Filarmonica Fakes

Hi guys, I've been meaning to post this for ages now but never got around to it. i bought a filarmonica on ebay from Japan about a year ago. It was advertised as a 'NOS' razor basically near new condition. It was a sello oro number 13 and i paid a fair bit for it because i'd always wanted a 'filarmonica' and heard such good things about them. Well it turned out to be the worst razor that I ever owned. It doesn't hold an edge and basically you can't even get to give you a comfortable shave. It's a worthless piece of junk. I was always convinced it was a fake and i still believe this. I makes sense these blades would be easy to counterfeit and demand high prices for like this one did. I have since seen other brands of razors mostly originating from Japan that are advertised as near new. Brands like duck and puma that seem too good to be true ( to be new, the price is still high). Whilst i can't vouch for their quality i would advise people to buy with caution because i really believe there's a market for some of the old razors that demand high prices to be counterfeited.

Can you post a clear photo of the razor with the blade exposed? Another with a close up of tang stamps & any blade etching ? I've yet to see a counterfeit filly, but anything is possible.

Hmmm. I have a Sello Oro (what does that mean?) 13 and it is quite good, to me.

Lots of stories have circulated about Filarmonicas, old and new. Where they were actually made, etc.

I think hype contributes to too much of it. Just me...

Ok....Just looked..Sello Oro. The Spanish-made stamp of gold, as I see it.
Must mean the gold wash on the blade! ;)

Attachment 240882Attachment 240883Attachment 240884Attachment 240885

Also before i bought this it did cross my mind. I looked up on this forum and people were saying that they had never seen a counterfeit before and that put my mind at ease a bit so i went for it. I don't see why people wouldn't think that it's a possibility that counterfeits don't exist of such an expensive item that could easily be reproduced...

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Originally Posted by aquapura1

Also before i bought this it did cross my mind. I looked up on this forum and people were saying that they had never seen a counterfeit before and that put my mind at ease a bit so i went for it. I don't see why people wouldn't think that it's a possibility that counterfeits don't exist of such an expensive item that could easily be reproduced...

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I'll defer to those more familiar with that model to check out the photos. It does look genuine to me, but I sold all my Fillys years ago, and don't have one to compare at hand. Do the scales have the embossed harp ?

yes it does in gold.

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Originally Posted by aquapura1

yes it does in gold.

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Anything is possible, but I find it difficult to believe that someone would do a one off counterfeit of a filly, or whatever. Was it honed by a professional ?

I don't think they would be one offs... they could easily make a batch. No it wasn't but i can get all my other razors sharp, Dovos, TIs, a wedge and shiefield razors.. I don't see why this would be any different to the others.

It's not a fake, in fact I don't think there are any fake Filarmonica's, the razor is one of the last models which come in the black coffins there's a big question mark over the QC and the steel used in the production of these razors.

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Originally Posted by aquapura1

I don't see why people wouldn't think that it's a possibility that counterfeits don't exist of such an expensive item that could easily be reproduced...

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I am always amused when I see the counterfeit razor hypothesis being thrown when a filarmonica razor fails to deliver. I hate to disappoint you, but there is nothing exceptional about this brand. The only reason it is an "expensive item" is because of hype that has been generated on shaving forums. Hence:

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Originally Posted by aquapura1

;It was a sello oro number 13 and i paid a fair bit for it because i'd always wanted a 'filarmonica' and heard such good things about them.

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Sure, some are nice shavers, but no better than a plethora of other razor brands. Just look on eBay, they are certainly not rare. They were mass produced for export and sure, there will be duds among them, but not counterfeits.

I was going to ask the same thing about sending it out to a pro. I don't believe anyone is questioning your honing ability, a pro may be able to fix whatever issues your having. I myself have almost 60 razors. I have honed all of them from day one of those razors I have 2 that I can not put a good edge on. 1 is a Boker that's warped to hell that I need to fix but have 2 of the same so I've left it alone. The other is a Simon pure cutlery that I come back to every few months trying to get a good shave out of it to no avail one day I will beat this razor or send it out. This is my problematic razor your filly may be your problematic razor just my 2 cents.

well perhaps it's just a dud then but honestly it's a really shit razor.

Yes maybe it's my honing ability, i never profess to be an expert although i get my other razors very sharp and good to shave with. maybe i'll try it again. There's something about the metal on it that just doesn't seem like my other quality razors it seems like 'tinny' and 'pingy'

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Originally Posted by aquapura1

Yes maybe it's my honing ability, i never profess to be an expert although i get my other razors very sharp and good to shave with. maybe i'll try it again. There's something about the metal on it that just doesn't seem like my other quality razors it seems like 'tinny' and 'pingy'

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I might recommend getting it to someone good to set the bevel and hone it.
The bevel looks not to be even and the edge looks rough, from this perspective.
It looks to have been rusted and cleaned-up. Might be that some smooth fresh edge is necessary.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/attac...s-dsc_0317.jpg

i think it might be beacuse of the shot the blade is very clean ( i thinkt that's just some dust in the shot i didn't give it a good wipe). However you could be right about the bevel. I might try set the bevel and hone it again and see

Well I'll say t the hone job looks pretty rough. Tc

Ok this is all bringing back memories again. I just re-honed this and tried to shave and i remember i have been through this experience before: It seems to start off sharpish then after about half my face was shaved it becomes very pingy and basically feels rough and doesn't really cut well anymore. I continue more and it gets very uncomfortable and seems to start pulling. My questions:

1. Could an edge deteriorate this quickly?
2. Could this mean i just can't hone thing blade to save my life?

Did it come in the black box with the gold marking as a cello oro series? If so what you have been told is correct. Any razor in that cello oro series requires real scrutiny. There are some very nice ones and some that QC was home sick or sleeping during his shift and the blades are just junk. It is not a counterfeit.

Do not give up yet.
I did a DT 14 a couple of days ago that didn't want to keep an edge. De edge seemed to crumble at low and hi grit honing on synthetics. Only very careful honing on naturals (jnats) gave an edge which was good enough. It was a Filarmonica without the JMP stamp on the tang.

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Originally Posted by lz6

Did it come in the black box with the gold marking as a cello oro series? If so what you have been told is correct. Any razor in that cello oro series requires real scrutiny. There are some very nice ones and some that QC was home sick or sleeping during his shift and the blades are just junk. It is not a counterfeit.

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Yes exactly right that's how it came. ok I believe it's not a counterfeit after all.

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Originally Posted by tonybee

Do not give up yet.
I did a DT 14 a couple of days ago that didn't want to keep an edge. De edge seemed to crumble at low and hi grit honing on synthetics. Only very careful honing on naturals (jnats) gave an edge which was good enough. It was a Filarmonica without the JMP stamp on the tang.

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Interesting. Ok well i only have a norton 4/8K and 12K Naniwa all synthetic. I then finish on CrOx.

I had 2 of the sello oro filarmonicas and both were great shavers, exceptionally easy to hone. I believe it is luck of the draw when it comes to these later editions. Glen (gssixgun) honed one last year or so for a member and couldn't get an edge on this particular razor, if he cant no one can.

You had mentioned it being expensive. I know how it is to be adamant about honing your own, but since you've invested as much as you have in $ and in time, sending it out to the pro honer of your choice wouldn't be that much more in comparison, and would at least let you know if it is you, or if it is just a lemon. IMHO.

Thanks everyone who responded. Jimmy honestly it was a year ago and i have come to the point where I actually hate this razor. I'm not going to spend anymore time or money on it. I have much better razors in my collection. When i said it was bad i don't mean just mediocre i mean it's bad. I can now imagine this it what a cheap ebay razor from Pakistan or India would perform like. At least I learned something. Raises another question though - i know there is quality steel and cheap steel but what about metal makes it quality? Is it the fabrication of the razor or the actual metal that determines a good Vs average razor? Does cheap steel contain some type of impurities or something that means it won't get sharp? I was never good at chemistry and have no idea scientifically what would determine this. Would be interesting to know...

I would have it professionally honed. If you had it honed and it turned out to be a good shaver, you could sell it without worrying you were passing along a defective razor. You might as well recoup some of your money.

I have seen more than a few Filis from Japanese sellers that are advertised as JMP but are actually later production as well. Pics are the key to some of these, and if there isn't a clear shot of both sides of the tang, avoid, and if I don't see the JMP stamp I also avoid. I am unsure if it is so much false advertising as much as it may be the sellers really don't know the difference. A few of them have lots for sale simultaneously....perhaps that implies they purchased or found boxes/unused retail packaging in barbers supply stores in Japan.

Either way, for me....with a Fili (I have 3 now), if its not a 1st or 2nd gen JMP, I won't take the risk of buying it. They generally aren't cheap so I won't take the risk.

“1. Could an edge deteriorate this quickly?”

Yes, especially if you are bevel setting on a 4k, not saying it can’t be done, but the bevel has to be completely set.

Yesterday, coaching a new honer with a problem razor, we spent a couple hours getting a chip free edge on a vintage razor. Sometimes it takes what it takes.

I’d bet a doughnut, the bevel is not FULLY set.

If a bevel is not fully set, it can be made to shave, though not the best shave then crumbles. It is actually pretty common an often blamed on other thing like stropping.

Filly’s do vary, some razors just prefer certain stones and methods as well.

It may be just me but in my mind it would not be an easy or low cost feat to make a fake "whatever" so close to the original and to sell for only a few hundred tops...well I just can't see it.

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Originally Posted by Euclid440

I’d bet a doughnut, the bevel is not FULLY set.

If a bevel is not fully set, it can be made to shave, though not the best shave….

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Exactly my experience too!