Wacker Jungmeister

So for the last year I keep seeing this one razor in a case at the Antique Mall just around the corner from my house. It has what appear to be black plastic scales with a silver inlay script of "Jungmeister". I have mostly ignored it as the price is above the mark I was willing to pay for something I knew little about. Now that I am being more active on this board I have come to find out, after a bit of random curious searching, that it is a Wacker and therefore quite well respected. Unfortunately I have had a hard time discerning what exactly Wacker blades are. I think from what I have read that they are recent regrinds of old blanks and there are no true vintage Wacker razors. Can anyone direct me to some history on the name or just fill me in? It seems that they are highly respected though and I am itching for a more hollow ground razor (which it appears to be from what I have seen) of late.

Regardless I plan on stopping back by there after work today and finally asking to see the razor in person to check out if it is a clean and NOS-y outside of the scales as it appears to be.

I don't know where the blanks come from, but I do know they are highly regarded razors. My understanding is that Wacker is the last truly masterful grinder in Germany.

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Originally Posted by Muirtach

So for the last year I keep seeing this one razor in a case at the Antique Mall just around the corner from my house. It has what appear to be black plastic scales with a silver inlay script of "Jungmeister". I have mostly ignored it as the price is above the mark I was willing to pay for something I knew little about. Now that I am being more active on this board I have come to find out, after a bit of random curious searching, that it is a Wacker and therefore quite well respected. Unfortunately I have had a hard time discerning what exactly Wacker blades are. I think from what I have read that they are recent regrinds of old blanks and there are no true vintage Wacker razors. Can anyone direct me to some history on the name or just fill me in? It seems that they are highly respected though and I am itching for a more hollow ground razor (which it appears to be from what I have seen) of late.

Regardless I plan on stopping back by there after work today and finally asking to see the razor in person to check out if it is a clean and NOS-y outside of the scales as it appears to be.

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Muirtach, I bought my Jungmeister directly from Shaving Shop. They have a line of Wacker razors for sale. You might want to look into this before paying a visit to your nearby store, their website: www.shavingshop.com. My Jungmeister does not have plastic scales; but rather is a three pin horn scales and it is a fantastic shaver; matter of fact my next shaver will be a Wacker. Good luck

So the current Wackers are being ground out of old blanks. I have also seen that the name has been in razors for a few generations. Do we know if the current ones are using new names or retouching on old ones? Say for example that the Jungmeister I have seen is from his father's era and the current ones are just keeping the naming tradition going.

Conjecture on my part of course.

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Originally Posted by Muirtach

So for the last year I keep seeing this one razor in a case at the Antique Mall just around the corner from my house. It has what appear to be black plastic scales with a silver inlay script of "Jungmeister". I have mostly ignored it as the price is above the mark I was willing to pay for something I knew little about. Now that I am being more active on this board I have come to find out, after a bit of random curious searching, that it is a Wacker and therefore quite well respected. Unfortunately I have had a hard time discerning what exactly Wacker blades are. I think from what I have read that they are recent regrinds of old blanks and there are no true vintage Wacker razors. Can anyone direct me to some history on the name or just fill me in? It seems that they are highly respected though and I am itching for a more hollow ground razor (which it appears to be from what I have seen) of late.

Regardless I plan on stopping back by there after work today and finally asking to see the razor in person to check out if it is a clean and NOS-y outside of the scales as it appears to be.

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They are not "regrinds" - some are old blanks that have been recently ground. A regrind is an old razor that is honed out but still salvagable if the blade is reground, or an old wedge that is hollowed out. All production razors are ground from forged razor blanks. To get one that is not ground from a blank you must go to one of the custom razor makers. Having said that, Wacker also grinds recently forged blanks now too.

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Originally Posted by Muirtach

So the current Wackers are being ground out of old blanks. I have also seen that the name has been in razors for a few generations. Do we know if the current ones are using new names or retouching on old ones? Say for example that the Jungmeister I have seen is from his father's era and the current ones are just keeping the naming tradition going.

Conjecture on my part of course.

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Jungmeister is one of Heribert Wackers family brands. Sometimes when he locates a blank or group of blanks from companies whose trademark is now public domain he will grind and decorate them and with others like Bartmann and Dorko he has permission of the trademark owners to make their brand razors. There are a lot of new blanks being forged in Solingen now because the supply of old blanks has diminished significantly.

Thanks John. I'll go check it out tomorrow and see if it is in good condition. Seems like a solid rep either way.

Well I finally got a chance to head back over there today. The razor is in pretty much NOS condition. It appears that it is an older one though as the case reads Karl Wacker and not Heribert. 13/16ths round point full hollow. Tang reads "Silber Stahl Solingen". The Solingen is not much of a surprise. There is some gold wash on the blade and it reads "Acero Plata" with a crown in the middle. Jimps on the bottom and top with teh top jimps being on the edges and not covering the whole thing.The original price was marked at 185 down to 125 and I talked the seller down to 105. Seems like a good deal and after I clean the edge up I wil take some images.

So was Karl his father or grandfather? :D

Just to clear up any confusion.........

Really the only regrinds out there are like a W&B Wedge with a totally flattened spine that is actually reground to a more hollow ground razor.

What is normally referred to as a regrind really is not. Whether old stock or new, razors are or were typically drop forged other than those being cut from bar stock by the custom guys.. These blanks so to speak are what are being ground to the finished state. I guess they can actually be called new grinds...........

Have fun,

Lynn

Here are the pictures. Far different from the rest of my stable, which is mostly wedge or 1/4 grind Sheffield with a nice 1/4 Henckels in there too.

very nice!

Looks like ya done good! I dont know if we could consider them production or semi custom/hand made but they are tops as shavers.

I have a new production Jungmeister, 7/8 Spanish in tri-color buffalo. Got it form shavingshop.com a year or two ago. Very good shaving razor, i have 6 or so Wacker razors in the rotation and they are among the best shaving in collection.

That is one hell of a score. You were right to ask and even better to go back and talk the guy down :tu If for some reason you don't like it I will gladly take it off your hands!!:D

That's a steal for Wackers. They go for over $250 in most cases I've seen. Here's mine, also a "Jugendstil":

http://straightrazorpalace.com/membe...sotd091121.jpg

Thanks John, but please explain me the following.
Herr Wacker has a supply of old blanks, right? He can stamp them with public domain brands like Bartmann or Dorko.
But at the same time you say that there are new blanks coming up too. What brands are these? Dovo, Revisor, Henckels, no-brands? Does Herr Wacker grinds these too?

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Originally Posted by John Crowley

Jungmeister is one of Heribert Wackers family brands. Sometimes when he locates a blank or group of blanks from companies whose trademark is now public domain he will grind and decorate them and with others like Bartmann and Dorko he has permission of the trademark owners to make their brand razors. There are a lot of new blanks being forged in Solingen now because the supply of old blanks has diminished significantly.

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Nice! :)

"Acero Plata", means "Silver Steel" in Spanish, by the way...

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Originally Posted by Muirtach

Here are the pictures. Far different from the rest of my stable, which is mostly wedge or 1/4 grind Sheffield with a nice 1/4 Henckels in there too.
http://straightrazorpalace.com/attac...-wacker-7-.jpg

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I have two Wackers so far, a wedge and a quarter hollow both in silver steel that I got from John Crowley. These are by far my favorite razors, very sharp and smooth shavers. I have a hard time rotating, want to use them every day. Really forward to getting more.

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Originally Posted by Leon

Thanks John, but please explain me the following.
Herr Wacker has a supply of old blanks, right? He can stamp them with public domain brands like Bartmann or Dorko.
But at the same time you say that there are new blanks coming up too. What brands are these? Dovo, Revisor, Henckels, no-brands? Does Herr Wacker grinds these too?

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First of all let me explain that when the brand information and model number etc. is forged into the shank it is done in the blank forging process in that companies die set. This isn't something that is done as a stand alone operation that I know of. I qualify this with a "that I know of" because I don't believe it has ever been done after the fact.

The Bartmann razors Wacker made about a year-and-a-half ago were originally blanks that were found in someone’s basement and had no branding on them. In most cases Bartmann was laser etched on these blades. Let me stop here and further explain that - as I have stated many times in the past - any razor coming out of Solingen has to be of good quality and pass both Solingen city requirements and requirements of the Solingen Knife Guild to have "Made In Solingen" on the blade. Just as all of the stainless razors from Solingen are cryo hardened 440C - the tool steel that the carbon steel blanks are forged from is a standardized quality tool steel. I read a recent post on the Skunk & Dagger forum where Joel made a comment that the stainless that DOVO uses is a better quality than the stainless that Henckels used. The joke is on him because they are not only both 440C but they come from the same foundry according to Anne Rothstein of DOVO

Boker has had new die sets made for 5/8, 6/8, and 7/8 - I understand at great cost - and their information is forged into the razor shank. Heribert Wacker has been setting up Bokers grinding operation and training the grinders. Since there are new Boker large blade blanks being made it is easy for him to grind off the Boker information and have Jungmeister or Wacker Rasiermesser laser etched on the shank and gold washed on the blade. The new Dorkos he is making have the Dorko brand forged into them. I really don't know if these are old or new but he has the right to make Dorko razors and there is quite a few of them. I suspect that these are old blanks he purchased from Dorko which is now into industrial cutters. What I do know is that they are quality products one way or the other.

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Originally Posted by Leon

Nice! :)

"Acero Plata", means "Silver Steel" in Spanish, by the way...

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I asked Herr Wacker about this razor and he says Karl Wacker is his father and this razor was made about 1965.

That is a nice razor. Thanks for the info John.

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Originally Posted by John Crowley

I asked Herr Wacker about this razor and he says Karl Wacker is his father and this razor was made about 1965.

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Well thank you for finding that out for me. Quite nice of you.

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Originally Posted by Oglethorpe

That's a steal for Wackers. They go for over $250 in most cases I've seen. Here's mine, also a "Jugendstil":

http://straightrazorpalace.com/membe...sotd091121.jpg

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What type of metal is it?