W & T Marsh Old English early pre Marshes & Shepherd c1820?

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02-28-2017, 08:12 PM
ajkenne

3 Attachment(s)

W & T Marsh Old English early pre Marshes & Shepherd c1820?

Picked this old beauty up last week and initial research indicates that it was made by the cutler brothers William & Thomas Marsh before they were Marsh Brothers Co. and before they partnered with their brother in law Shepherd becoming Marshes & Shepherd. Have not seen this logo before in this forum, so it may be quite rare. I had initially planned to rescale it in a nice honey horn but decided after a slight polish that I should leave it alone as it is beautiful as is. The wood scales (possibly walnut or ash??) have acquired a rich patina over the years. They are nice and thin, without cracks, work well, so they will live on. The brass washers were probably an attempt to replicate dome collars or maybe just a functional fix with products on hand. They seem to add character as well. Just need to put a shaving edge on it and add it to the rotation. Just to share. Comments welcome. Thanks for looking, Austin

Attachment 258040 Attachment 258041 Attachment 258042
02-28-2017, 08:40 PM
DoughBoy68

That would really look nice with some stacked washers! I may have a set, will check if you are interested. But it does look just fine like it is. By looking at the shape of the blade, tang and monkey tail she looks to be pretty old, say the 1700's, maybe very early 1800's. Would love to find one in that good condition. Should make a great shaver!
02-28-2017, 08:57 PM
Martin103

Interesting razor for sure, glad you decided to keep the wood scales and the wild washers. Are you sure it is stamped Marsh look like 4 letters to me?
02-28-2017, 10:16 PM
ajkenne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin103

Interesting razor for sure, glad you decided to keep the wood scales and the wild washers. Are you sure it is stamped Marsh look like 4 letters to me?

Yes, it is definitely "W & T Marsh".
03-01-2017, 01:07 AM
sharptonn

If you can scrub it up a bit on the insides of the scales and get the pivot tight, all the blade would need is a light, fine steel wool detailed cleaning and light polish, Renwax.
Hone it up! Neat piece! :)
03-01-2017, 02:33 AM
ajkenne

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharptonn

If you can scrub it up a bit on the insides of the scales and get the pivot tight, all the blade would need is a light, fine steel wool detailed cleaning and light polish, Renwax.
Hone it up! Neat piece! :)

Probably will need to do a bit more cleaning up the blade. Will try the steel wool and that may even bring out the logo better. Will need to tighten the pivot as it is still loose. Don't believe the pivots are nickel silver but are steel. Peening will be interesting and know that I'll need to be careful and go slow as I don't want to crack these scales. Any suggestions or recommendations on tightening would be helpful. Thanks Tom and will try the Renwax.
03-01-2017, 02:40 AM
sharptonn

A little wad of fine steel wool clamped onto a hemostat, some WD40.
Up and down. Smash some q-tips with the hammer and use Maas or similar in between, gentle and slow.
Needs to be preserved, for certain.
03-01-2017, 11:05 AM
karlej

Great find Austin. The pins are probably old iron nails.
03-02-2017, 12:45 AM
Voidmonster

Definitely early-to-mid 1820's. It's amusing to see the Marsh brothers were in on the Old English thing too. Sheffield trades talked like it was John Barber's mark, but I think in reality it was a generic and Barber was just the one to popularize it. The first ad I've found for that slogan is this one:

The slogan goes back before Barber or the Marsh's careers. The first ad I found is from 1818 and is promoting Rodgers' Old English razors. The first John Barber ad is from 1821. More than anything, it was a style of razor with a tall, squared spine, a very particular heel and typically a long-cut shoulder. I'm a sucker for'em, myself.
03-02-2017, 12:55 AM
sharptonn

TBH, I think that is long-grained hickory?
03-02-2017, 02:06 PM
ajkenne

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharptonn

TBH, I think that is long-grained hickory?

Thanks, could very well be hickory. Certainly a strong wood great for tool handles and prominent all along the east coast. Hot this from a guy in PA but not sure it originates there. Who knows...
03-02-2017, 02:11 PM
ajkenne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voidmonster

Definitely early-to-mid 1820's. It's amusing to see the Marsh brothers were in on the Old English thing too. Sheffield trades talked like it was John Barber's mark, but I think in reality it was a generic and Barber was just the one to popularize it. The first ad I've found for that slogan is this one:

The slogan goes back before Barber or the Marsh's careers. The first ad I found is from 1818 and is promoting Rodgers' Old English razors. The first John Barber ad is from 1821. More than anything, it was a style of razor with a tall, squared spine, a very particular heel and typically a long-cut shoulder. I'm a sucker for'em, myself.

I have another similar shaped "Marsh Bros, Sheffield" razor that has "...shave well" remnants as well. Agree most of these were promotions used apparently by many of the larger cutlers.
03-02-2017, 02:25 PM
sharptonn

2 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajkenne

Thanks, could very well be hickory. Certainly a strong wood great for tool handles and prominent all along the east coast. Hot this from a guy in PA but not sure it originates there. Who knows...

Would not be the first razor from up in Pennsylvania with those!
03-02-2017, 10:52 PM
ScienceGuy

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharptonn

Would not be the first razor from up in Pennsylvania with those!

Be careful - Philadelphia was also a region just outside of Sheffield.
03-02-2017, 10:55 PM
sharptonn

Yes, I know that!;)
Seriously it's a Greaves Philadelphia razor I bought out of Pennsylvania, a real rust-bucket.
Tossed the iron nails, sanded and minwaxed the scales and pinned it back up with some old steel collars.
A friend from Philly wanted it, so back to Pennsylvania it went! :D