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After my near-screed on overlabeled new razors, I remembered a question I've had for a while about new TIs. The main reason I'm interested in trying out a TI is their old lead-hardening process. I'd just like to try out a piece of steel that's been treated that way. But if I buy a TI with a Sheffield blade, am I getting that same process? Does anybody know if they buy Sheffield blanks then harden them the TI way, or do they just grind them and put them in TI scales?
As far as I'm aware, TI uses Sheffield silver steel for the blades, as it is regarded by them as superior to french steel, so in a way they are all Sheffield blades.
They buy-in the steel blanks from a steel supplier, and these blanks are roughly formed to TIs specs by that supplier. The blank is cleaned, the hole drilled, file-work and shaping the blank to whatever design is being made is all done by TI prior to lead-hardening. Why lead? Because it holds and transfers the heat very evenly, not because it is inherently superior to any other process. The blanks are then annealed and ground.
Regards,
Neil
I've seen some of the Sheffield silver steel Ti's in various places, keen to try one to see if there's a noticeable difference between that and the C135 steel. Actually i could very easily get OT so will start a different thread on that, but suffice to say i have a Grelot, the popular opinion on which, apparently, are that they were Sheffield Silver Steel, and there is a difference in shave and therefore i guess, the edge they take. could also be down to the grind too but they are both 1/4's.
Anyways yes, they look quite appealing. I believe, classic shaving, the superior shave and rasupur all stock them.
Good eye Neil.Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Miller
Considering the effects of lead on the human nervous system it has it's dangers too. Aside from the heat transfer you mentioned, it also provides an oxygen barrier to the surface of the blade. Heating a blade in an open air environment, whether a fire or an electric kiln, allows oxygen to bind to some of the surface carbon in the steel and create a layer of iron oxide (scale) that has to be removed after heat treatment. A liquid, like molten lead, does not produce this effect, except a little color change. The blade can be manufactured to a near-finished state with less superficial material requiring removal during the critical grinding/polishing after the heat treatment is done. Having to remove more material at that point risks heating the blade to where the heat treatment is useless.
The lead mass represents a huge heat sink. The advantage here is that the lead, once at temperature, does not fluctuate above or below the set point to the same degree that an open fire would, nor the opening and closing of a kiln door. Having to watch a blade come up to temperature and not overshoot takes skills and you can't do batches of blades all at once. The Dovo video illustrates this very well. Opening a kiln door loses heat and you have to wait for everything to come back up to temperature. All that time allows for surface oxides and more finishing time later.
Simply put, it reduces wasted time and materials from a factory perspective.
TI has always used Sheffield steel, same as now. It's the only steel they use.
They require a very specific alloy which they can only buy from a specific manufacturer.
They piggy-back their orders on the orders of an industrial consumer which uses the same steel. The amounts they buy are otherwise not large enough for the steel mill to bother with at a reasonable price.
While lead is indeed the ideal medium for heat transfer, personally I wouldn't want to be near the baths. I like my nervous system the way it is :)
They did a big marketing when they switched their steel few years ago, and even to this day they continue it (Silverwing LE, another Silverwing, then another round of heat treatment improvements...). Currently all of their production is made from the same alloy they call c135, or sometimes carbonsong.
I have no idea if the steel is now made in Sheffield or not, but it definitely isn't like their previous steels or the other vintage brands from Sheffield. So, if you want the old Sheffield feel get an old razor, if you want the new steel feel get a new TI.
They came out with the C-135 for the Silverwings and announced that they were going to the same steel in all of their production henceforth. Before they settled on the C-135 they had at least one, if not more, experimental steels. I recall Tony Miller had one of the prototypes and it was so marked. I never got to try one of those but I have quite a few of the older TIs as well as a few of the current stuff. I haven't found a TI I do not like yet. I guess it is like having an ear for music, or not, but I don't feel a difference between the two steels in shaving with both. Honing might be a bit tougher on the new stuff, but not terribly so.
Tat lead won't hut yuu. I have beeeen etin' lead paint fur yers..no eeeeeeeeeeeeefffacts hab bbean noticced...
Didn't do Lead Belly any harm... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Wintchase
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2.../lead3full.jpg
Regards,
Neil
In my younger days I cast one hell of a lot of Lyman 429421, among many others. A lot of times in a Lyman bottom pour pot sitting on the kitchen table. Still here but the brain damage is obvious. :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wintchase
I recently saw something on T.V about Sheffield, England and from what I could see it seems to be a pretty depressed area. All the traditional industries are gone. I wonder if they do any metal work there anymore.
It's a lovely city actually, or at least was when I studied there ten years ago. Times have changed in dear old Blighted since the 80's.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
Sheffield has been a depressed area for many years, basically going back to the Thatcher era. I had family that lived in Sheffield and they ended up moving to Canada because the economic forecast was pretty bleak. That was 20 years ago, I'm not sure if they ever recovered.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
I was there back in the mid-80's, I don't remember it being so bleak but that was a long time ago. It's a working mans' town. Does anyone remember the movie The Full Monty? It was filmed and set in Sheffield, and if you remember the would-be strippers were out-of-work steel workers.