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I am wondering if there is a test that I can do to be able to tell if a pair of scales are real ortoise shell or imitation? Can someone here tell me just by looking at some pictures or is there a special trick like that one with the needle for the ivory?
Yes to all of the above? Sometimes it is very clear visually, but other times additional tests are helpful. Can you get us pictures of the faces of the scales, as well as the sides so we can judge thickness?
Here are the pics. Let me know please who ever can tell. Thanks
:dropjaw: What a beautiful razor
Try the pin test. Heat a pin (has to be red hot) and touch the scale (preferably on the INSIDE so you dont ruin the razor) and smell. If it smells like burning plastic - it probably is. If it smell like burning bone - It's probably not synthetic. The same is true for Ivory - but Ivory tends to smell like burning tooth (that icky smell you sometimes catch a wiff of at the dentists....).
Beuitful piece by the way.
Good luck.... :)
That's my razor up on the bay, here's the thread where I determined it to be real
http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...ell-scale.html
Here's another pic of this razor
http://imgur.com/V0uuS.jpg
For anyone thinking to outbid me on this razor you should know that this razor is cursed so stay away for your own good. :mace: I am %100 sure that who ever owns this razor will get ingrown hairs and no one wants that. I'm only bidding on this because I know a special incantation that will release the razor from it's cursed. :boohoo:
FOrtunately for you, Justacat, I'm out of razor-buying money for the month.... ;)
Hope you win her! She's a beautiful razor and (no offense Chayes) with a bit of buffing to get the scuffs out, those scales will shine even more!
Bad news, Justacat.... I think I'm gonna go mortgage my family...
:matrix: :medvl::tameshigiri::chop::overkill: ... you get the picture what will happen if you outbid me :roflmao.Quote:
Originally Posted by BKratchmer
Well, the bank just called back and apparently you can't get a fourth mortgage on sisters. Jerks. ;)
No offence taken at all & even easily explainable!Quote:
Originally Posted by BKratchmer
My number 1 rule after killing a few nice razors, DO NO HARM. I cleaned it up but I came to a point where my minimal skills in working with scales forced me to stop and enjoy it as it was. I know that I could have done more buffing & cleaning but I could also just as easily damage what I find to be a beautiful razor.
Exactly- and I understand totally! I wouldn't get near those scales for a thousand bucks myself, but if I were buying it I could think of some people who would... but yes, I think the minimalist approach is always good! I would turn them into tortoiseshell powder with a buffer in about .025 milliseconds. Take THAT Google!Quote:
Originally Posted by ChayesFSS
This one's plastic.Quote:
Originally Posted by justacat
+1 on that. Its far 2 consistent to be tortoise shell, and I reckon i can make out at least one celluloid bubble
Ok now I am so confused. I guess I can never be sure unless I check them myself however I do not want to gamble a big amount. The only reason I will ever consider such a razor will be if the scales will be real shell. So I will just place a low bid and if I will get it and it's not real shell maybe at least will be a decent shaver and if it won't be that either than the garbage can can have it. Thank you for the last 2 posts, this helped me decide on the maximum amount I am willing to risk with this razor so please no body here bid on this item if possible. Thx
? what the heck leads you to say this? There is no way the scales are plasticQuote:
Originally Posted by gugi
Scipio, I'd appericate if you took one of the pictures and pointed out this 'bubble'. I've taken a red hot pin to these scales and gotten nothing. What kind of celluloid does this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Scipio
And I thought that the other posts got me so confused. Imagine what is in my head now. Anyway I have decided on the bid that I want to put in. I am not going to say if it will be a big or a small bid but one think is for sure. I will bid on this razor and hopefully I will win it. If I will get this razor I will send it to 2 different experts to check the scales and I will post the results here. Also I will try myself all the known tests to see if this is real shell and I will also post the results here ... and if the wining bider will not be me hopefully the one that will win it will read this post and he will do the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChayesFSS
Could you do it after the auction ends? If you prove beyond doubt that this is real shell than everybody will want to have this razor. The current situation is favorable for me as I have my bid placed and I am not related with Bill Gates so I kept my bid under one gadzillion dollars.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChayesFSS
I'm now second guessing myself. I did a smoke test again, even had my wife verify that the smell was different than plastic scales. I looked through the light and see numbers in each side, I've taken pictures of both sides. I really don't know what to think now. Best to pull the plug on the auction until I'm 110% one way or the other.
http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/fil...4/IMG_3963.JPG
http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/fil...4/IMG_3961.JPG
http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/fil...4/IMG_3960.JPG
http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/fil...4/IMG_3966.JPG
http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/fil...4/IMG_3965.JPG
Well... what those numbers mean? I have no idea. Can anyone explain this to me pls. Thx
To me, it just adds doubt, more doubt than anything else.Quote:
Originally Posted by justacat
Forgive me for my opinion, however i do not believe this is shell. I have owned a shell razor before and it did not resemble this. It was more like horn. If you zoom in to the extent that you have done, the fibres which are like strands of tightly packed hair should be visible.
In my experience, shell razors are often Sheffield, not German. That does not mean to say they are exclusive to Sheffield, just I havent yet seen a German made one - and judging by looks, most shell razors I have seen are a little older than this one, many of them being made prior to the evolution of celluloids.
As with ivory, the hot pin test can be used to determine or certaintly deduce what a material may be.
I have read from ivory experts that the test can be inaccurate, as the hot pin must be red hot and touched to the material immediately. If not, the results can be skewed with false impressions/conclusions.
I've gone ahead and cancelled the auction. I've always been 100% honest in my listings and refuse to sell something under possible false pretenses.
I want to say that I sincerely appreciate the doubts raised by the members here
Why are you selling it anyway, looks like a good shaver
I've just got too many, impossible to shave with them all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scipio
I know the feeling. I should get ebaying myself...
Yea, I ended up keeping it for almost another year, love it but put it back up, this time as imitationQuote:
Originally Posted by Scipio
Numbers like those pictured, and in some cases longer are usually manufacturing process references. It could be the mold used to cast the scale, a specific type of process, an inspection station, a specific person in the manufacturing or something along those lines. Here I would guess that it refers to a mold used to cast the scale but the low numbers has me wondering.Quote:
Originally Posted by justacat
Back to the material, With the metal on the scales I really doubt they are tortoise, hard to tell by the pics but if the metal is inlay (flush with the top surface of the scales) I doubt tortoise even more.
I have one genuine torty and in looking up info on the internet I found that the real stuff is laminated with heat and pressure. I know mine are the real McCoy because they are delaminating in a few small areas. Check out the edges for any delamination.
no, I don't think it's real anymore. The new auction reflects thatQuote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
I think you are lucky it's not tortoise shell because if it was real from what I understand of the laws at present if you wanted to sell it to an over seas buyer it would need to be certified by CITES if it was not it would be confiscated by customs at the border. Its the same with Ivory and the rules are tight too.
Say you had a razor with genuine antique ivory scales and they were cracked you could get some old antique ivory piano keys or old ivory ruler and cut some new scales out of them but this would mean getting certificate would not be possible and to sell it out side your country or taking it abroard on holiday with you would be illegal because you have somthing from an endangered animal even though it is made from parts at a time when it was allowed.
These rules are in place to stop the illegal poaching of these endangered animals and the countrys that import these goods use dubious methods to make them look antique and what has been discribed above is one of the methods they use.
So I think you are lucky not have the real deal. plus if you wanted to get somthing certified you will have to pay a fee after you have proven that it meets the criteria set out by CITES.
And for anyone who has antique scales on their 100 year old straight from a now endangered animal you might want to have a look here just so you don't fall foul of the law should you want to sell it on to an overseas buyer.
Welcome to CITES
And I never sell genuine ivory on the bay...honest! I always just list it as 'a creamy white organic material relating to pacaderms that is definitely not bone...!' Most people can tell pretty much just by pics as the keratin grain of Schraeger lines is often apparent...well I can anyways if it is elephant ivory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Evin
Quote:
Originally Posted by justacat
There are a number of incantations, some secret some not so.....
Mine begins with
Hooooonnnnnnn....
Hooooonnnnnnnem.. fineee
About 25 times then like a frog on the
Budweiser commercials
CrOx.... CrOx.... about 50 times.... the last 15 so quietly it is hard to hear....
I picked up a well old Joesph Rodgers & Son's razor with cracked Ivory handle and was thinking about getting a lump of antique Ivory that could be used to make a replacement set of scale when I was looking around the web I came across the CITES site and found out this would have got me into alot of trouble traveling around Europe on me holidays. So I'm getting them fitted with faux ivor scale it does not matter there only gonna get covered in shaving soap anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scipio
I'd love to get a real tortoise shell scaled razor but I can't pick one from an ebay listing so unless someone I trust lists one for sale then I'll just have to wanting one.