I've read about the "7 day" sets......was that just an expensive option of the time or was there validity to using a different razor each day?
I've read about the "7 day" sets......was that just an expensive option of the time or was there validity to using a different razor each day?
If a well honed good quality razor can last months with just good stropping, imagine how long a 7-day set will last between sharpenings.Quote:
Originally Posted by AnglesMatter
I've read that some of the sets were for persons on Foreign Service. Meaning they as military or Politicos could not be assured of a good razor if one went dull or broke. Other than that, I believe, as you suggested, the wealthy had the money and pretty bribes were in fashion.
JMO
~Richard
Could be a sales tactic by the razor makers to sell 7 razors in one go, also offer fancy high end razors to fill the sets at a higher price.
All good suggestions......thanks guys.
I foresee a nice 7 day set in my RAS* future.
*Razor Acquisition Syndrome
I wonder just how "expensive" they were for the times? They were just razors after all.:) I'm sure they weren't something that everyone had but was that because they were relatively expensive for the times or just something that most people weren't that interested in?
Just like today even among the wet shaving community. Some people have lots of razors or soaps or brushes. Other's have fewer items but it's not really because they can't afford to have more.
I do think, as was mentioned above, that they seem pretty convenient given how long you could go between maintenance honing.
A 7 day set might actually be cheaper than 7 individual razors....we see this concept all the time. Ski condos often offer "deals" if one rents a whole week and a socket set is certainly cheaper than buying each socket at a time.
I saw a leather roll of razors on ebay....the razors were average with nothing special about those. I suspect that was a lower end version. Now the highly optioned sets would have gotten pricey for sure but it one had the means, it had to be nice. *Life is nice for those that have the money these days. :p
I think it has to do with travel. Back in the day, when long distances were covered by train or boat, the folks who could afford it had immense luggage pieces and took several with them on their trip. I assume the same would be true for personal grooming implements. A 7-day set and a strop could suffice for quite a long time without having to return to the stones to freshen the edges.
My understanding is that a gentleman had a "gentleman's gentleman" who kept his clothes and accessories in good order. A sharp razor was one of those expected accessories to always be correct. Good old days...
I think it was just for the rich. They could aford high cost items so razor makers filled the bill. And the fact that honing would only need done once a year. JMO. I got a 7 day set in my collection. I just had to have one. It sits in a drawer not used by me besides once. But i got one.
The multi-day set long predates what you could call 'modern' steel -- the stuff that really took off in the 1760's with Huntsman. The razors made before then needed regular honing, so multi-day sets helped make sure there were always razors ready to use. Owning your own razor(s) was originally a sign of luxury. As late as the 1770's the Reverend John Pye paid an annual shaving contract, in Sheffield.
7 day sets were not common. They were marketed for the well heeled and often times they were top of the line pieces with fancy ornate scales and fancy boxes. It wasn't something the average Joe would ever acquire.
Most folks owned one or two razors and that was it. Even though you could put together your own 7 day set for less (just like now) once you matched and labeled them and got them in a presentation case the markup was huge. TI had a 7 day set a few years ago, they might still have it. The price will take your breath away.
Here is a modern Thiers Issard 7 day set for sale for under $2000 Canadian (ABOUT $1500 USD). Given the cost of the presentation box, the spine engraving and price to buy the razors individually, that’s not a bad price. Too rich for me, but there are folks who pay a lot for NOS individual vintage razors.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
https://www.fendrihan.ca/collections...traight-razor#
Attachment 288707
This is my 7 day set. :) It's not really a 7 day set but it's what I have ended up with after buying and selling a lot of razors and I finally decided I just wanted to end up with 7 razors total that I really liked and to sell the rest.
There are five pictured here that I'm keeping (not the one on the far left), one that isn't pictured and one that hasn't arrived yet. My total cost including the wooden cigar box is $400.
Attachment 288709
Attachment 288710
Is this it?Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Thiers-Issa...cAAOSwxN5WZvot
Here is a 7 day set from the TI web site.
https://www.thiers-issard.fr/en/stra...s-napoleon-604
Note that the handles are made of "legal" ivory. No price listed but bet it is eye watering.
Bob
Above explanation comes close to the point, I believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by bcw
Over time, I picked up two 7-day sets and they do come in handy.
Whether you had a manservant, took the set to the nearest barber to have him hone and strop the set for you, or took care of the set yourself, there was a convenience in starting the week with an entire set of razors stropped and ready to go.
And when the week was over, the set was prepped for the next week.
As mentioned earlier, it was probably something for the well off and only a few could spare the coin for it, while the rest made do with one or two razors and may only have shaved 2-3 times a week.
Rising at 5 am, I certainly do appreciate an opportunity to save a few minutes — although it does not go as far as reaching for a can of shaving foam and a system razor. :)
A 7-day set comes equally handy for travels. Firstly, many came with a suitable razor case that made it easy to pack them safely in a suitcase, and secondly depending on trip length there was no need to pack a strop.
B.
Check this out guys...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCSECOzKszE
beluga,
No need for a strop? Reason enough right there!
A few years back DOVO produced a seven day set of 5/8 Round point Pearlex. Many years ago, before I started straight razor shaving I saw a seven day set, dont Re the brand but I remember they were German. They had genuine elephant ivory hand carved scales. They had never been used. They were made in the late 1800s and came in a beautiful Mahogany Velvet lined case. No scratches on the case. This was 1979 I think. The lady wanted $500.00 and I nearly bought them just for a collectible. I have quite a few razors. I keep 8 razors shave ready and shave with a different one each day so the edge on my razor last a long long time! When the time finally comes to refresh one I tune all of them up at the same time.
Beautiful razors. I wish I hadn’t seen it. LOL.
Back in those days straight shaving was something a few folks did in the closet and you could buy any razor for next to nothing. Typical razors in good shape you had to pay for folks to take.Quote:
Originally Posted by Legman
As late as 2005 on eboy if you searched straights you got maybe 1200 razors. Now its's over 10 times that amount.
In 1964 on my way to High School every day I walked right by the Duble Duck Store without giving it a second look. Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda, or if I only knew then what I know now.
oooh...you don't have something holding the blades in place? I've been wanting to do smthg like this, but am struggling with some way to find something to hold the blades in place, can't find anything (u know, 7 day sets usually have a tray like thing with slots for the razors). Do you just use this as storage then?Quote:
Originally Posted by gcbryan
Attachment 313206
This is the 7 day set I put together but I like the first three so much they are the only ones I use now. Those three are Prezioso speciale 97 Italian razors which aren't made anymore. I have used a straight my entire life and they are the best razors I have ever used. For some reason I made the Sunday scales longer than the others, hence the bad fit
that box is awesome, did you make that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony A
Sometimes when I'm questioning what day it is, I think back to what razor I used that morning.
For a long time, it was common folklore that a razor needed to “rest” between shaves for up to 48 hours, so the fin could “grow back”. Dovo still states this in their Guidelines for Wet Shaving, as do a number of other sources.
This myth probably began with pre-modern steel that was less hard and required honing more often as stated, and even then, most probably a marketing ploy. Knowing full well that the “theory” could not be disproved, at that time.
Marketing is marketing, as the well-known lore, of the advertiser that guarantee to the Alka Seltzer company that he could double their sales overnight. He started the Plop Plop, Fiz, Fiz campaign and instructed users to take 2 tablets as opposed to one, as previously directed. Sales doubled, overnight.
So, folks using a 7-day set, were amazed at how long one could go without honing, it is just a matter of numbers, 7 razors will out shave 1 any day. Add to that, 7-day set became a status symbol and in addition to numbering were more elaborately embellished and cased as show pieces of the makers wares.
It’s just marketing.
My son made the box but I cut out the inside razor slots and covered the inside with red velvet. I also made the scales of olive wood and engraved the days of the week on brass. IQuote:
Originally Posted by Tjh
also engrave a brass name plate for box cover.
awesome. I have a box but not sure how to do the inside part, what did you do btw? Any tips? cuz it really does look great.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony A
Tjh, it is pretty simple to do. Just take a couple of pine rectangular lengths of wood. Cut to fit in the box. First cut the slots, one side for the tang and the other for the end of the scales. You will have to do a little sanding after the rough cut. Glue the in the box then cut and fit sticky felt to the flat areas. If you do that I will engrave the days of the week on a sheet of brass for you. Be sure to leave room for them.Attachment 313316
You can line a box with paper or fabric, then make a false bottom with dividers, made from foam core, wood, bookbinding board or cardboard, then drop the false bottom into the box.
It is much easier than trying to line the box with dividers. If you make dividers make them shallow or with finger cutouts so you can access the razors.
Here is a good series of box making and lining boxes from a book binder. Using his techniques. I have lined many a wooden cigar box, ($1-2), buy an extra box and it can be cut up to make dividers or custom boxes. Spanish Cedar is easy to work. Fabric, leather and paper makes a great liners.
Sage Reynolds
A thing to put in perspective is that "semainiers", or weekly sets, were not only made for razors, but for other kind of things as well.
The main usage for the word "semainier" in French designate a kind of dresser with seven drawers, so that you have a set of clothes for every day.
Then you can also find wax seals weekly sets.
I think in some case it went along some kind of "ritualized" kind of life. You can find sets in wich there are only 5 to 6 razors (because people would not shave on saturday and/or sunday)
They were OH MY GOD DAMN ARE YOU SERIOUS ? expensive.Quote:
I wonder just how "expensive" they were for the times? They were just razors after all.
We are talking times were a good tool was bought for life, and as much as possible given to your sons. Owning only one razor have been, at some times, a kind of prestige.
But more than that, while fans and ball notebooks were all the rage for the ladies, well, as far as vanity items go, men had a more reduced choice.
Therefore, some sets were sold as "expensive presents", like wedding presents for example, never to be used in their whole life for how precious they were. Some of these razors were, for example, sold in the arcades of the Palais Royal in France, for the visitors to the court of the French king in the early 19th century.
As for weekly sets being made for dignitaries or persons going abroad, I would not be so sure.
When you look at the French "necessaires" (be they necessaire de voyage (travel), or necessaire d'officier (army officer), they seldom have more than two razors.
Has there ever been any kind of empirical analysis of this? It isn't totally implausible that the very apex, after being deformed in shaving, might recover somewhat over time due to memory effects/elasticity in the steel.
Steel does have a memory and microscopically wants to go back to the original shape. You must remember that the actual cutting fin/edge, can only be seen with magnification of more than 1000 power.
To this day, Dovo recommends letting a razor rest for 48 hours to allow the burr to realign itself.
From the Dovo web site.
“We recommend that you store the straight razor in a well-ventilated place, as this is the best way to protect the metal from tarnishing or oxidation. Since the burr of the straight razor bends slightly during shaving, leave the straight razor to rest for 48 hours. During this time, the burr can realign itself”
I'm going to have to question that. Steel springs back instantly if it is not bent to the point of deformation. If it is bent to the point of deformation, then I don't think that it will slowly repair itself. Granted, it is incredibly thin at this point, so it may behave slightly differently. But I doubt it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Euclid440
If anything, I would say that they edge gets worse as it is stored due to oxidation and contamination. I always strop before I use a razor and after I use a razor. Strop before use to clean up the edge. Remove any dust or debris that may have accumulated as well as repair any damage that may have occurred. Strop after using the razor because you know darn well that you have now caused damage to the edge from cutting all that hair. If you strop after using the razor, then you have straightened the burr. I see absolutely no point in letting it "rest".
No one is saying that the edge will completely repair itself.
Steel springs back instantly if it is not bent to the point of deformation.
We are talking about a fin of metal that you can not see without 1000x magnification. Why would the fin not spring back?
Ask a machinist if metal moves. They will tell you the heat from your hands can alter a precision measurement from touching the tool or metal to be measured. As it cools it will return to the original size.
On a molecular level a lot is going on in steel that we do not, fully understand and some we do and can predict.
I do not know if anyone has documented the movement of a razor fin or can explain exactly if and why there is movement. But that is the mystery of honing, because we cannot see what happens in real time as a razor is honed or stropped.
So, is it possible? Yes, maybe.
We have a pretty good idea, but until relatively recently we did not even know what an edge looked like. (Experiments on Knife Sharpening. John D. Verhoeven, 2004)
"[I]Has there ever been any kind of empirical analysis of this? It is not totally implausible that the very apex, after being deformed in shaving, might recover somewhat over time due to memory effects/elasticity in the steel.[/I"]
No studies on fin re-alignment, that I am aware of.
I think that it could spring back if it was not taken to the point of deformation, but I would guess that it happens right away. I would be surprised if it took overnight or 48 hours as Dovo says.Quote:
We are talking about a fin of metal that you can not see without 1000x magnification. Why would the fin not spring back?
I'm fully aware of this as I have been making and heat treating knives for 30 years now. Not to mention the 20 years I spent in the maintenance departments of heavy industrial manufacturing where we "heat fit" steel parts all the time. Twelve of those years were in a metal foundry/mill. We alloyed, cast, heat treated, aged and work hardened metal. I have never seen steel move due to "resting". I have seen it move due to temperature change though, but that is temperature related not time related.Quote:
Ask a machinist if metal moves. They will tell you the heat from your hands can alter a precision measurement from touching the tool or metal to be measured. As it cools it will return to the original size.
When I was working in the factory making metal, we would artificially "age" it. This was the process of making it harder by speeding up the aging process (not to be confused with hardening and tempering). So letting metal "rest" can change its molecular structure (as in its hardness). That is well known in the metal industry. However, I have never seen it change shape by resting.
It would be fun to see if the fin re-aligns itself over time. I agree that it is possible, but my guess is that he fin moves considerably more due to temperature. Trying to correlate any movement to time, while excluding temperature variation, would prove to be challenging. Other factors such as temperature, oxidation, contamination, physical abuse (getting bumped) are going to have way more impact on the edge of a razor than time. Hence the reason to strop before and after each use.
I would be confident in saying that if you stropped your razor before and after each use, then you could use it every day (or multiple times a day if you were an old time barber) and not have to buy a second one in order to allow them to "rest" between uses.
