Help needed identifying very old 9/8 monster

I found this today in a market as part of a barbers lot.
It has a large barbers notch, no jimping, dark horn scales and bone spacer.
Jimping was introduced after 1840s so I am thinking it was made before then.
Pins look original brass.
I really like the form of these scales, classic and elegant.
Tail is comfortably big enough for 2 fingers!
The point of the razor has been worn down to 15/16.
I haven´t cleaned the razor. Apart from some patina it is really well preserved as it had a coating of grease which I wiped off.

My guess is that it hales from England but the name is really strange.

Show side of tang:-
"AK 41" or "AVK 41" - the letters are joined (see photos) so it makes it VERY HARD to find anything via google.
Reverse side of tang is blank.

Any clues would REALLY be appreciated.
I can post more pics if this would help identification.
Please click the link below to see detailed photos.
Thanks for looking ;)

http://img279.imagevenue.com/gallery...59_AKNo.41.php

Attachment 87162

I strongly associate numbering systems like that with razors made after 1880, but that doesn't mean much. There might be some numbered like that from earlier that I'm just not familiar with. The lack of jimps doesn't really mean much -- they actually go back to at least 1820, and I have one razor that I suspect is 1815-1820 which has them. Possibly a later addition, but I doubt it.

The AK/AVK character is curious. It *might* be a ligature for the Greek AVK, which is short for Aveklov. Possibly a place name? I wasn't able to turn up much on the name or what it means, probably because I'm typing Roman characters when Greek is called for. :)

It's certainly an interesting razor!

I identify it as a big badass razor! :)

The scales appear to have been replaced, ref the different pins. I also would guesstimate it to be much later than pre 1840, and I think Voidmonster might be right. The earlier stamps I have seen are less detailed, and typically would not be set in serif fonts.
It is hard to get a clear idea about the tang, but it seems to me to be later than 1830 as well.

In any case it is a very nice razor, hope it shaves like a dream :tu

Best of luck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by str8fencer

The scales appear to have been replaced, ref the different pins. I also would guesstimate it to be much later than pre 1840, and I think Voidmonster might be right. The earlier stamps I have seen are less detailed, and typically would not be set in serif fonts.
It is hard to get a clear idea about the tang, but it seems to me to be later than 1830 as well.

In any case it is a very nice razor, hope it shaves like a dream :tu

Best of luck.

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Thanks str8fencer,
I am glad you noticed the serif font style. That is definitely a pointer as to its age.
Doesn´t seem to match anything too early in the 1800s.
I noticed the different pins but should have described it in more detail.
The spacer pin has the traditional collar but the top pivot pin doesn´t, and it is noticeably smaller. Unusually small!
If this was a rescale then it was professionally done. The shaping of the scales, bone spacer and general finish is excellent.
They way the razor sits in the scales looks very original.
Still that pivot pin is really unusual!

I'm not an expert, for that we'd need Manah to chime in, but...

I would guess late 1800's or possible early 1900's for the blade itself, and likely later for the scales as they do look to have been replaced (though that's not a certainty).
Most early 1800's blades I have seen have a much shorter tails. Also, if it had jimping we could easily say mid to late 1800's but there were plenty of blades manufactured without jimping through the late 1800's and 1900's.

So far as the stamp goes, the depth and the font both suggest to me a later date as opposed to an earlier one. I think Voidmonster might be one to something with Greek. To my eyes (having studied greek) it looks like a capitol Alpha and a lower case Lambda.

Hopefully someone who's more familiar with these will be able to chime in.

Peace,
Jim

BigJim,
after looking at the tang symbols I like the idea of the ancient Greek letters Alpha & Lambda.
Would that suggest that this razor has something to do with Masonic origins?

A few extra pics of the scales:-

Attachment 87170Attachment 87171Attachment 87172

After spending some time searching I have come up with this......

I have a German Cutler marks document see here http://www.archivingindustry.com/cut...lermarks-1.pdf

They list a monogram AK belonging to an Abraham Knyn...

I have searched this name and found Razor makers

which lists... Abr. Knyn, Solingen-Gräfrath in 1922. Open-blade razor maker.

I cant tie the maker to an ak41 so all this may be of no help at all?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by monkeypuzzlebeefeater

After spending some time searching I have come up with this......

I have a German Cutler marks document see here http://www.archivingindustry.com/cut...lermarks-1.pdf

They list a monogram AK belonging to an Abraham Knyn...

I have searched this name and found Razor makers

which lists... Abr. Knyn, Solingen-Gräfrath in 1922. Open-blade razor maker.

I cant tie the maker to an ak41 so all this may be of no help at all?

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Nice work MpB :D

International Genealogical Index - Germany
4. ABRAHAM KNYN - International Genealogical Index / GE
Gender: Male Christening: 09 JUN 1831 Evangelisch, Wald Solingen, Rheinland, Preussen
5. ABRAHAM KNYN - International Genealogical Index / GE
Gender: Male Marriage: 04 AUG 1857 Evangelisch, Wald Solingen, Rheinland, Preussen

Maybe you are right.
I have nothing to use as a comparison with font type etc to give a more accurate identification.
1922 seems pretty recent for its styling and scale material........then again this razor is a real puzzle.
Thanks for your help :tu:
Lets hope Manah or Neil Miller can add more light to this conundrum.

Its possible he was making long before '22? or its possible Im way off the mark and he has nothing to do with it. I did have a quick look on Google image for Knyn and it does show some of his razors but I couldnt see any with AK logo