I just saw a Henckels razor with logo on it that only has one stick figure man.
Does the "one man" Henckels logo simply indicate that the razor was manufactured after 1969?
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I just saw a Henckels razor with logo on it that only has one stick figure man.
Does the "one man" Henckels logo simply indicate that the razor was manufactured after 1969?
Would be interesting to see this razor, if i remember correctly the one man stick figure is the logo used for Henckles International.Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
Attachment 240385
As far as being after 1969 seems like the logo was changed to red in that year but still with 2 stick figure like the original.
Attachment 240386
Hmmm...
I wonder if I might have been looking at a cheap knockoff spelled Henckles?
I can't find it on e-bay anymore...
The logo was stamped on the blade much like the GD logo.
One stick man inside a red circle.
Think. Henckels Zwillingswerk. How much sense, if any, does one person make?
There are a lot more Henckels logos than the few in the example give, however I am yet to see a really comprehensive chart either. I have written and asked Henckels head office and have gotten no real information back. The current people answering inquiries don;t really seem to care or know what is what with all the logos over the years. I suspect there is a lot more to it than the simple chart we see, but have found little in my looking. I have quite a few Henckels and would really like to know more but have nothing beyond the chart shown. Anyone with great resources care to share?
Yes, there is a lot of confusion about Henckels logos and not much solid info. Many years ago I was told that the difference between having a twins logo or a single man logo indicated the first was German made and the later made outside of Germany. Never could confirm that then or now but at the time it seemed to make some sense to me.
Bob
I really don't know much about the logos but i do know the ones i have shave good. I believe these i have are pre war and carbon steel. I've yet to try a stainless one maybe one day. It would be nice if the company would do a history of there company and all the logos.
Easy~! Get every number and rate them for yourself! :roflmao
Don't forget the Twinworks razors.
They seem to have a numbering system of their own!
I would tend to agree with BobH on this since I have recently purchased a few Henkels with the "twin" logo on them and they were or supposed 70's razors which are definitely after 1969. Maybe the single logo is signifying an outside Germany build.
Part of that is Zwillingsworth was made for German areas and Twinworks is an export stamp, and the number system does not make a whole lot of sense. It seems as though you can get two razors of the same grind and shape with different numbers stamped on them. Things that make you go hmmmm.Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
My first thought was that a Henckels with a one-man logo might have been manufactured someplace other than their Twinworks facility.
Out of curiosity...
Doesn't Henckels manufacture straight razors anymore? I went to their site and couldn't find a single one!
ZWILLING J.A. HENCKELS Official Store | Shop Cutlery, Cookware, Flatware & Kitchen Tools
Well whatever the reason, if it is that rare, and if you can get a razor with that mark at a reasonable price, I'd take a chance. You can eventually find out what the single 'twin' mark signifies. In the meanwhile you might have a collector’s item.Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
Not to my knowledge. I think they either stopped in the 80's??? Or maybe early 90's??? But I am not the one to ask just what I think I read somewhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
To my knowledge, ALL German manufacturers went through a 'tough time' in the late 1940s .... Boker, Henckels, Wustof, Puma, and many others .... they all made German dress daggers for the Nazis. They all, pretty much, regretted that relationship - so many of them even say that 'that was a different company' ... even if the trademark and logo looked the same. Maybe not 100% on topic, but it is a reason why German makers changed logos and trademarks
I found the razor that I was talking about and bought it.
It is a: Henckels 10072 1/2 Solingen Straight Razor; Shave Ready.
Based on what was said on this thread, I got it for it's apparently unique logo.
I wonder if the "1/2" means "half of the twins"? :idea:
see: http://www.ebay.com/itm/281975624616
I don't know how long this page will stay on e-bay, so photos to follow...
BTW: I have contacted J.A. Henckels in an attempt to find out when this product was manufactured.
Well a couple of thoughts, it does specifically say Germany on the blade, I have never seen that logo on a Henckels blade, 1/2 indicates a round point.
Some answers right here http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...al-fake-7.html
Based on absolute ignorance, I am sort of leaning towards Henckels disassociating their long standing logo from some things that they may have been making for the German military during the Third Reich era.
There are plenty of German companies that supplied the German military during the Third Reich that still retain their names and logo regardless.Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
Bob
Here's mine I had to have it cause I like the uniqueness of it. The only child if you will Har!!!
Attachment 240460
Attachment 240461
Hmmm...
There is no stamp on the back side of the tang.
Is there any kind of stamp on the back of the tang on yours, Tarkus?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Whatever they say... I will still view it as a collectable.
No, but then the back side of all of my Henckels are blank. Friodur's are back side stamped with the JA Henckel's Solingen Zwillingswerk
Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
I asked Henckels a while ago and they informed me that they no longer produce straight razors.
Regarding the lonesome twin, the few razors I saw were not top of the range, which led me to believe that it was the Henckels second tier product line.
B.
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Attachment 240462
Har
:rofl2:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Well from the official correspondence that Razor Talkin received in that thread that Martin linked to it is apparent that the logo is genuine, and relatively rare for straight razors. Here is a photo from the ebay auction you won Dave ;Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
Attachment 240463
I bet it'll be good shaver.
The ½ after the model number is commonly associated with round points.
I avoid Henckels five digit model numbers; similarly to what I wrote earlier in this thread about my explanation of the lonesome twin, I found that these razors are not on the same level as other Henckels.
As far as Henckels goes, I used to look more for the stainless steel Friodurs.
Towards the end of their straight razor era, Henckels quality appears to have started slipping - possibly due to shrinking demand that made Henckels loose interest - and I once bought a late NOS Henckels in Europe that took mulitple attempts to get it up to a similar standard as my other 20-odd Friodurs.
K.
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I have seen them but not very often. I saw this one but I passed on it. I'm glad one of our guys got it.
I'd like to see a Henckles catalog showing the prices of their razors with the twins logo, and the illing logo. Just to see if there is a price difference. Obviously the Friodur was the top of their line with the stainless special cryogenic processed blade, and the fancier inlaid scales. Comparing Friodur with the high carbon is like comparing a VW to a Porsche. I can't imagine that the single figure logo denotes a 'second' or inferior blade. It doesn't make sense to me that they would produce something inferior with the Henckles name on it. YMMV.
While it would not have made sense for Henckels to produce something "inferior", it would have made sense for them to have a less expensive "economy" (e.g. 10072) razor line that they would have given a slightly different (single twin) appearance to differentiate from their premium products.
B.
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That's just a half-assed Henkels, Darry!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
HAR!
HarQuote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
Me thinks I know where the missing twin is at.
Attachment 240485
All kidding aside I do not find the theory of the second tier or seconds is a viable answer to this question.
Lets review. What could construe this razor as a second tier razor? Carbon steel is carbon steel, and the processes of working the metal (stamping, grinding heattreating, etc.) remains the same as well.
So the manufacturing is no different.
Ok so lets suppose they have a guy will call 2 Finger Freddy (from a horrible drop forge accident) who was grinding these specific blade models and always did a %&#@-ful job at grinding them,. What would the Henckels clan do? Would they invest in designing & manufacturing of a whole new scale design as well as a new tang stamp to distinguish O'll Freddy's handy work, and keep these sub-par razors on the market? Of course not, they would give Freddy his walking papers for not producing the quality J.A.Henckels is know for.
That's just my theory gentleman. But then I'm not a cutlery mogul.
Regards,
Tarkus (Darl)
I still like my story...
Somebody in marketing with a conscience decided to change the logo when Henckels got the contract to make daggers for the SA (the Brown Shirts)...
They (or somebody in the family) did make SA daggers.
SADAGGERS #38170C Early SA Dagger – Paul A. Henckels
The Paul A. Henckels firm must be an offshoot of the C. A.(sic) Henckels business; it seems like too much of a coincidence to see another maker with this name. This maker rates as an 8 on the McSARR scale, so it is quite scarce.
see: http://www.wwiidaggers.com/SADAGGERS.htm
Since Paul started making SA Daggers, they removed the prodigal from the logo maybe?
That's what I love about folklore...
Tell the story often enough and people begin to believe it!
Hmmmmmm :hmmm:
I still dont get it. He's more worried about his precious logo then his own name????
Not Paul... the rest of the family.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Paul lit out and took a government contract on his own...
The family then removed one twin (signifying Paul) from the company/family logo.
Get it?
It is mildly amusing, if only because of the lack of underlying facts, and people's perverse fascination with Third Reich memorabilia.Quote:
Originally Posted by howdydave
For completeness's sake, here is a list of SA Dienstdolch makers. Pick your poison.
A.Evertz, Solingen
A. Werth, Solingen
A.G. Erbe., H.A. Schmalkalden
Abr. Schnittert, Solingen-wald
Adolf Volker, Schmalkalden
Aesculap, Tuttlingen
Albert Dorschel, Solingen
Albert Mebus, Solingen (AMSO)
Alderblick
Arrow
Anvil
Alexander Coppel, Solingen (ALCOSO)
Anton Wingen Jr., Solingen (Othello)
Arthur Melcher, Solingen-Merscheid (Armeso)
ASSO - Arthur Schüttelhöfer & co, Solingen
Aug. Knecht, Solingen
Aug. Küllenberg, Solingen-Gr.
Aug. Malsch FR. Sohn, Steinbach, Kr. Meinigen
Aug. Merten Ww., Solingen - Gr
August Bickel, Steinbach-Mallenberg
August Rother, Solingen
Axt - und Hauerfabrik - Berg & co., Solingen
Bismarck - August Müller KG , Solingen-Merscheid
Bruno Heimbucker
Böntgen & Sabin, Solingen
C. & R. Linder, Solingen-Weyer
C. Bertram Rein. Sohn, Solingen
C. Eppenstein Söhne, Solingen
C. Gustav Neeff, Solingen
C. Gustav Spitzer, Solingen
C. Linder, Solingen, Merscheid
C. Lütters & Cie, Lowenwerk, Solingen
C. Remscheid & Co., Solingen - Aufderhöhe (REMEVE)
C. Rud. Jacobs, Solingen-Grafräth
C. Schlieper, Solingen
C.D.Schaaff, Solingen
C.F. Kayser, Solingen
C.G. Haenel, Suhl
Carl Aug. Meis GMBH, Solingen
Carl Bender
Carl Eickhorn, Solingen
Carl Fr. Kührt, Kom. - Ges
Carl Grah, Solingen-Ohligs
Carl ********, Solingen-Wald
Carl Halbach, Stahlwarenfabrik, Solingen
Carl Heidelberg, Solingen.
Carl Jul. Krebs, Solingen
Carl Kloos, Solingen, Landwehr
Carl Schmidt & Sohn A.G., Solingen
Carl Tillmanns Söhne, Solingen (LUX)
Carl Wüsthof, Solingen
Carl Zander, Solingen
Christianswerk, Solingen
Chromolit - Arthur Wingens, Solingen
Clemen & Jung, Solingen
Curdts Nachf., Solingen
Curt Hoppe, Solingen
Daniel Peres, Solingen
David Malsch, Steinbach
E. & F. Hörster, Solingen
E.Bonsmann, Solingen
E. Gierling, Solingen
E. KNECHT & CO., Solingen
E. Lüttges & Co., Solingen
E. Schrick, Sohn, Solingen
E.P.& S.
Ed Wüsthof, Solingen
Ed. Gembruch, Solingen
Eduard Vitting, Solingen
Ehr. Reich, Schweina
Eickelnberg & Mack, Solingen
Emil Hermes
Emil Kaiser & Co., Solingen
Emil Voos, Solingen
Ernst Brückmann, Solingen-Ohligs
Ernst Busch, Solingen
Ernst Dirlam, Hoffnungswerk, Solingen
Ernst Erich Witte, Solingen
Ernst Gerling, Solingen-Ohligs
Ernst Hugo Rasspe, Solingen
Ernst Kemper, Solingen
Ernst Rottgen
Ernst Römer, Solingen
Ernst-Grah, Solingen-Wald
Eugen Haering, Solingen
Eugen Scheidt, Solingen-Ohlings
Ewald Cleff, Solingen
F. & A. Helbig, Steinbach, Kr.M
F. A. Kirschbaum & Co. , Solingen
F. Dick
F.Dick, Esslingen
F. Ed. Ohliger, Solingen
F. Herder A.S., Solingen
F.Koller & Co, Solingen-Ohligs
F. Plücker, Jr., Solingen
F. von Brosy-Steinberg, Solingen
F. Wilhelm Jordon, Solingen
F.W. Backhaus, Solingen
F.W. Höller, Solingen
Felbeck & Pickard
Ferd. Neuhaus, Solingen
Fr. v.d. Kohlen, Solingen
Franz Pils & Sohn, Steinbach
Franz Steinhoff, Solingen-Wald
Friedr. Aug. Schmitz, Solingen
Friedrich Geigis, Solingen-Foche
Fritz Barthelmess, Muggendorf (BAVARIA)
G. Felix, Gloriawerk, Solingen.
G. Reinhold Grah, Solingen-Foche
Gebr. Becker, Solingen
Gebr. Bell, Solingen-Gr.
Gebr. Berns, Solingen (OTTER)
Gebr. Böhme Nachfl, Brotterode
Gebr. Born
Gebr. Gräfrath, Solingen
Gebr. Halbach., Weyer b. Ohligs (Bulldog)
Gebr. Krusius, Solingen (Gazelle)
Gebr. Lützenkirchen, Solingen
Gebr. Torley, Solingen
Gebr. Heller
Gebr. Krumm, Solingen
Gebrüder Heller, Schmalkalden
Giesen & Forsthoff, Solingen
Gottlieb Hammersfahr, Solingen-Foche
Gottfr. Hoppe Söhne, Solingen
Gottfried Weyersberg Soehne, Solingen
Gottfried Müller Herges, Vogtei
Gust. Weyersberg Nachf., Solingen
Gustav Häker, Solingen
Gustav L.Koller Nachf, Solingen-Wald
Gustav Voss, Solingen
Gustav Völker
Gustav Wirth, Solingen-Gräfrath
H & F. Lauterjung, Solingen
H. Herder, Solingen
HACO - Ernst Mandewirth, Berlin
Hammersfahr Cie, Solingen
Hartkopf & Co., Solingen
Heinrich Böker &co , Solingen
Henkel & Müller, Solingen-Ohligs (Macero)
Herbeck & Meyer, Solingen-Mohscheid
Herbertz & Meurer, Solingen - Gr
Herder & Sohn., Solingen (Diogenes)
Herder & Engels, Solingen-Ohligs
Herm. Konejung A.G., Solingen
Herm. Linder, Söhne, Solingen
Hermann Schneider, Solingen - Aufderhöhe
Hermann Hahn, Sol.-Wald
Hugo Berns, Solingen-Ohligs (Hubeo)
Hugo Köller, Solingen
Hugo Linder Deltawerke, Solingen
Hugo Rader, Solingen
Hugo Servatius, Solingen
Is. Wolfertz, Solingen
J. Dirlam & Söhne, Solingen
J. Reuleaux, Solingen-Wald
J.A. Henckels, Zwillingswerke-Solingen
J.A. Schmidt & Soehne, Solingen
J.E. Dittert & co., Gmbh Neustadt I. S.
J.P. Sauer & Sohn, Suhl
Jacobs & Co., Solingen-Gräfrath
Johann Leupold, Bayreuth (Leuco)
Johanniswerk, Bayreuth
Jos. Schlimbach, Solingen
Josef Münch, Brotterode
Josef Wolf, München-Au
Julius Bahrl Jr., Solingen
Julius Bodenstein, Steinbach Kr.M
Julius Ohliger, Solingen
Justinuswerk, Solingen
Karl Boker, Solingen
Karl Malsch Spitzer, Steinbach Kr. M
Karl Malsch Gust.Sohn, Steinback Kr. Mein
Karl Oschmann
Karl Rob. Kaldennbach, Solingen-Gr.
Kaufmann & Söhne, Solingen
Klittermann & Moog G.M.B.H., Haan b/Solingen
Koeller & Co
Kolumbuswerk, Eduard Becker, Solingen
Krom
Krieger
Kuno Ritter, Solingen
Louper - Louis Perlmann, Solingen (Flamme)
Ludwig Groten, Solingen
Ludwig Schiff
Ludwig Zeitler, Wien
Malsch & Ambronn, Steinbach
Mann & Federlein, Solingen-Ohligs
Mannos
Mav & vom Hau, Solingen-Ohligs
Max Weyersberg, Solingen.
Melzer & Feller , Zella -Mehlis
Neidhardt & Schmidt, Brotterode
Neptun - Küpper & Oertling, Solingen
Otto Linder, Solingen, Mersheid
Otto Simon, Steinbach, Kr. M.
Otto Stover, Solingen
P.A.Dunzer
P.D. Lüneschloss, Solingen
Paul A. Henckels, Solingen
Paul Ebel, Solingen
Paul Kohl, Solingen
Paul Seilheimer, Solingen
Paul Weyersberg, Solingen
Perfectum - C.D. Schaaff, Solingen
Peter Dan. Krebs, Solingen
Peter Lungstrass, Solingen – Ohligs
Pfeilringswerk - Müller & Schmidt, Solingen
Pils & Sohn
Prang
Puma - Lauterjung & Sohn, Solingen
Pumeto, Solingen
R.********tert & Büll, Solingen – Wald
Rau & Koch , südwest (RK)
Reinh. Weyersberg, Solingen
Rich. Balke & Söhne, Solingen
Rich. & E.Hartkopf, Solingen
Rich. Drees & Sohn, Solingen
Richard Abr. Herder
Richard Schmitz
Rob. Giersch, Solingen
Robert Herder, Solingen
Robert Klaas
Robert Müller, Solingen-Merscheid
Romi
Romüso - Müller and Sohn, Solingen-Merschied
Rudolf Büchel, Solingen- Merscheid
Rudolf Schmidt, Solingen
Seehund
SMF, Solingen
Spalteneder, München
Sudd Messerfabrik, Gefrees
Tiegelwerk Riemberg-Karl Tiegel, Bez.Breslau
Tiger - Lauterjung & co, Solingen
Undine - Kuno Meisenburg, Solingen
Wagner & Lange, Solingen
Waffenhammer, Deggendorf
Wedi
Wester & Butz, Solingen
Wilh. Halbach, Solingen
Wilh. Krieger, Solingen-Merscheid
Wilh. Wagner, Solingen-Merscheid
Wilh. Weltersbach, Solingen
Wilhelm Kober & Co., Suhl
Wilhelm Hoppe, Solingen
WKC (Weyersberg, Kirschbam & Cie.), Solingen
I don't care about the facts...
I'm trying to construct a plausible story here!
You shot me down by pointing out that J.A. Hinckels is also on the list. :banghead:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bW7Op86ox9g
The plot is defiantly thickening
I did find this
J.A. Henckels, Zwillingswerk. Solingen. Brand names: 'Acutal' (1924-5), 'Blitznieta' (1920), 'Coltelleria' (1924-5), 'Genielos' (1929), 'Henckels' (1898), 'Henckels Extra Dünn', 'Henckels-Klinge', 'Henckelswerke' (1901), 'J.A. Henckels' (1898), 'Noxida' (1924-5), 'Sigma' (1936), 'Twin Works' (1908), 'Vacuum' (1924-5), 'Wotan' (1898), 'Zwilling' (1871), 'Zwillinge' (1899), 'Zwillings-Klinge
http://strazors.com/uploads/images/henckels_1933.pdf
http://strazors.com/uploads/images/ZWILLING.pdf
These were from Manah's site. Hope your German is better than mine:)
