im committed to buying a W.W.Tait straight
either made by, or for, W.W.Tait of Nottingham
to me it looks early 20th
i cant see any info online anywhere
... pics once its mine
Printable View
im committed to buying a W.W.Tait straight
either made by, or for, W.W.Tait of Nottingham
to me it looks early 20th
i cant see any info online anywhere
... pics once its mine
Is there any other info on the blade? I have one that says solingen 5042 Importe D'allemagne, and then on the other side it has a Name on it that I was unable to find any info on whatsoever, I assumed that it was imported by the seller and the sellers name was stamped on it but manufactured by someone else. Maybe yours is similar
I can't find any W. W. Tait's in Nottingham, but there was a merchant of that name (William Watson Tait) in Liverpool, at one time in business as "Wm. W. Tait & Thomas Danson, Co, Merchants". The partnership with Danson was dissolved in 1800, but he married miss Jane Danson in 1800 and they went on to have 8 sons and four daughters. Just what W. W. Tait did is a bit of a puzzle - he is described as a 'merchant' an 'agent' a 'shipowner' and involved in 'maritime transfers' - there is even a record of him becoming a privateer in the Napoleonic wars and taking a Dutch ship - when we were not at war with Holland and which led to at least one of his bankruptcies (I have come across three). One of his sons - William Auther Tait - was placed in a merchants business after leaving school, then traveled to Portugal where he opened his own merchants business and traded with England.
Another son - Mortimer - owned a cotton goods factory in Manchester. Son Alfred became a sea captain and was famed for composing the song 'Fare Thee Well, My Dear Susannah. Son Ferdinand went to America and ended up as a sugar refiner in New Orleans. Ferdinands son Alfred served in Company D of the 155th Pennsylvanian Volunteer Rgt, serving in the Battle of the Wilderness, Antietnam and Gettsberg. He signed up aged 13 - the youngest person in the army, and he never got wounded!
Wm. W. Tait died of gangrene in Manchester in 1851, which makes it likely that he is not the W. W. Tait you are seeking. His business could have survived however - there is another Bankruptcy case involving a W. W. W.Tait and John Dover that extended from 1870 - 1911, so perhaps the firm was still going or there was indeed another W.W. Tait.
Regards,
Neil
Razor has now arrived ::
vendor pic
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...ps1ed5515b.jpg
tang says just WW Tait, Nottingham .. on the other side tho, it has a pistol pointing at a heart
which im sure ive seen before
pics to follow
In which case W. W. Tait was the agent or retailer who commissioned the razor, and Jonathan Crookes was the maker.
Attachment 123643
Regards,
Neil
excellent sir; maker established ..WW Tait remains a bit mysterious, tho he could have had a shop for a brief period only ..
Could we discuss J. Crookes as involved in Brooks and Crookes and history? I would like to now more about Crookes!
Neil should know! :p
Brooks & Crookes? Weren't they a country western act out of Tulsa?? Har!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
They always opened there act with You shot my heart with a revolver.
:roflmao:roflmao:roflmao
I think that was Brooks and Dunn. You, kind sir, are DONE! ;)
As far as I know, Jonathan Crookes (heart/pistol makers mark) had nothing to do with Brookes and Crookes (bell makers mark). The Crookes in Brookes & Crookes was Thomas Crookes (born 1825 died 1912), whose partner was John Brookes. Thomas Crookes wasn't even a cutler - in 1851 (7 yrs before the founding date of Brookes & Crookes) he was working as a solicitors clerk. His role in the firm was as a salesman - even after John Brookes died in 1865 he continued to travel and sell, leaving manager William Westby to run the company.Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
Jonathan Crookes (heart/pistol mark) was son of Jonathan Crookes, who was listed in a 1774 directory. Our man was born around 1787 and died in 1866. He was working for Joseph Rodgers & Sons - he is credited with the year knife but formed his own company in 1827. His son Henry joined the business to make it Jonathan Crookes & Son, and Henry continued to run the business after his fathers death. Henry died in 1892.
There were many others with the Crookes surname in the area and in the same line of business - spring knife makers, table cutlery makers, bowie knife makers and razor makers. Some examples are Crookes & Slater (c1856), Crookes Bros (c1865), George Crookes, George Crookes & Son, John Crookes (father of Henry and John - Crookes Bros and originally from Crookes & Slater), Samuel Crookes and probably a lot more. Must have been some family tie-in way back, I'm sure.
Regards,
Neil
Attachment 123712Attachment 123713Interesting info, Neil! This one has Johnathan Crookes, but no son. Also it does have "England" on the tang.
Could it be supposed that after the son's death, the company continued without the "Son" on the mark?
Jonathan retired in 1841 and the business was in Henry's hands until his death in 1892. That left a year after the Mckinley Tariff Act to include 'England' on the tang. There were at least three trade names used with the heart/pistol device: Jonathan Crookes, Jonathan Crookes & Son, Jonathan Crookes & Sons.
That was not the end of Crookes trademarks though - they were bought by Joseph Allen circa 1903. The marks passed hands again in the 1950s when Slater bought them. slater used the marks until the 1990s on knives.
Regards,
Neil
So, perhaps this one is an 1892? The blade design is surely different than anything I have seem from Jos Allen!
blade etch
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...ps45df0f07.jpg
W W Tait .. love the archaic typeface
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...ps863432e5.jpg
obverse with Heart&Pistol
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...psa4920297.jpg
naff hingepin .. but its brass imho
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...ps16e052e9.jpg
lead wedge
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/k...psafc40cea.jpgaltogether perhaps not of the highest quality .. but adequate
Wow Neil, where'd you get all that info from? I love hearing about the history of all the different makers. I really wanna get some of those books on straights but their all expensive to buy and out of print.
Quite a few are to be found for free by searching Google books - but it helps if you know what you are looking for, as you need to wade through a lot of stuff otherwise. Perhaps the single most useful book quoted extensively here - and almost word for word on some members websites - is Geoffrey Tweedales, which costs a lot and is not available as an e-book as far as I know. Old newspaper archives that are searchable are great, as are old telephone directories, that often have multiple entries for some makers showing all the things they sold, as well as advertisements.Quote:
Originally Posted by saitou
Ancestry sites are another good source of info, though very time consuming to sift through. A lot of the old Sheffield Trades Directories can be found online and in old bookshops. Perhaps the best sources are old bookshops and second-hand book sites on the web like Alibris and Abe Books.
Regards,
Neil
