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i have Geneva and it has a rather large smile on it, it has always had this smile, but when i started using it the heel( i believe its called that) has been rather dull, but now its useless, it only a small portion, i could hone the thing to death but i was thinking why not use sand paper and even up the blade, i will not attempt this till i get a response cuz this is my grandpas razor.
Smiles are good on razors, just as they are on people. If you are honing, you can use a "rolling-X" stroke to get both the heel and the toe properly sharp. If you are not honing yet, it is probably best to send it off for honing. Most shavers, I think, would prefer a smiling edge to a perfectly straight one, and almost everyone prefers a smile to a frown. That's the same with faces too.
I wouldn't sand out a smile. That's my opinion.
Do you have pictures?
Without pics it is impossible to access what needs to be done. With pics I am sure that good answers will be forthcoming. Best, wildhog
i have Geneva and it has a rather large smile on it, it has always had this smile, but when i started using it the heel( i believe its called that) has been rather dull, but now its useless, it only a small portion, i could hone the thing to death but i was thinking why not use sand paper and even up the blade, i will not attempt this till i get a response cuz this is my grandpas razor.
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Please don't sand it out. There was a guy who used to breadknife out the smiles and then "hone down" the spine to get it to match, and that, IMO, ruins a razor. You just need to develop some type of a stroke so that you can get contact at the heal, middle, and toe (not all at the same time, obviously). I use a rolling X stroke.
That guy wore me out... :gaah:Quote:
Originally Posted by holli4pirating
you can try correcting the problem by lifting he spine off the sand paper and doing light pressure circles. Do sets of 5 and check after each set you do not want to over do the correction..
Smiling razors, if they could speak, would say:
"Hello there. I am here to serve you. I understand what you require, and I will povide it to you. Simply learn to use me, and move me properly across a hone once in awhile. I require nothing more. Shall we begin?"
Do not hone out the smile. The straight razor gods will hound you to the gates of hell, tear the flesh from your bones, and leave you to the flies and maggots.
Got it?
what grit do you suggest
The first pic shows excessive spine/hone wear towards the toe, the second pic shows it in the middle of the spine. Warped blade. Grandpas razor. Just sand it to get it clean and shiny, once it is polished put a layer of electrical tape along the spine for protection, from the stabilizer to the other end. Use a black magic marker to mark the edge/bevel and give it a few strokes and you will see exactly where you are missing it. This is where you want to "rock" the blade while doing your strokes to compensate for the deformity of the blade. While doing your X strokes not only do you want to lift or rock the spine you will want to make the stroke in a semi circular fashion like a windshield wiper in order to preserve granpas winning smile. I hope this helps.
As for grit progression, I usually start with 600 grit wet and dry and then 1000k, 1500k, 2000k and then shine her up with your favorite metal polish.
400 will work fine I think.
Themagicturtle!
You're getting some good advice for these guys! Listen to them! They are way more experienced at honing than I am.
I will point out that if and when you decide to clean up the blade, Please wear Heavy Leather Gloves! Even though the blade isn't shave ready it's still plenty sharp to do some very serious damage!!
Safety First! The gloves may not allow you to completely prevent a very nasty cut, but they will diminish the damage!
You don't need gloves when honing but still take your time and keep your mind on what your doing!
Keep us updated on your progress!
Smooth Shaving!
It's time for me to "Blasphyme" again, but here goes, I would bread knife the edge on a diamond stone maybe a DMT 325 or 220 [course or extra-course] ane then use PVC tape on the spine and start honing on your 1k or even 500 Grit if you have one and just keep going until a decent edge is put on.
The tape is to arrest what is already a great deal of hone wear- if you start on the 4K grit stone you will be there for quite a while mate'!!!! If the blade was a decent shaver before you CAN make it a decent shaver again!!!
IMHO, that is.
tinkersd or SRP!!
You can do all that extra work if you wish. Someone with experience honing would just hone the razor as it is and it will shave just fine. When I hone, unless it has a frown, I just sharpen the blade as it is. I find that most of the vintage razors I have were honed the way they are for a reason that improves the shave. Some razors that were used by barbers may have excessive toe wear. I guess that was what they used most. Razors like the one you pictures has less of a chance of slicing you with the toe if you are careful but still allow for the square point functionality. Which ever path you take, good luck.
Mod comment: The OP created two threads on the same topic. I merged them onto one thread.
Please don't breadknife the razor. It is an extreme technique that can be avoided with patience and a little reading/guidance.Quote:
Originally Posted by tinkersd
Hone the razor as is. When you take metal off....you can't put it back on. I'm with Joed on this one.
Remember, your grandfathers razor cannot be replaced and you would feel horrible if damage was done to said razor. If I was in your place, before I took said razor to the stone, I would ask myself if I was really qualified to do the job. If you are experienced in honing, fine. BUT, if you have any questions as to your ability to do the job,you should send the razor to one of our guys who do this all the time. A razor that your grandfather used is priceless, and a few bucks spent on a expert is nothing compared to that razor being wrecked. Very Best Regards, wildhog
Oh thank God! I thought I was having Deja Vu all over again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joed
BTW breadknifing just creates extra work.
This is the answer right here. This is not the razor to learn on. There are hundreds of poorly honed razors out there for learning. Send this one off. Please.Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhog
Where is the smile????
Look here for some info on edge profiles, everyone sees stuff differently but this will help, in general Smiles are a good thing and Frowns are not sorta like the same way they work on your face :)
Your's simply has a worn toe, also some odd hone wear in the center,,,
A simple 45 degree heel forward X stroke will do fine on that edge profile... Now if you don't know what all that meant then send it out to be honed and learn on an easier razor profile
All honing really needs to accomplish is to push the edge evenly across the hone(s) and then the edge gets sharp, everything else is a matter of degree...
Edit: I see that the pics did dot accompany the first post which is why there is so much conflicting info in here...
Glen, check the spine, it is still there, not so much anymore along the edge.
I wish greatly that I had an heirloom razor to use, but alas: I do not. Because of this, do yourself (and your Grandfather) some justice and send the razor out to be honed properly. I guarantee they can make it shave-ready, and possibly clean it up for you a little bit. A little toe-wear never hurt anybody. It's like the scars on my face from SR shaving - it adds character!
Yeah I think you were right in that post Kelly it might be a touch warped :( Could we also be not seeing a bit of a frown in the center????Quote:
Originally Posted by nun2sharp
So hard to tell in pics what would take 30 seconds in hand :roflmao
I saw that too, Glen.
Especially in pic 2.
+1... There is absolutely no reason to breadknife that razor. A breadknifed razor still needs corrective honing or grinding to the spine or you will simply hone the same shape back into the edge that you already had.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joed
I thought so too but wasnt sure. I put a straight edge up to the monitor(stop laughing!) and still wasnt sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
NOw is that a smile or a frown
Did you find the link in my post to the Wiki??? there is a really nice diagram of edge profiles in that link..Quote:
Originally Posted by Themagicturtle
IN the final instance you should consider finding on the the fine Honmiesters of the SRP site and send it to them, they will put a great bevel on the razor and then finish it to shaving perfection, or near so.
That would save a lot of debate and give you a great shave also.
tinkersd
I still don't really see the smile, I just have to agree on your call about the slightly honed out toe. The uneven hone wear in the second picture makes it seem as if the spine has a smile, as far as I can tell it has none. The second picture might show a slight frown, but my guess that it is mainly due to the lighting and quality of the picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
To the OP: for the love of God, don't breadknife this out. I have used breadknifing in my relative short honing career so far but only for severe chipping in he edge (1mm+ chipping). Judging by the pictures, you'd lose at least one full millimeter of good, unchipped steel that you can't put back on your grandfather's razor. My advise is practice honing on less valuable (to you) razors until you feel secure enough to carefully hone that one.
If my grandfather's or my father or etc. would've used straights that I inherited, I would 100% want to hone them myself. Sort of 'keep it in the family'. But first you'll have to hone about 10-30 other razors, I estimate.
