demand based upon the makers reputation
7. Customer demand vs product scarcity

Certainly, there is considerable overlap between the valuation of knives and razors that can be derived from this list. A razor is, after all, just a specialized form of knife. Correct? One of the components that can not be deduced from the list regarding razors, however, is: steel. When one buys a knife made from say 1095, the informed buyer knows what to expect from the steel -- assuming that it is properly tempered and properly heat treated. The buyer also knows why an identical knife made of CPM 30V costs more and why it's different from A2, for example. However, I've never seen any information about which steel is used for making non-custom razors other than the phrase carbon steel or Swedish steel or stainless. If differences in the steel used contributes to the cost differences between razors, then those differences remain a mystery to the buyer. That being the case, one must assume that any straight razor made by say Dovo, Ralf Aust, Revisor or any of the other contemporary makers is the same steel as all of the other razors made by the same maker, and further, more than one maker may use identical steel from the same steel manufacturer. If so, any differences in "quality" would have to be judged by factors that don't have any relevance to how well the different razors of a given manufacturer cut whiskers off of a face. The $100 Dovo or Ralf Aust or <fill in a maker>, would all shave hair exactly the same (depending on the quality of the honing) as the more expensive versions of the same geometry, with the price differences being due to more expensive scales, shape of the point, gold embossing, elaborate engraving, etc. None of which matter at all when it comes to shaving hair. Am I wrong?

As far as I know all modern European blanks are made by one firm in solingen. (Thiers Issard are an exception in that they make their own I believe). The main difference between makers is in the quality of grinding (warped spines from the get go and what would be described as defects). Also some seem to have on and off quality control issues, razors that need serious regrinding or blades that don't centre in the scales and such. Then almost another issue is whether a razor is actually shaving sharp from the manufacturer.

With one manufacturer, the blades are generally identical, the price difference comes from gold wash, spine work, engraving and plain or fancy scales. Also some also do stainless which is different steel.

Don't know if that's helpful or just babble. My opinion is the difference between makers mainly comes down to quality of the grind and quality control with some of the bigger ones who employ more people. Ralf Aust for example is only Mr and Mrs Aust. Dovo is a large company.

Feel free to correct me anyone, hoping I remembered all I've read correctly.

First, razors are not knives. That being said a sharp piece of steel will cut anything that comes to hand, but both types of tools are the way they are for a purpose. Your general insights are correct.

Traditional makers are generally bound by tradition with occasional exceptions. They stick to what works, what their customers expect and what has made them money for generations. The customers have certain expectations as well and that keeps the system balanced and working.

Custom makers are like custom makers anywhere regardless of the craft. The price will reflect the materials and the "art, including the fame of the artist." They will be influenced by trends, experimentation and chasing after the latest or greatest often driven by marketing hype that may well push the edges of tradition and not necessarily improve the tool. It's a far more competitive world. And because the traditional companies are not likely to experiment so much, there is latitude to try to develop a newer steel for a razor and get it out into the world to see if it works.

There are more thoughts but this is a good start.

Yea, I think Mike Blue has it correctly stated. If you want a razor to shave with buy a basic model of production razor. If you want a little something extra buy a production model with added embellishments and pay more. Customs are a whole other level again and priced accordingly. I highly doubt any will shave too terribly different if they are properly honed.

Bob

As in knives as in razors cost is more about what you want more than need, a good Ka bar doesn't cost a lot , but is a fine knife for real world applications. From the high end customs, to the base model production, most manufactures of decent quality use good steel and heat treat processes will produce good edges, my 20 dollar Kinfolks gets and keeps as good an edge as any custom I have, just as my Kabar holds an edge as good as my Randall, granted embellishments have there place but it does boil down to steel used and grinding and heat treating. I think most of the vintage companies tryed to stay with the same types of steel for consistency . That ought to clear it up ! Tc

If you are talking about mass produced razors, in that I mean more than one of the same model unlike a commissioned custom then the higher cost usually is associated with the scale material. The more exotic usually equates to the higher price of said razor as compared to same exact blade on a basic acrylic scale.

This is just a baseline however.............several other things from what I have seen go into this equation as well as you get to etchings; spine work; blade width; and you get the picture.

So the fact you have an expensive razor...............well that does not mean it is the best or shaves the best or has better QC.

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Originally Posted by Uzi

I'll start of by saying: New straight razor guy, very old knife guy.

I've seen a number of statements, particularly by first time razor enthusiasts, conveying the general notion that because one razor, of current manufacture, by a given maker costs more than another razor by the same maker, then the more expensive razor must, therefore, be a higher quality razor. I'd like to find out if there is any truth in this statement.

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Reality to that statement is no. You can buy the same blade form the same manufacturer with fancier scales and presentation box but it will still shave the same. The person behind the hone as a lot to do as well, and technique about shaving.

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Originally Posted by Martin103

... The person behind the hone as a lot to do as well, and technique about shaving.

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Thanks for bringing this point up Martin. I am going to venture to say that this factor, with regard to razors, is probably the most important.

Razors, as different from knives, have a segment of society devoted to sharpening them with some skill. Knives on the other hand, have the expectation that the owner will sharpen them for themselves, or worse, can simply have an edge put on by any one with any tool. All a knife has to do is cut, right? The material being cut doesn't grumble about how smoothly it was cut, or how many cuts before "Hey, buddy, that hurts, you should sharpen that axe you're using..." No, razors are personal, and it's your own flesh that's at risk.

If the person honing the blade is not happy with the razor's response to their work, the blade and the manufacturer's reputation will become a point of discussion. As an example, see the amount of space on this site, and others, devoted to honing and the training of honers and the reputation of the honmeisters and their feedback about blades when they are asked. I think they are the ultimate customer for a blade maker. I know this because during some experiments I got feedback about being able to harden a blade to the point where it was polishing the stones. My heat treatment practices have since been modified. But I had to know what would happen, and no doubt, they were testing me to see if my stuff would be satisfying.

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Originally Posted by Mike Blue

Thanks for bringing this point up Martin. I am going to venture to say that this factor, with regard to razors, is probably the most important.

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Absolutely! Some of the razors i didn't like a few years ago have become favorites now, and not because of the resting period, just by getting more familiar with honing.

And as far as steel used, ive seen many custom makers using different kind of steel, but is there one out there that really came up with a significant improvement over razor made a hundred years ago or even 200 years ago? I think not...

One thing that separates a custom from a mass produces blade whether razor or knife is the fact that every step on a custom there is a high degree of control were as on a mass produced product quality control is sketchy at best.On a hand made custom the heat treat and tempering is precise and carefully done .

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Originally Posted by AKwildman

One thing that separates a custom from a mass produces blade whether razor or knife is the fact that every step on a custom there is a high degree of control were as on a mass produced product quality control is sketchy at best.On a hand made custom the heat treat and tempering is precise and carefully done .

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Well, I'd go yes and no on that. It should by all accounts be so though. WRT heat treating and tempering I'd guess by mid 20th Century, at least, those processes were well controlled in mass produced razors. The thing that has slipped is the QC in most modern production items. A rigorous QC regimen runs counter to production numbers and profit now in mass produced items.

Bob

That's true Bob on QC but the heat treat on custom blades is very controlled and usually no more then 4 at a time,myself I don't do more then 2 at a time in the hardening stage,in mass production they shove as many in as possible and you have some blades getting a little hotter due to being closer to the heating elements.

And let's not forget the supply and demand factor. If 2 guys are wanting the same razor the seller may not be able to get as much as if the same razor was drooled over by 100 guys :<0) All the previous factors stated will influence this of course. Quality wins in my book. You can feel it, you can see it.

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Originally Posted by AKwildman

That's true Bob on QC but the heat treat on custom blades is very controlled and usually no more then 4 at a time,myself I don't do more then 2 at a time in the hardening stage,in mass production they shove as many in as possible and you have some blades getting a little hotter due to being closer to the heating elements.

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Totally disagree, in mass razor production manufacturing there was people doing razors in stages, forging, grinding,hardening, scale making, honing,etc and highly trained. A custom maker has to do it all by himself most of the time.
Not to take anything from the custom makers at all, but in the end you dont get a better shave because its a custom made razor.

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Originally Posted by AKwildman

That's true Bob on QC but the heat treat on custom blades is very controlled and usually no more then 4 at a time,myself I don't do more then 2 at a time in the hardening stage,in mass production they shove as many in as possible and you have some blades getting a little hotter due to being closer to the heating elements.

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Yea, that is true about better control with customs but then again that is extremely rigorous QC at work. OTH I have razors going back to around the mid 1800s up to one modern Revisor and none have failed to take an edge and maintain that edge for a reasonable time. So to me the metal alloy used and the heat treating and tempering were more than adequate for the job of daily shaving.

Bob