Inoue Tosuke Razors - The Real McCoy

There has been some debate and confusion over the authenticity of the Master Inoue Tosuke razors purchased by forum members (B&B and SRP). While the razors made by his associates are still top quality, some people would like to know if their razor is a real Tosuke razor. Here are 8 different imprints (not logos) on authentic Tosuke razors. This is not a complete list but it's a start. Compare these pictures with your razor. Regards.

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/803/1app0.jpghttp://img206.imageshack.us/img206/8922/1bqc7.jpg

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3720/2ahp4.jpghttp://img296.imageshack.us/img296/8869/2bpy8.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/3693/3axu3.jpghttp://img86.imageshack.us/img86/5632/3bdq8.jpg

http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/7125/4aek8.jpghttp://img247.imageshack.us/img247/9405/4bps4.jpg

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/5980/5aml9.jpghttp://img247.imageshack.us/img247/1884/5blr9.jpg

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1607/6amt2.jpghttp://img148.imageshack.us/img148/8826/6bha2.jpg

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/7453/7alh3.jpghttp://img341.imageshack.us/img341/3784/7bmq1.jpg

http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/4029/8ahe7.jpghttp://img245.imageshack.us/img245/6595/8bki9.jpg

I'm still somewhat confused, it would probably help if I could actually read Japanese, but I can't find any elements that are common between all 8 of those.

I'm also somewhat surprised that he doesn't have the exact same logo, just in a different place or whatever. Even artists and people that do pottery and such try to avoid changing their logo or signature so that their work can be more easily recognized. Maybe it is a possibility that some or most of the "true" Tosuke razors are just made under his direction? By apprentices and such?

I recently received a couple Tosuke handled razors, and while I like them very much, they shave excellent and seem high quality...I'm not so sure it's a true Tosuke.

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Originally Posted by Droshi

I'm still somewhat confused, it would probably help if I could actually read Japanese, but I can't find any elements that are common between all 8 of those.

I'm also somewhat surprised that he doesn't have the exact same logo, just in a different place or whatever. Even artists and people that do pottery and such try to avoid changing their logo or signature so that their work can be more easily recognized. Maybe it is a possibility that some or most of the "true" Tosuke razors are just made under his direction? By apprentices and such?

I recently received a couple Tosuke handled razors, and while I like them very much, they shave excellent and seem high quality...I'm not so sure it's a true Tosuke.

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The markings on the razors aren't logos (I fixed that in my original post). They're his name and/or the metal used and/or a sign indicating how the metal was forged. However, your point about apprentices (or associates) making his razors under his direction is certainly a possibility. Tosuke is the only knifemaker to have his own handles mass-produced. He could've stamped his name, attached a handle, yet commissioned someone else to actually do the work.

I like the thought that in japan they want england steel like we in england want japan steel.

the grass is always greener!:)

From the moment I first saw them I felt it is a shame that Tosukis are equipped w/ such tacky looking blue plastic handles.

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Originally Posted by Kees

From the moment I first saw them I felt it is a shame that Tosukis are equipped w/ such tacky looking blue plastic handles.

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Ditto. Is the razor in the second series of pictures what all Tosukes look like without the blue handles? If so, why not take them off?

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Originally Posted by Kees

From the moment I first saw them I felt it is a shame that Tosukis are equipped w/ such tacky looking blue plastic handles.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by SteveS

Ditto. Is the razor in the second series of pictures what all Tosukes look like without the blue handles? If so, why not take them off?

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I'm not sure of why he started using these handles but I do know you can take them off. Perhaps it was for English buyers. For Japanese buyers, all the necessary information is already written right on the blade.

Thanks for the pics...they REALLY clarify a bunch of questions I had that nobody could answer....:tu


BTW, the blue handles are actually quite nice and I find them to be very comfortable....not cheap at all. I thihnk they come off cheap looking because the "Tosuke" imprint has that handmade look.

http://razorland55.free.fr/razorama_...zor_Tosuke.jpg

WOW, that's a nice one!

Here are two razors like that one. The second one doesn't have the rattan handle.

http://aycu31.webshots.com/image/486...1286697_rs.jpg

http://aycu18.webshots.com/image/485...1797882_rs.jpg

Where are people buying the Tosuke razors? I'm pretty curious about them myself.

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Originally Posted by They Call Me Blockhead

Where are people buying the Tosuke razors? I'm pretty curious about them myself.

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I don't know where everyone else is getting theirs but I get them from a friend in Japan. I've bought three in the last 2 weeks for people. I'm getting another one in 2 weeks for someone else.

http://aycu05.webshots.com/image/480...3738916_rs.jpg



http://aycu07.webshots.com/image/495...4953654_rs.jpg

I'm fairly certain that most of these razors are not made by master Inoue himself. Does that mean they aren't just as quality? I happen to think they are fairly equivalent.

The rattan handled one in post #14 I believe is the same maker as the ones in post #16. I have the ones in post #16.

Also...to me in looks like the 2nd razor in post #14 is an Iwasaki.

Overall...I think I'm more confused by the whole subject than when I started. But it would be nice to have someone translate the markings on all those razors, and find out the common elements. As stated what should be written is who actually forged and ground the razor, and the type of steel used. But it's possible that master Inoue forged/heat treated all of them, and someone else ground and finished them. It's somewhat ambiguous, and maybe we'll never know for sure.

Either way, mine make amazing shavers.

Hi all,

The kanji characters for Inoue are: 井上　These two characters are clearly seen as stamps in the steel of many of the original pictures shown. This may or may not be helpful as Japan has a tradition of apprentices taking on the master's name after death/retirement to carry on the tradition of the "school." I'm not familiar enough with Master Inoue's apprentice system so I cannot comment for sure that this is the case here, but I can say without much difficulty that Master Inoue's name is imprinted on several of those blades.

BTW, whoever said the second picture was an Iwasaki was correct. The paper wrapping has Iwasaki (岩崎）written clearly in Kanji.

John

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Originally Posted by Droshi

Also...to me in looks like the 2nd razor in post #14 is an Iwasaki.

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Originally Posted by Grendelsan

BTW, whoever said the second picture was an Iwasaki was correct. The paper wrapping has Iwasaki (岩崎）written clearly in Kanji.

John

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I forgot to respond to Droshi's post but yes, it is an Iwasaki. It's a very expensive Iwasaki at that. Here's another one:

That... is... gorgeous.

It's like a hunk of metal fell from the sky 10,000 years ago, and the smartest of all the cavemen went "hmmmmmm" and made it into the sharpest thing in the world. Besides Chuck Norris' teeth.

Hello Telly, maybe you can answer this question pertaining to the stamps on an Iwasaki razor, I have seen 3 stamps and I also have seen 5 stamps on the blade.
Do you by any chance know the difference? And how do you know what type of steel is being used? Most sell for around $300 - $350, but some have been sold for as high as $1750 (if my memory doesn't fail), are the stamps different or the paperwork, if any, delivered with the razor? Thanks in advance

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Originally Posted by RMV

Hello Telly, maybe you can answer this question pertaining to the stamps on an Iwasaki razor, I have seen 3 stamps and I also have seen 5 stamps on the blade.
Do you by any chance know the difference? And how do you know what type of steel is being used? Most sell for around $300 - $350, but some have been sold for as high as $1750 (if my memory doesn't fail), are the stamps different or the paperwork, if any, delivered with the razor? Thanks in advance

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Three points...

#1: Not every Iwasaki razor is made by Master Iwasaki. Some razors are made by his pupil, Mr. Mizouchi.

#2: The 3-stamp razor means it's a normal Iwasaki razor made of Swedish steel. The 5-stamp razor means it's a special Iwasaki razor made of Tamahagane. Swedish steel is mass produced; Tamahagane is made using raw materials the way they made steel for swords in the ancient times of Shoguns and Samurai. Swedish steel is very good but it doesn't compare to Tamahagane.

#3: Only Master Iwasaki can forge Tamahagane to make his razors. His pupil, Mr. Mizouchi, cannot (at least, not well) so he makes Iwasaki razors using Swedish steel. Five-stamp razors are harder to make and rarer, making them much more valuable. If you have a 5-stamp razor, Iwasaki himself definitely made that razor. If you have a 3-stamp razor, Iwasaki or Izouchi could've made the razor.

Regards.

http://aycu04.webshots.com/image/476...0316425_rs.jpg http://aycu22.webshots.com/image/492...8524414_rs.jpg

Tamahagane also carries another issue with it.
Only licensed swordsmiths are allowed to buy it and use it.
It gets distributed by age, meaning oldest and most experienced smiths get first pick. For outsiders it is virtually impossible to get hold of sword quality tamahagane because its use is regulated by law.

And tamahagane is so rare (because of how it is made) that it is very expensive. The best stuff gets put into swords and tantos.

I didn't know about the 3 / 5 stamp thing, but I do know that there are at least 3 types of Iwasaki forged razor.

The normal one of swedish steel which goes for around 300$.
The longer one which is also swedish steel, but a different type I think (not sure. I think thebigspendur knows more) which goes for 400 / 500$
The tamahagane one, which goes for 1750$ or more.

Tamahagne may or may not be superior to swedish steel but it is cool.

My money is on the swedish steel for superiority in quality.

It's probably pretty hard to compare just these two steel types without getting a sample of each. But in general the old Japanese way of producing steel was vastly superior for it's time.

These days steel is quite easily controlled down to billet form, now it's just more about selecting the proper steel for your application if you ask me. Still Tamahagne would be pretty cool because of it's traditional factor, worth the money? Not to me, but each to his own :)

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Originally Posted by RobertFontaine

Tamahagne may or may not be superior to swedish steel but it is cool.

My money is on the swedish steel for superiority in quality.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Droshi

It's probably pretty hard to compare just these two steel types without getting a sample of each. But in general the old Japanese way of producing steel was vastly superior for it's time.

These days steel is quite easily controlled down to billet form, now it's just more about selecting the proper steel for your application if you ask me. Still Tamahagne would be pretty cool because of it's traditional factor, worth the money? Not to me, but each to his own :)

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Swedish steel is of excellent quality. Don't get me wrong. IMHO, Tamahagane is still better. I haven't seen it in regards to Iwasaki razors but I have dealt with it profusely in regards to Japanese swords. The swords are beyond reproach. Perhaps the Tamahagane razors don't match up to Swedish razors - I don't know. However, I feel Tamahagane steel is better than Swedish steel, at least in regards to making swords. (Yes, I know we're talking about razors...)

There's an auction on Yahoo Japan Auctions of a Tamahagane Iwasaki razor. The starting bid is $500 USD. I expect the final bid to be way passed $1,000.

http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f66692537

incase anyone is interested :)

3 days left I think