What is the difference between a faux frameback and a rattler? I've seen both terms used to describe the same type razors and hope someone more knowledgeable that I can clear this up especially to help the beginners so they understand..........
Printable View
What is the difference between a faux frameback and a rattler? I've seen both terms used to describe the same type razors and hope someone more knowledgeable that I can clear this up especially to help the beginners so they understand..........
I believe that real frame backs are designed with thin blades that can be inserted into a slot in the tang and locked in place with a set screw. That way one razor can accommodate several different blades and the user can replace a dull blade with a sharp one by loosening the screw. You can have a sharpened 7-day set with only a single tang that permits swapping blades in and out.
A faux frameback is similarly constructed, but the blade is welded or soldered in place permanently.
A rattler is a single grind. Here’s a pic of one for sale at Griffiths Shaving Goods.
Attachment 296142
Faux frameback is the name modern users have applied to rattler grinds.
They are one and the same.
A frameback can have replaceable blades or not. Its a 2 piece construction.
Voidmonster covered the rest.
Here's an old Joseph Rodgers Dutch Rattler that came in for honing sometime ago.
Attachment 296151
I stand corrected.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasman
Is there no distinction between framebacks with removable blades and those with permanent blades? Seems that could lead to confusion when talking about them without pictures.
Yeah, as a marketing slogan, it's messy. That's not a rattler grind. Probably a much older usage of the term. As fare as I know it's only the ones sold as 'Dutch Rattlers' that don't have a rattler grind. This is the canonical rattler grind.Quote:
Originally Posted by celticcrusader
Nope.Quote:
Originally Posted by DZEC
In fact I have a LeCoultre with a fixed blade that is otherwise identical.
It's also worth noting there are a lot of different designs of framebacks. Some have a blade inserted into a handle made of a different metal, others are just ground very thin with a brass or German silver frame to adjust honing angle. There are even some oddballs with plated tangs (the Dittmar brothers from Heilbronn), but they're all called framebacks.
And, of course, the late, great Neil Miller has already covered this extensively and authoritatively.
And in case anyone's curious, here's a link to the book Neil is talking about.
He also mentions that sometimes very large razors are honed with the spine off the stone for people with very thick beards.
I need that in my life!Quote:
Originally Posted by celticcrusader
Just keep it away from your other ear if you get it.Quote:
Originally Posted by earcutter
not to argue with the experts but; it's seem i remember reading that a real frame back is one that has the tang and spine made of one piece of metal with a blade inserted and a faux one has the blade and spine made of one piece of steel with the spine inserted over the top?
If not, than is there a different term for them?
Here y'all..!!
Attachment 296175
One thing that helps me make sense of the confusion is to apply what I know of modern advertising... and then apply the concept that there's nothing new under the son.
Advertisers are a dubious bunch! And so its hard to know which companies were simply using a catchy popular name to sell more razors.
Shavers back then were probably at times saying "uh, no, that's not a rattler, that's a space station!!!"
BUT I guess its also an assumption to presume they had fully standardized terms for the grinds back then..?
I gave up on the "Rattler" designation after I saw a Double Hollow stamped "Rattler Razor" it made zero sense after that basically near every grind had a razor called Rattler
To my eyes, there are 4 different Framebacks
#1 Removable Blade True Frameback
#2 Non-Removable Blade True Frameback
#3 Solid blade and tang with an added spine Faux Frameback
#4 Longitudinal ground Faux Frameback
That keeps it all straight for my OCD brain :p
That makes more sense to me, Glen.
That explains it. Thanks Glen.
Another thing to help explain ‘rattler’: it was a description of the sound the razor made when shaving. So any razor that made a loud noise when shaving was, to the ear of the 19th century shaver, a rattler. It’s a case of usage changing a little bit. Now rattle implies a very un-shaving-like action, whereas up until the advent of radio, roughly, it was more of a word describing a sound (radio, and ‘static’ seems to have been a pressure on word usage if you look at a Google NGram of the two words, but the correlation is weak).
that was the explanation I understood also Zak
It Rattled over the beard..
Thanks guys, now I'm totally confused. All this time I thought a Rattler was a poisonous snake.....he! he!
These rattlers can also bite. Sometimes they bite before rattling!Quote:
Originally Posted by DoughBoy68
~Richard
That would make sense: ‘Dutch’ in English from this period meaning false or underhand, as in ‘Dutch Courage’, ‘Going Dutch’ etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Voidmonster
