Why shaving with the featherlite blade is the better than the rest

Hi guys! I know I am going to provoke a reaction to this, but I have to say it: Shaving with the Feather artist club Disposable straight razor is BETTER than non disposable blades. Here are the reasons: First, I think that learning on the Featherlite as I have done is the best possible thing you can do. There are simply no sharper blades then the FeatherClubs. I haven't come across any non disposable blade that is nearly as sharp. If you can master shaving with the Feather club(which I don't think I can honestly say that I have), then anything else is child's play. So, for the pure ART of the shave, I think that the Feather artist club master is the true artist. THUSLY, he is more BAD ASS, and let's face it: most of us shave with Straight razors because it is manly as hell, and there is a sad sad lack of manliness in the world today. Next, I would add that the razor itself is pure art in its design. It is perfectly designed to adapt to every person's individual style and do it well, it's balance is perfect, and its light weight is excellent. I have read a ton of posts where people say "it just seems flimsy" or "there seems like there is nothing there." Like this is a BAD Thing??! It is SUPPOSED to be light, the "flimsiness" is actually an extremely fine edge, for the closest shave possible. Thusly, you get a closer shave, another reason. Finally, no stropping.. Yes yes, I know the purests claim to "love to strop" but Come on, the manliness and art of shaving begins and ends with the shave itself, stropping is just extra busiwork, time I'd rather spend on something else, like learning to master the Featherlite!!


Agree? Disagree? Why? (full disclosure, I am thinking of having a custom Zowata straight designed as a keepsake)

Also, for those who don't know what kind of straight razor I am talking about I have attached a link to a picture: http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.c...op_2037_250410

Ok... let me be the first to have a crack at it.
I understand what you are saying, but somehow I just feel that you are missing the whole point of using a straight razor (a real one, I mean...). There's more to it that just shaving. That's my point of view. I enjoy stropping and prepping and all the things related. I understand that you think that the feather is the ultimate in shave closeness. Ok. Good for you. But you are missing out on a lot, my friend. But to each its own and as long as you are having fun and getting a good shave...

Now, concerning the Bad Ass thing: why? Why does this keep coming up?! Just because it's a sharp blade it doesn't make you a hooligan! To me the straight razor represents the ultimate in deportment and gentlemanly behaviour. And a gentleman is not bad ass... I seem to stumble upon the bad ass argument too often. I just might be a bit old fashioned, then, if I find this to be a thing of gentlemen... maybe I'm wrong.

"Ok... let me be the first to have a crack at it.
I understand what you are saying, but somehow I just feel that you are missing the whole point of using a straight razor (a real one, I mean...). There's more to it that just shaving. That's my point of view. I enjoy stropping and prepping and all the things related. I understand that you think that the feather is the ultimate in shave closeness. Ok. Good for you. But you are missing out on a lot, my friend. But to each its own and as long as you are having fun and getting a good shave...

Now, concerning the Bad Ass thing: why? Why does this keep coming up?! Just because it's a sharp blade it doesn't make you a hooligan! To me the straight razor represents the ultimate in deportment and gentlemanly behaviour. And a gentleman is not bad ass... I seem to stumble upon the bad ass argument too often. I just might be a bit old fashioned, then, if I find this to be a thing of gentlemen... maybe I'm wrong."


Before this goes to far on this track, let me explain a few things: This is a discussion board and I have listed the pro's for the Feather artist club, so if you want to give pros and cons for one or the other have at it, but I quite clearly listed the "pros" for the Feather artist club. Your rebuttal was mostly reduced to a general statement tantamount to "you are wrong." Secondly, I resent the implication that the Feather artist club is not a "real straight razor." Is it not straight? is it not a razor? Is it not handled? Does one not use it the same way with the exception of stropping?

As to the "bad ass" comment, you are either missing the spirit of my post, or you have no sense of humor, or it is lost in translation. I do not mean to insult you with this statement. I am only interpreting why other people are using this word to describe it, but when I use it, it is meant to be in fun. However, Bad Ass would just describe the masculinity of this method of shaving in this case. It has nothing at all to do with being gentlemanly or not. Bad ass simply as stand in metaphor for "more masculine" and not "hooligan". I don't think that I am wrong in believing that most men who shave with a straight razor do it because it is somewhat of a lost art that represents a certain masculinity. It is a connection with something that is strictly within the domain of being Male and nothing else. Women have Makeup, nails, facials (although some men do this too, NOT FOR ME!! ), etc. etc. With the shaving technology available today, there is absolutely no reason to use a straight razor for only the purposes of getting a close shave. I can get a close shave with a Mach 5 razor. But for me, it is less of a challenge, and it is too fast to derive any sense of connection with the "manliness aspect." I understand that everyone has their reasons, but I am old school in many ways, I believe in traditional values, I am a bodybuilder, I own a business and work hard to provide for my family, I believe very much in being my own man. ANd I believe that I am a "bad ass" AND a "gentleman." My guess is that if we took a poll of straight razor users, we would find that many of us have these things in common.

So thanks for your comment, I hope I clarified my position and would love to hear some more. I am sure there are a lot of people who disagree with me and have their reasons for it.

If shaving with disposables is your thing have at it. I myself enjoy the art of the straight.

I like straights because of:
1: the way they look (so many are pieces of art, especially the restores)
2: the process of the shave.. it is very relaxing to go through the strop, lather, shave process.
3: the fact that I will be able to pass these two century old blades down to my son, and he will still be able to get the same great shave I get today (and he will be able to learn something about history... just like I have).
4: the projects I get into (making my own brushes, scales, etc.).

For me it's a hobby, not just a way to get my face smooth... I could get laser procedures done so that I never had to shave again but I enjoy my hobby too much.

Of all my friends and family who know I shave with a straight razor, none of them necessarily think of it as "bad ass." Nor do I think of myself that way. Those who know either think of it as backwards or else just plain crazy behavior to shave with a straight razor. I suppose one could make an argument for manliness because one is pressing an unrestrained blade to one's face and throat, but realistically wouldn't it be just as manly to grow a full beard -which is not only what differentiates men from boys but also women? It's all relative, I guess.

But there is a sort of ritual associated with it. Showering, beard prep, stropping, hot towels, etc., and all are involving. One spends a lot of time and energy engaging in an archaic ritual where time stands still. There isn't a lot of the "make it happen" mentality associated with it. It's almost meditative. It's luxury. Now, that doesn't interest everyone, but it interests me. I spend all day rushing and trying to make things happen. Shaving now is elevated to a hobby, almost an art form, and I get to relax and let it happen.

Also, I have total control over the process, from how sharp the blade is, to the thickness of the lather, to the closeness of the shave. I like that. It's elegant and gentlemanly, as mentioned. There is a skill necessary for proper execution. It's not like the cartridge "system." There is also a bit of experimentation involved. I like those things, too.

In addition, I think of modern society as disposable. So many things are meant to be used and discarded. We live in a time now where if it's old, it's no good any more, the new is better just because it's new; where if there's maintenance involved, it's not worth the trouble to have it, whatever it is. I think that's a symptom of our society, where everything must be done or gotten in an instant. Is food really better just because it can be made and served in seconds? Not necessarily. Is a product better because the maintenance aspect has been taken away? Not necessarily. Is an experience better simply because it can be done quicker and with less effort or skill? Not necessarily (think sex, here).

I can't knock it if someone has found a great shave with a disposable-blade razor, and that same person no longer has to do things like stropping, etc. which they didn't really enjoy anyway. That person has acheived a kind of liberation. But some of us found the same kind of liberation by committing to the ritual. While some may have been freed by no longer having to maintain the blade, some of us delight in the maintenance.

So far, I have never shaved with a feather razor. But I don't plan to. It seems to me to be a cross between the straight and the disposable blades. And that disposable aspect taints the thing for me. Personally, if I want a disposable blade razor, I'll go for a safety razor.

And as for closeness of the shave...let me put it this way: Yesterday I had the best, closest shave I have ever had. I learned the exact angle I need to go ATG on the third pass to get a perfect shave. No irritation, either. And my face was left perfectly smooth, even in the "problem" areas like my chin. It doesn't get any closer, and this was with a blade I had to strop. (100 times is my norm.)

Like I said, if you have found your perfect way, I'm happy for you. But my perfect way includes the maintenance, the attention to detail, the preparation and ritual, the blade in which I am invested, and the magic of time standing still for me.:cool:

I agree, if shaving with the disposable Feather blades in the Feather AC holder works best for you, than you've found your niche.

I have shaved with the Feather AC and the Feather pro-super blades. I prefer my edges that I create to be keen but with such a miniscule amount of forgiveness (you can define "forgiveness" in this context however you'd like) that unless I make a boneheaded move, I can glide my blade lightly over my face without the ever conscious and ever cautious awareness I needed with a Feather to avoid nicks and weepers.

Also, I often enjoy shaving with a extra hollow grind razors in addition to the stiffer grinds. A feather AC with whatever Feather blade you'd like to insert into it is not as flexible as a full or extra hollow. They're pretty rigid.

Sorry man, I like stropping and honing. Wait, I retract my apology. I like stropping and honing.

Finally, as fpessanha said, this "bad ass" thing comes up. Invariably on the occasions it is mentioned as a reason for shaving with a straight, it's brought up by newcomers to this method of shaving. I can honestly say whether it's believed or not, that looking, feeling or otherwise being "bad ass" while shaving with a straight was never and has never been a reason I shave this way. Seriously. To me it's simply the ultimate way to shave which allows me full control of the shave both in the maintainance and tool I select and how I use it. Being close to 40 maybe makes a difference.

Chris L

Chris L

Why shaving with the feather Artist Club blade is better than the rest for me.

Title fixed. :D

There's more to it than just shaving, as someone said. Whatever holds an attraction for you go for it.

Laser hair removal is probably better than the rest - including the Feather AC - for giving a pure clean-cut appearance. But it doesn't hold much appeal for most men, including yourself I imagine.

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

So, for the pure ART of the shave, I think that the Feather artist club master is the true artist. THUSLY, he is more BAD ASS, and let's face it: most of us shave with Straight razors because it is manly as hell, and there is a sad sad lack of manliness in the world today.

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

However, Bad Ass would just describe the masculinity of this method of shaving in this case. It has nothing at all to do with being gentlemanly or not. Bad ass simply as stand in metaphor for "more masculine" and not "hooligan". I don't think that I am wrong in believing that most men who shave with a straight razor do it because it is somewhat of a lost art that represents a certain masculinity. It is a connection with something that is strictly within the domain of being Male and nothing else. Women have Makeup, nails, facials (although some men do this too, NOT FOR ME!! ).

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I probably misunderstood what you said but it still sounds like the bad ass/manly part is pretty important to you. By the way, there are a good number of women on here shaving with straights.

For the other points, I really like the fact that I'm using something that I maintained, and/or honed, and/or cleaned up. That has a lot of appeal to me. Like spending a couple of hours cutting up an old boot to hand sew a custom leather belt loop on the back of my cell phone case 'cause the one that came on it wasn't exactly to my liking. Then there's the attraction of using something "classic" and the connection with the past. Then there's the visual appeal and feel of something solid and timeless that (real or imagined) required some old world/hand craftsmanship to make.

Egads. You do realize that this, an internet forum, is a place of pure words, right? The words you use convey everything that we know about you. So when you come to this board and say, "My way is the best way becuase it is most bad-ass and the manliest", the only conclusion I can draw is that you are 1. obsessed with being "bad assed" and 2. your goals are thus out of synch with my own and I have no time for you. I am a traditional wetshaver becuase i want to enjoy my shave, I want to touch base with tradition, and I am interested in the old rituals that used to be a part of every man's life.

I have no problem with the Feather. (NOT the featherlite. Please. If you want to fight, bring the right tools...) I think they're lovely machines, and I am interested in picking one up.

But "bad ass"? Please.

I sure like my Shavette (I use feather DE blades) and would probably love the featherlite...

Being better is just a matter of what your goals are..
Most of the time my goal is a comfortable shave without nicks or irritations.. if its a BBS shave.. all the better..but thats not my goal..if thats my goal the Shavette(or featherlite) would not be the best tool for the job. I would chose a real straight.
Sometimes my goal is just to get the hairs removed from my face as quick as possible.. in that case the Shavette could well be my tool of choice to reach that goal.

If bad assnes is your goal and in your opinion that is measured by the sharpness off the blade.. well maybe the featherlite is the lbest tool for you..

I dont shave with a straight for bad-assness... and I dont think it is particularly manly to spend half an hour pampering in the bathroom..growing a beard and not combing your hair is more manly IMO.

Maarten

I think its cool too. Do whatever you like. It does surprise me that you equate the FeatherLite with being bad-ass.

Does that mean that if they stop producing the blades for your disposible that you become a pansy? The first rule I learned about being a bad-ass was not to allow anyone to be in a position to remove you. Trust me, its in the book they give you when you become a bad-ass.

Most of my buds made "bad-ass" in combat zones, you're the first to do so in a bathroom; that in itself is a miracle. Just make sure if you whip that thing out in a bar fight that it has a blade in it. ;)

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Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL

Is a feather not a real straight razor? No it is not, real straight razors do not have disposable blades. A feather is only better for the sake of convenience, you don't need to hone or strop the blades.

I started out with a feather, and I too thought that no blade would ever compare to that of a feather, but once I gained more experience, I soon found that you can get a real straight, almost as sharp as a feather. I had one get as sharp as a feather professional blade, but I didn't like it because it reduced the quality of the shave.

I recommend you first gain experience with shaving with these new implements before making such claims. Get a real straight which has been honed by an experienced person, practice with it and you will come to learn that it is much better than shaving with a disposable blade razor. I'm not saying you are wrong, because you can certainly get good shaves from feathers no doubt about it, but you can also get just as good and sometimes better shaves with a real straight once you have experience.

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+1 I totaly agree!
I am shaving with real straights for 33 years. It was my first shaving instrument -my grandfather was a barber- and I don't believe that it is possible to get a better shave with anything else.
I am not fan of the ultimate sharpness for a quality shave
I dont like the feeling of a shavette or a feather and believe me I have the experience.
And I like to adjust razor sharpness with my hones to get the most comfortable shave ( this is imposible with other shaving instruments )
For those reasons I am shaving with straights and I am a happy father with 2 sons both shaving with real straights...

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

Before this goes to far on this track, let me explain a few things: This is a discussion board and I have listed the pro's for the Feather artist club, so if you want to give pros and cons for one or the other have at it, but I quite clearly listed the "pros" for the Feather artist club. Your rebuttal was mostly reduced to a general statement tantamount to "you are wrong." Secondly, I resent the implication that the Feather artist club is not a "real straight razor." Is it not straight? is it not a razor? Is it not handled? Does one not use it the same way with the exception of stropping?

As to the "bad ass" comment, you are either missing the spirit of my post, or you have no sense of humor, or it is lost in translation. I do not mean to insult you with this statement. I am only interpreting why other people are using this word to describe it, but when I use it, it is meant to be in fun. However, Bad Ass would just describe the masculinity of this method of shaving in this case. It has nothing at all to do with being gentlemanly or not. Bad ass simply as stand in metaphor for "more masculine" and not "hooligan". I don't think that I am wrong in believing that most men who shave with a straight razor do it because it is somewhat of a lost art that represents a certain masculinity. It is a connection with something that is strictly within the domain of being Male and nothing else. Women have Makeup, nails, facials (although some men do this too, NOT FOR ME!! ), etc. etc. With the shaving technology available today, there is absolutely no reason to use a straight razor for only the purposes of getting a close shave. I can get a close shave with a Mach 5 razor. But for me, it is less of a challenge, and it is too fast to derive any sense of connection with the "manliness aspect." I understand that everyone has their reasons, but I am old school in many ways, I believe in traditional values, I am a bodybuilder, I own a business and work hard to provide for my family, I believe very much in being my own man. ANd I believe that I am a "bad ass" AND a "gentleman." My guess is that if we took a poll of straight razor users, we would find that many of us have these things in common.

So thanks for your comment, I hope I clarified my position and would love to hear some more. I am sure there are a lot of people who disagree with me and have their reasons for it.

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Jguns: We seem to have gotten lost somewhere. I am sorry if I have offended you. I didn't want to imply that you are a hoologan or that the feather is not a "real" stright razor. By using the term "real" I wanted to refer to anyrazor with a non disposable blade... If you prefer the Feather, great! I hear it's a great razor and all... I just seem to prefer, myself, a non disposable blade straight razor.

Concerning the bad ass thing: yes, I didn't understand the nature of your tone and I appologize. The thing is, we get a lot of people that like this sort of razor because it is aggresive, old school, ass kicking mumbo jumbo. I now understand that you only meant "manly"... ok, sorry. I thing it's manly too.

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Originally Posted by AFDavis11

The first rule I learned about being a bad-ass was not to allow anyone to be in a position to remove you. Trust me, its in the book they give you when you become a bad-ass.
;)

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Ha, good stuff

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

Agree? Disagree? Why?

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I cannot return to disposable. It is too late for me, regardless of how manly the disposable is

A real str8 Razor has become my main shaving tool. I enjoy honing, stropping and shaving with it. I'm really in to Traditional things. I make my own Arrows & bows, I really like to sharpen my Knives, arrow hunting heads and my razors.

Those throw away blades are ok, but when you sharpen a blade yourself you get a better feeling after your shave. Now if you light the throw away blades Kool with me, If You like the real str8 razors, Way kool with me, If you like the DE razors, again kool with me. Do it the way that makes you feel good, Try it to see if you would like a different way to shave. The steps I do when I shave makes my shaves that much better & enjoyable. Good Luck with what ever you use.

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

There are simply no sharper blades then the FeatherClubs. I haven't come across any non disposable blade that is nearly as sharp.

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Really????
Anybody with .25 and.10 diamond paste and a knowledge of honing and stropping can match it... The edge will last about as long too and be about as comfortable....
The only thing we can't do that I know of, is put the coating on the blade...

Just how many 100's of non-disposable (Real Straight) blades have you come across, and I don't remember honing an edge for you but perhaps you skipped me on this quest of sharp blades, (kind of depresses me that I wasn't chosen for this quest for sharp) and had edges done by the other honemiester's on the site, I mean for sure you had one honed by Lynn himself right?? and of course Randydance, and I bet Mparker did one for you too for these tests that you ran for comparison...

I mean no disrespect but without, something to really compare to, at least you haven't mentioned what you were comparing the disposables to, your observations really have no basis....

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Originally Posted by AFDavis11

I think its cool too. Do whatever you like. It does surprise me that you equate the FeatherLite with being bad-ass.

Does that mean that if they stop producing the blades for your disposible that you become a pansy? The first rule I learned about being a bad-ass was not to allow anyone to be in a position to remove you. Trust me, its in the book they give you when you become a bad-ass.

Most of my buds made "bad-ass" in combat zones, you're the first to do so in a bathroom; that in itself is a miracle. Just make sure if you whip that thing out in a bar fight that it has a blade in it. ;)

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:rofl2::rofl2::rofl2:

Word of advice Jguns: Being a complete newb, and then badmouthing straights(Feather does not count) is not the most clever thing to do on this forum.Listen to Glenn and gain some exp.Mabe a real straightrazor will make you feel even more manly...

Kristoffer

Ah, I see that I have struck a chord with a number of you!! That is good, because it always keeps the discussion going in interesting ways, and it sure makes the board more exciting. I have a little bit of experience with this as I own a few discussion boards of my own, and I started my first about 10 years ago, some have grown to over 80000 members. It's off topic, but on my first and most popular board, I have not posted there for over 3 years, I walked away from discussion boards because it took so much time from me, yet here I am posting on a straight razor board!! Anyway, I will try to broadly address the variety of responses I have received.

Apparently, I have come here in all of my ignorant newbieness and dared question the wisdom of the wizened sages. I do not mean not to display the proper amount of humility to those battle hardened and erudite Master's of the Craft! Please excuse my Sophism, for I am but a coarse and uncouth knave who means no offense! Someday, I too hope to be lecturing the unworldly neophyte on the correct techniques to removing the hair from one's face with a lone blade of steel, while at the same time exemplifying the proper amount of "bad assness" which I will have earned only after having single handedly defeated mine enemies on the field of combat!! How wrong I was, to believe that I had the right to that title after having stood in the bathroom and not made mincemeat of my enemies, but instead of my own FACE!! I also implore forgiveness for asserting that the razor which I use is a "straight Razor" for I now see that even though it may SEEM like a straight razor, it is but a prop for a dupe, since a real and true straight razor requires one to have spent countless hours of studying before one becomes proficient enough to recognize what exactly constitutes a straight and true straight razor. But it does not end there either, for a Real Straight Razor is apparently not defined by the fact that the razor is straight, nor that it is a blade intended for the purpose of hair removal, but is in fact defined by a complicated criterion which includes the number of hours spent stropping, the type and grade of sharpening materials for this implement, the proper display of honing technique, the years of experience at the removal of hair from one's face, and the number of "straight razors" that one owns and/or has utilized efficiently and effectively. And then, and ONLY then, after all of those factors have been entered into a special formula which only Masters of the Craft know, will I then be able to CORRECTLY Identify a straight razor! I pine for this day!!

I hope that the note of sarcasm could be detected in the above paragraph, but if not, I will make sure to precede future communications with clear labels so as not to confuse.

Anyhoo, back to the topic of the post. I meant to provoke a discussion on this topic as over the months that I have visited this site, I have many times seen the Feather artist club blade discussed in a negative light. I bought one myself several months back and have been using it ever since. I have also read a lot on the other type of blades and I felt that it would be interesting to see what would happen if I posted about the positive aspects of the Feather club blade. It seems to me that on this board, and any board, there are many of the type who become so involved in the topic at hand that they are always at the ready to demean and demote anything that does not fit into what their version of "purity." I was curious about this as well because after all, the only difference between this and the others is the simple fact that the blade is removable. But in terms of the process of shaving itself, it takes as much if not more skill to achieve a perfect shave with this blade as it does with any other. But many belittle this blade for the simple fact that one does not sharpen the blade themselves. Personally, I don't think that constitutes the definition of a straight razor, but apparently there are many that do. That is a whole topic of discussion in and of itself! I also don't claim to be an expert, but I wonder if there are times when some individuals ever sit back and consider the silliness of belittling those who disagree with them on the topic of shaving with a straight razor! I realize that those who visit this site are very interested in this topic, and have spent a ton of time on it, but it is worth reminding that we are talking about HAIR REMOVAL! At the turn of the century, I suspect that the length of time a man spent talking about a razor was limited to "Dern fred, cut yourself good that time didn't ye?!" "Yep, I got a peek at my wife's bloomers and nicked myself good!".

There are not many positive things said about the disposable straight razor here, so I thought I would start a discussion of it. I also realized that when I first made the post, I had identified the type of razor I have incorrectly, as it is a Feather Artist Club, and not the "featherlite" (although i gleaned from one response that this blade is also somehow a sign of a shaver to be defrocked and cast out). At any rate, there are definitely pros and cons to both, and room for each in the pantheon of straight razors. In my mind, the real attraction to shaving this way is in the challenge of shaving and not so much in the rest, but I DO see the appeal in the other things, and I will likely find that to be true for myself when I choose to get another straight razor.

The discussion went on a little tangent when I used the term "bad ass" in regards to shaving with a straight. At the time, it was just a thrown out word, with tongue planted firmly in cheek, but that too was a point of contention so I will address that as well. I don't believe that I am wrong when I say that MOST men who use a straight razor were attracted to it because of what it represents. After all, there must be SOME reason why one would choose to devote the time and effort to shaving when the razor technology has advanced to the degree that it has. I am sure that there are any number of reasons, and for most, SEVERAL reasons. But I don't think that I am wrong when I say that it is a distinctly masculine exercise. I don't think that people are being truthful to themselves when they claim that this has no bearing WHATSOEVER on why they chose this "hobby." Some claim that it is the honing and stropping that attracts them to this, but I would say that when one FIRST looked into straight razor shaving, the thing that grabbed them first was NOT honing and stropping. There are not many images in society of the process of honing and stropping for one, and I don't think many people would look at the process first and then say "man I have to shave with a straight because THAT is for me!" I think that you find out later that you enjoy this process but it is not what grabbed you in the first place (furthermore, evidence of the appeal to masculinity can be seen in the explosion of straight razor shaving after exposure in Maxim magazine and a recent television appearance). It may be worthwhile for some to examine these things via your own introspection, but I don't think that it is a bad thing to claim that the masculine or maleness of this hobby attracts you. In fact, I think that society today denigrates and demeans masculinity, that the world is feminizing the male. This is all to apparent in some of the reactions to this concept. I, for one, stand against this along with a number of others. I also applaud this activity, and this site for venerating this activity, because I think it is a GOOD THING. This has nothing to do with kicking ass, or being a jerk, but for many the suggestion of masculinity immediately triggers that connotation. I would not act a coward from behind the safety of my computer to assert my fighting prowess. I don't think that is honorable, and I think that talk is cheap. So if I came across that way, I apologize. However, I will say that I would be comfortable saying anything that I say on the computer to any ones' face, but in any case, I am not one to start a fight, or even seek one. that said, I am not afraid to get hit,or do the hitting with bad odds, and unfortunately I have plenty of experience with that (which I am not proud of). In the end, when that happens win or lose it is still STUPID.

I do believe that this type of shaving is a connection with a man of ages past, I do believe that it puts men in touch with some of those things that make up just being a guy. I think that is great. I also agree that the process of shaving itself is rewarding in that it is a challenge, and it is fun to try new techniques, and you feel great when you do it right. as an aside, I also think that those things are distinctly male traits. I have been a body builder for over 15 years, and I see parallels between the two. For one they both challenge yourself, it is you against you! They are also things that you always seek to maser, for in body building you require great discipline, and you must go through a lot of pain to get results, and you are always challenging yourself more and more. I think may would agree that straight razor shaving has those things in common. Body builders and the activity itself is a very individual thing, and you will find that many people who do it pride themselves on their individuality, my guess is that many here are the same way. Does it make you "bad ass?" I say "yes" if you mean by bad ass that you are doing something that few would do because it is hard, and often painful. How many times has someone seen you shave and said "wow, I could never do that I would chop my face up!" or something similar? That is the one I hear the most next to: "you don't see that much anymore!" Which also validates my earlier point about a connection to an earlier time. So there are many reasons, but I believe there are some pretty universal ones. I also believe that people who share a similar passion also find they have much in common in terms of values, beliefs, and interests. I think that applies here too.

For those that made valid points on the merits of shaving with a disposable straight vs a non disposable straight, I think that I agree with most. I am thinking of getting a custom Zawoda blade done, and the reason for this right now is because it will be a keepsake I will always have and that is pretty attractive. I even hope that someday my own boys might try shaving this way. I will probably learn to like stropping and honing too, as I see in that activity some of the same type of "challenge" and satisfaction one gets from shaving. I know that I am a novice, I never pretended to be otherwise. My wife thinks its pretty funny when I come out of the bathroom after having watched another video and trying a new technique with blood running down my face! I can't help but laugh too! what the hell am I thinking?! Well, I think we all know what I am thinking, and I am looking forward to chopping my face tomorrow. The cuts should be healed by then. ;)


And to fpessanha: Thanks for your very "genteel" response! ;) I hope that this post clarifies what I meant a bit more as well.
Thanks to everyone for responding, would love to hear more!! :)

Straight shaving is not only about hair removal.Many of the guys at this forum both collect and restore old straights.To define a straight razor by the criteria of it being straight, and therfore call the feather a straight razor is to simple.There is an art to producing a handforged item as this.And thats what this forum is all about.A bunch of guys that shaves, collects, hones and restores straight razors.That enjoy talking about them and exchanging information.Honing, restoring and even shaving with a straight razor is about skills that takes years and years to master.In my book, that deserve respect.Therefore you will have to anticipate some reaction, when you go out loudmouth on issues in wich you have very limited knowledge.You should spend some time in the forum to read and watch what some of these guys can do,pretty amazing!That is why I don't find your sarcastic tone appropriate.I meen why post something just to cause an argue?
Good luck in your endevours with straight razors.

Kristoffer

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

And to fpessanha: Thanks for your very "genteel" response! ;) I hope that this post clarifies what I meant a bit more as well.
Thanks to everyone for responding, would love to hear more!! :)

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It does clarify what you meant, Jgun. It's really nice to see that you have your train of thought on this matter perfecly lined up. That is always a treat to see. Thanks for that. I beleive you made yorself quite clear on this post. But Kristoffer and a lot of the other guys that responded to your posts are also right. Now, I beleive, we can see that your intent was the best, meaning, stating the pros of the feather blade. This just degenerated into something else... glad to see its back on track. But you have to understand that it's not nice to rain on anyone's parade... not that you did, but it sure looked like you were about to! ;) I recall a thread that got really really hot at some point: a new guy came in and started a thread with the title "straight razors are rubbish"... now you can imagine what happened, right? We all got pretty worked up, especialy the most active guys in here, guys that answer every question, that read every post not because they have nothing better to do, but because they are commited to this. So I guess you can understand where we all stand... of course you have no way to know this.
I certainly hope that no missunderstanding remains.
Therefore let me be the first to say WELCOME to this place!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fpessanha

It does clarify what you meant, Jgun. It's really nice to see that you have your train of thought on this matter perfecly lined up. That is always a treat to see. Thanks for that. I beleive you made yorself quite clear on this post. But Kristoffer and a lot of the other guys that responded to your posts are also right. Now, I beleive, we can see that your intent was the best, meaning, stating the pros of the feather blade. This just degenerated into something else... glad to see its back on track. But you have to understand that it's not nice to rain on anyone's parade... not that you did, but it sure looked like you were about to! ;) I recall a thread that got really really hot at some point: a new guy came in and started a thread with the title "straight razors are rubbish"... now you can imagine what happened, right? We all got pretty worked up, especialy the most active guys in here, guys that answer every question, that read every post not because they have nothing better to do, but because they are commited to this. So I guess you can understand where we all stand... of course you have no way to know this.
I certainly hope that no missunderstanding remains.
Therefore let me be the first to say WELCOME to this place!

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Thanks for the words and the PM fp!

I am well familiar with the passion that people have for a hobby and the way that passion can come out in the best and worst ways. Lord knows I have done and said all of them! It stands to be pointed out though that it makes my point about the masculinity factor when we can see the results in bruised ego's and territorial ****ing's (urinating)right?! haha, all in good fun.

But let me say this as a board owner myself: Post count does not equal respectability, nor intelligence. In another life years ago there were what we called "post whores" who used to post as much as they could, so that in six months they could be re invented as "experts". I don't know if that occurs here or not, but it is an interesting phenomena. WHere I used to hang we would hotly debate scientific studies, spending hours and hours dissecting volumes of data, often contradictory. It is very interesting to come here and see the same thing, yet over something so seemingly mundane as shaving. But obviously, none of us believe that shaving with a straight razor is mundane! However, I would believe that some perspective is in order. If I post here, I will not offer ad hominem attacks, but to the previous poster, I feel that my sarcasm was well deserved.

Kristoffer, you made some valid points about why you like straight razors, but then you demeaned yourself by belittling MY choice of razor, while at the same time claiming what you didn't like about me was that you felt I was doing that to others (which I pretty well explained my position I believe). Then you resorted to the tried and true ad hominem attack, calling me a "loudmouth." And here you also apparently believe this to be so because I had the temerity to extol the virtues of the Feather club, which in your mind is beneath you. So, there you base your opinion on post count,and you offer yourself as an elitist, and I am sorry, but that is a bit pretentious.

Is that what this board is? Is it a place where you need to use the "right kind" of razor? Is it a place where when you post enough and brag about how many razors you own you are elevated? For some, it is, but I suspect that for the silent majority, it is not. I have read this board without posting or even as a registered user for awhile. I have found a lot of knowledge here, but when I bought my feather Club I was excited to read about it, and what I found was pretty much contained in this thread. I found that interesting and decided to post what I thought were the merits of the blade. I have seen a fewpeople actually post some interesting comments and the rest, not so much.

I am new to shaving this way but I know more than most people about boards. It is more interesting to have different viewpoints, then a few who decide for the rest what the viewpoints should be. If you want to have a place that is fun to come to, maybe some should lighten up. Just my .02 (oh, would it help if I mention that I have collectively over 20,0000 posts, just not here, probably not... SIGH) ;)


PS- the Feather Club Artist rules and is a real straight razor. So far, nothing has changed my mind, but I am thinking that stropping is the key to enlightenment (a JOKE, sheesh!)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

maybe some should lighten up. Just my .02

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lol :roflmao:rofl2:

PS add 1 to my post count :rock:

I think things got a bit out of hand here guns, even though I think I see where you are comming from. Your first post had some interesting points and you gave straight users an opportunity to explain why they prefer non-disposable blades, but it started off in a very antagonistic way. It seemed like you were making a post (on a site dedicated to the old fashioned straight razor) telling everyone why their razors were inferior. Like a ford user going on a chevy forum and telling everyone why their machine was better... of course people are going to react.

I can only speak for myself and I listed the reasons why I like my old straights... I have not tried a feather, but I get a bbs shave with my razors. Add that to the other reasons I like straights and I am comfortable where I am. I think that it is a valid point that some of the senior members have raised... it could be that you have not had a straight as sharp as the feather, but maybe they have. Anyways, for what it's worth I think that many posters have raised some good reasons why they prefer the non-disposable blades, confrontational language aside.
:shrug:
for what it's worth

Ok, since you want other people's opinion I would submit my refute to your statement.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

Shaving with the Feather artist club Disposable straight razor is BETTER than non disposable blades. Here are the reasons:

First, I think that learning on the Featherlite as I have done is the best possible thing you can do. There are simply no sharper blades then the FeatherClubs. I haven't come across any non disposable blade that is nearly as sharp. If you can master shaving with the Feather club(which I don't think I can honestly say that I have), then anything else is child's play. So, for the pure ART of the shave, I think that the Feather artist club master is the true artist.

This has been demonstrated to be wrong - many people's hand-honed edges are just as sharp at the Feather ones. Please submit your proof. I would like to see micrographs of the edges of people who were mentioned previously along with ones for the feather edges.
On my end I would point you to the infamous article by Verhoeven et. al.

However, not only your facts, but your logic is flawed as well: I do not see why shaving with the 'sharpest possible edge' is the most challenging thing in the world, making anything else a child's play. I would argue that far more challenging is shaving with a dull blade, say dull as in butter knife dull. I would submit that if one masters shaving with that edge, any edge sharper than it would be a child's play. If you think that is prohibitively dull, let's use the minimum sharpness that ensures a hair would be cut - I suppose that's about order of magnitude smaller than the thickness of the hair, so let's say 5micrometers.

My own opinion is that the best edge to learn on is somewhere in the middle between the sharpest possible and the dullest possible.

THUSLY, he is more BAD ASS, and let's face it: most of us shave with Straight razors because it is manly as hell, and there is a sad sad lack of manliness in the world today.

So if I would to wield an AFM tip I would be the ultimate bad-ass? There is sharp for the sake of sharpness and there is functionally useful for the task at hand.
You would also have to provide some support that 'most people shave with straight razors because of insufficient testosterone level'.

Next, I would add that the razor itself is pure art in its design. It is perfectly designed to adapt to every person's individual style and do it well, it's balance is perfect, and its light weight is excellent. I have read a ton of posts where people say "it just seems flimsy" or "there seems like there is nothing there." Like this is a BAD Thing??! It is SUPPOSED to be light, the "flimsiness" is actually an extremely fine edge, for the closest shave possible.

Some people actually prefer razors with substance, apart from the ever changing fads. I think extending your idea of 'perfection' to an absolute applicable to anyone else is where your (and many others') problem is.

Thusly, you get a closer shave, another reason.

I know plenty of people who get equally close shaves with other razors, and more enjoyable ones as well.

Finally, no stropping.. Yes yes, I know the purests claim to "love to strop" but Come on, the manliness and art of shaving begins and ends with the shave itself,

Really? "That's just... your opinion... man."

stropping is just extra busiwork, time I'd rather spend on something else, like learning to master the Featherlite!!

Well statistically you're an odd ball. A lot of people actually do the stropping, the honing, the restoration, the collecting, because they enjoy these things.

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I'm trying to find something to convince myself that this isn't a classic troll. I really am :w

I'll throw in my last 2 cents and then I'm out.

I've been on this forum for a bit of time. Although you'll see the occasional barb against shaving with "cans of goo" and mega multi bladed cartridge razors, etc, unless I'm blind to it, I don't feel the consensus among members on SRP is that shaving with a traditional straight razor (non-disposable) is so utterly superior in form, function and ideology that any other shaving method is not only inferior, but wrong headed. I could care less if a man chooses to shave in any other way. Or to put a more positive spin on it for the glass half full crowd, I think ANY method a man prefers to use to shave his face is great for him and more power to em.

YOU on the other hand appear to be telling me that my method of shaving with a traditional straight razor is inferior to the Feather. I guess I don't get it. I must be one of the luddites you make subtle reference to.:shrug:

Chris L

Oh, and yeah, I agree, Quick; I can't help but think Forzato sold his defective Norton combo stone and other straight razor gear, bought a Feather and has reincarnated himself.

I too enjoy the process, even the truncated (by some guys on heres standards) process I use (hot water, only apply more lather as needed, single passes unless needed etc.) I enjoy taking something that is older than my great-grandfather and shaving with it. wondering how many faces in how many places its seen. Do I honestly tell a difference in smoothness between it and my 3 blade disposables of yesterday (and I hate to admit, every once in a while when I sleep a bit too long and run short on time)?? No, not really. not that I personally can tell at least. but I was explaining to my wife the other day, and she understood, that the 20 minutes or so I spend shaving is for me a reset, it is what some people achieve with meditation. for that time period my head is empty, other than the shave. Probably saves me money for a shrink. :D

As to being a bad ass. Bad ass is not something you can create, sure, you can approximate it, you can pretend. but in the end being a bad ass is just like being cool. You are or you aren't. Am I cool? kinda I guess. Am I a bad ass, yes. I'm bad ass whether I shave with a shard of glass or a woman's shavy thing. do I notice my bad assedness more when using the straight? sure, but is that the razor or because I have more time to carefully look at my handsome face in the mirror? I don't know. ;) I do enjoy knowing that if I screw up I'll notice it.

Red
PS
I too have been a member on other boards. many of them have an ignore feature. I can set people on there then when I read threads their posts don't show at all. How come this board doesn't have that feature?

Jguns, first, I do agree with you that post count is does not necessarily convey knowledge. However, I have found that most people that post consistently on this forum do so because they DO have the knowledge and like sharing it.
Second, while I agree that many people probably do INITIALLY get into straight shaving because it's manly, not all do. I got into it becaue I had a straight shave at a barbers shop and it felt very enjoyable to me. I thought I would give it a try, and although I can get a smooth shave with my mach3, I find that a straight provides me with less irritation, and yes, once I began to aquire some experience, a closer shave.
As to the advantage of a Feather, I cannot comment, as I have not had the opportunity to try one. However, I would bet that those who finish their blades on a 30000 grit stone or with a paste can get them as sharp as a Feather. In any case, I don't really think it matters as to whether or not the blade is that sharp, but rather what your own personal preferances are. Some people prefer a wedge grind, some people a more hollow grind. Obviously shaving with only a Feather doesn't allow you this flexibility. Not to say that it doesn't have its advantages.
Personally, I really enjoy stropping, because it forces me to give the lather time to sit on my face and hydrate my wiskars, and it relaxes me. That being said, if it is not something that appeals to you, as I'm can easily see that it is not for everyone, then thats fine.
I do consider a Feather REAL straight, but not a TRADITIONAL one, and the heritage of this hobby is what it has become. I recently started grinding a blade on my Double Arrow to customize it to my liking, something that I couldn't do with a Feather.
I don't want to seem like I am criticising you, as I am not in a position to, but I would be curious to see what other razors you have tried. Many of the people who have thousands of posts on here have also tried thousands of razors, so they have an amazing comparison basis. This is not to say that you don't, but I would be interested to know what you are comparing the Feather to, in your personal experience that is.
For me personally, I do intend to try a Feather, but I think that I enjoy the other aspects of shaving with and maintaining a traditional straight too much to want to change.

JGUNS,

You write eloquently. That suggests at least some intelligence. Hence it puzzles me that you make such deficient arguments.
Your ongoing obsession with "manliness" post after post is largely based on bogus assumptions about what it takes to be an honorable representative of the male gender. Luckily I don't consider myself a real man, nor have I that ambition, or else I would be quite insulted by your caveman claim on masculinity.
What makes someone a "true man" is impossible to define. Clint Eastwood seems to qualify, so I've heard. He even made a brilliant cinematographic career out of it. But no other male has ever become truly manly by copying Clint's behavior. That would only turn you into The Schofield Kid, wouldn't it?
Being a real man might lead you to shaving with a straight razor or it might lead you to growing a beard. But doing those things as such won't turn you anymore into a real guy, as wearing a dress turns you into a woman.
As a final note about this topic that you seem to find so important: I've never met a "true man" that worried about being one or showed the least urge to define himself as one...

Now, about the heart of the matter:
I can't compare a disposable straight razor to a genuine straight razor. I never shaved with a disposable straight. I like genuine straights because of the craftiness of their use and maintenance, because of their tradition and aesthetics, and because they are lasting items in a throw-away world. Disposable straights fail on a number of these factors, so I'm not interested.
From a purely shaving viewpoint, I am sure that they perform well. A face can only be so smooth, and I think the DE, the disposable straight, the genuine straight, and why not, the cartridge razor all offer a complete smooth result, when in capable hands. Other than jokingly, I hardly ever read diminishing statements about the other shaving tools on SRP. The tone of your post in favor of the Feather, is quite an ungentlemanly breach with that trend.

As for your wish to provoke and have discussion for the sake of discussion itself, I think you have come to the wrong place.
You seem a master in innuendo, redefining the contents of words if that gets you off the hook, and making sarcastic disrespectful remarks. Insulting someone, and then tell him he cannot take it as an insult, is insulting him twice. Insulting a group of people and then tell them they have no sense of humor if they can't accept your insults is a cowards act.

I have made over a 1000 posts on this forum. First because I needed to learn, later because I like to share the knowledge that I have gained, and why not admit it, because it feels good to earn respect for that. That doesn't mean that I, or the other persons that frequent this forum think about our hobby as the single most important thing in the world, as you seem to suggest.
I don't need to post here to have a life. And I certainly don't need to write long posts that are primarily full of myself in order to boost my ego. It is allready bad enough that I have to read such posts.
Please read my signature lines.

Bart.

Debate may be interesting, but it always pays to follow some ground rules:

- don't confuse personal opinion with fact. You use the word 'is' as if to indicate fact, where you statement is really an opinion.
- don't assume that we all have the same reasons for using straights.
- don't assume that there are no other criteria for a razor than 'sharp'.
- try to explain you point of view and how you come to a conclusion, instead of making rash statements that may convey the same information, but seem to be made for the purpose of provocation. I don't like provocational debate.

Opening a discussion like you did in real life would have a significant chance of you ending up on the side walk, trying to open your swollen eyes in order to look for your teeth.
Just because this is the internet doesn't mean that you should forget your manners.

Reasoned debate is fine. Being needlessly rude and provocative is not.

Posting like you did in this thread would normally have me throw you out, at least temporarily.
But our members already replied and got into the argument, so my good deed for today will be not to ban you. Keep the above points in mind and you will be just fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Red

I too have been a member on other boards. many of them have an ignore feature. I can set people on there then when I read threads their posts don't show at all. How come this board doesn't have that feature?

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It does! :tu

empowering the individual,

Lee

I have a Feather Disposable and have tried it on many occasions. I have always found that the blades although sharp, are very unforgiving. With the slightest pressure and sometimes not, I have ended up nicked all over the place and especially under my chin where a nice scar from my youth resides. I do not get these kinds of nicks with a real straight razor and always get a really sticky close shave.

In addition, I find that the machined blades, much like the DE's leave my skin really feeling rougher and more dried out than the straight razor.

This of course is just my personal feelings and findings and as the other guys have said, If you like it the best then that is what is good for you. Now, if I could only find some wisdom and wizeness..............:shrug:

All the best,

Lynn

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JGUNS

PS- the Feather Club Artist rules and is a real straight razor. So far, nothing has changed my mind

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Maybe you should contact the manufacturers and inform them that they are misnaming their own product - even they do not describe the Club Artist as a straight razor on their website.

Maybe you should also take your own advice about lightening up. :gl: