help to identification antique razor blade

hello everyone!
information is required for the reconstruction and building of the handle
year century any information
thanks to everybody!

Interesting razor, but honestly I doubt that you have enough steel left there to make restoration practical. As for age, I can only guess as it doesn't conform exactly to a style I am familiar with, but my guess is late 18th or early 19th century. The thing is, the tails of most razors from that era were short and stubby, mostly. I am also guessing that it was not made by a major manufacturer or in a major razor producing city or region. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable than me will recognize it and reply. Do you have any information on where it might have been made? I am thinking that it might not be European origin, nor American. Not Asian. Really just going by instinct here. I see you are in Israel. MIght this have been made somewhere in the MIddle East or possibly North Africa? I would almost bet money that it was a one-off forged by a blacksmith who did not specialize in razors.

A straight razor does not have a handle. A handle is an extension of a tool meant to give the user something to grip and apply force and leverage with. A razor has scales. The only purpose of the scales is to protect the edge of the razor when closed, as the edge is extremely delicate and fragile. You don't grip the razor by the scales to use it, and so they are not a handle. The scales have a wedge that spreads them apart at a slight angle, and makes a space for the razor to fit when it is closed up. When the tips of the scales are pressed back together on the pivot of the razor, this forms a slight bow in the scales and helps the tips to squeeze inward and prevent the razor and scales from flopping about the pivot.

It is possible/likely that your razor's scales would have been horn, and the wedge possibly lead. There are other materials that might have been used. Wood, bone, ivory, etc. They would have been held together with pins having mushroom shaped heads peened into them. The process would be easier to explain if you were familiar with straight razors and how they are used and maintained. Re-scaling a razor as part of a restoration is not a trivial exercise and would best be done by some experienced person. However, there is no point, if the razor itself can't be restored to a reasonable standard of appearance and usability, and as I said before, I don't think you have enough steel left there, for a good restoration. Of course I could be wrong. The first step in evaluating the razor would be to remove all of the rust, down to white steel. or at least down to the white with the deep pitting still there. In doing so, you would have destroyed the razor's display value, should it prove to be unsalvageable.

If you really want to do something with this razor, here is my suggestion, if you have deep pockets. There are quite a few razorsmiths capable of making an exact copy of your razor as it most likely appeared when new, and making it in every respect, shave-ready, perfectly usable. Cost would almost certainly be under $2k possibly as little as half that. A lot depending on the reputation of the maker, and how many orders he has already lined up. You might find a hobbyist willing to do it for not much more than the value of the materials. So you end up with a working copy of the razor as originally made, and you still have the original in its present condition, to mount in a display. Make a nice display case for it, and keep the copy with it. Do your research and determine the likely origin and approximate year it was made. It would make a great heirloom to pass down to future generations.

Thanks for your detailed (and impressive!) reply.

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Originally Posted by CrescentCityRazors

If you really want to do something with this razor, here is my suggestion, if you have deep pockets. There are quite a few razorsmiths capable of making an exact copy of your razor as it most likely appeared when new, and making it in every respect, shave-ready, perfectly usable. Cost would almost certainly be under $2k possibly as little as half that. A lot depending on the reputation of the maker, and how many orders he has already lined up. You might find a hobbyist willing to do it for not much more than the value of the materials. So you end up with a working copy of the razor as originally made, and you still have the original in its present condition, to mount in a display. Make a nice display case for it, and keep the copy with it. Do your research and determine the likely origin and approximate year it was made. It would make a great heirloom to pass down to future generations.

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Since Oleg is in Israel, might I suggest that he contact a well-known and -regarded SRP member, Manah (aka אלקס צייטלין), who lives in Katzrin? I'm pretty sure he can help with this, one way or another.

Looks like a very old one, maybe from the 1600's. ZAK has shown some of these old treasuries in the stub-tailed-shavers thread, post 366 here:
https://sharprazorpalace.com/razor-c...havers-37.html

Regards Peter

Based on Renzo Jardella's book (see p.8 for reference), I'd say this razor is of MUCH earlier period - 11-12th century.
This is a terrific find - congrats!

this is not from Israel found somewhere in europe
and I don't need a master for restoration and reconstruction
I'm a craftsman myself
I just need information about the shape and style of the handle
thank you for your participation and willingness to help!
it's nice to meet good people

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Originally Posted by dimab

Based on Renzo Jardella's book (see p.8 for reference), I'd say this razor is of MUCH earlier period - 11-12th century.
This is a terrific find - congrats!

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where can I find this book?
and you're right it will be a beautiful thing for my museum display thank you!

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Originally Posted by oleg

where can I find this book?
and you're right it will be a beautiful thing for my museum display thank you!

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It's out of print, but he himself is selling it on eBay from time to time. His nickname there is "safetiesfirst".
Where did you stumbled upon this razor BTW - just curious:)

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Originally Posted by hatzicho

Looks like a very old one, maybe from the 1600's. ZAK has shown some of these old treasuries in the stub-tailed-shavers thread, post 366 here:
https://sharprazorpalace.com/razor-c...havers-37.html

Regards Peter

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yes you're right very similar
I also found similar ones

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Originally Posted by dimab

It's out of print, but he himself is selling it on eBay from time to time. His nickname there is "safetiesfirst".
Where did you stumbled upon this razor BTW - just curious:)

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I found her on ebay
I'm constantly looking for something to restore:)
my nb.tel 0547548238

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Originally Posted by dimab

Based on Renzo Jardella's book (see p.8 for reference), I'd say this razor is of MUCH earlier period - 11-12th century.
This is a terrific find - congrats!

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Fascinating! I wasn't aware that folding razors were made so long ago. That book must be a very interesting read.

Here is an extraction of a picture showing typical medical instruments in the early 17th century. Found in the book "The surgeons mate" from John Woodal - 1617.

Attachment 338776

The handle here is shown as a simple wood handle, made from one piece of wood with a closed end and a cut notch. The razor blade hold with a Pivot pin, maybe simply a nail hammered flat and rounded at both edges. Those handles were common as a cheap and easy possibility also for 18th century razors until beginning 19th century.

Here are some examples of 18th and 19th century razors with simple wood handles:

Attachment 338777

So maybe an option for you preparing a new-old handle.
Of course for the more exclusive razors, bone and later horn was also common for the scales.

Regards Peter

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hatzicho

Here is an extraction of a picture showing typical medical instruments in the early 17th century. Found in the book "The surgeons mate" from John Woodal - 1617.

Attachment 338776

The handle here is shown as a simple wood handle, made from one piece of wood with a closed end and a cut notch. The razor blade hold with a Pivot pin, maybe simply a nail hammered flat and rounded at both edges. Those handles were common as a cheap and easy possibility also for 18th century razors until beginning 19th century.

Here are some examples of 18th and 19th century razors with simple wood handles:

Attachment 338777

So maybe an option for you preparing a new-old handle.
Of course for the more exclusive razors, bone and later horn was also common for the scales.

Regards Peter

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thank you! I'm planning on bronze and bone only the wood is boring :-}

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Originally Posted by CrescentCityRazors

Fascinating! I wasn't aware that folding razors were made so long ago. That book must be a very interesting read.

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Indeed: his book is based on his personal collection - which is entirely on another (museum+) level!

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Originally Posted by oleg

thank you! I'm planning on bronze and bone only the wood is boring :-}

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If you want to be period-accurate, and not use wood, I'd say bone (bovine) is the right choice.

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Originally Posted by dimab

If you want to be period-accurate, and not use wood, I'd say bone (bovine) is the right choice.

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I decided exactly like this
bone with copper washers

This thread blows my mind. It is amazing that a razor could be 1000 years old and have survived in any form let alone a form that can be clad in period appropriate scales.

Oleg, can we see photos of some of your other razors?

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Originally Posted by dimab

If you want to be period-accurate, and not use wood, I'd say bone (bovine) is the right choice.

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Originally Posted by oleg

I decided exactly like this
bone with copper washers

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And the pins? Silver or brass? As well, what kind of washers? Bullseye? Flat? So many choices!

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Originally Posted by DZEC

This thread blows my mind. It is amazing that a razor could be 1000 years old and have survived in any form let alone a form that can be clad in period appropriate scales.

Oleg, can we see photos of some of your other razors?

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I don't collect razors
but I collect other things and I really like to made and restore something
in the photo there are both my products and restoration and reconstruction

Nice! Pre WWII, tin/metal toys are very collectible here in the states. Many were recycled during WWII.
HarryWally would have liked the goggles. :p

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Originally Posted by JBHoren

And the pins? Silver or brass? As well, what kind of washers? Bullseye? Flat? So many choices!

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when it's ready you'll see

Thank you for sharing. That is quite a varied collection! It contains some very interesting and quite rare pieces.

SRP has members who are also eclectic acquirers and will be very interested in your post.

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Originally Posted by oleg

when it's ready you'll see

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נחיה ונראה

That is a VERY cool find and almost certainly very old, just based on my 'gut feeling' of trying to research these for a while I would say 1500s-1600s. See also this piece from 1572, from a museum in Nürnberg Germany:

Attachment 339348

As for original scales, it's hard to say. I could imagine that wood may very well be an original period appropriate material, especially based on drawings from some of the period books.

Some more images I have collected over the years (sadly mostly without higher resolution or much context):

Attachment 339349

Attachment 339350

Attachment 339351

Attachment 339352

Attachment 339353