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Which do you use and why?
I've never understood the appeal of vintage DE razors. Don't modern DE razors shave equally as well? Vintage especially with butterfly openings seem like they would be difficult to keep clean and maintain and look like they can get damaged easier too. Am I missing out? Help me understand?
When I started shaving long about 1963 I used a Gillette TTO. Probably a super speed, I don't remember. So maybe it is somewhat nostalgia, but it is also that they are great razors. Go back further to the pre and post war Aristocrats, the British Gillettes ..... great razors. Even further to the Gillette 3 piece razors, Bostonian, Big Fellow, great razors. I don't know that I could say they are 'better' than what is made today, but every bit as good, and maybe better. IMHO.
All four of the DE razors I have bought were vintage Gillettes and all were TTO. I bought them because they are available at antique stores for a fraction of the price I would pay for a quality new DE. Cleaning really doesn't seem to be an issue. My razors are all older than me and I figure if they have made it this long without damage the design is pretty robust.
Find an old vintage Gillette in good shape, clean it & use it,,,,then you will understand more than what this thread will tell you.
Do you guys own both vintage and new? Am I correct in assuming you all prefer vintage?
Searching for example vintage gillette fat boy on ebay, it doesn't appear very cheap.
My new DE razors shave well, but are made of plated base metal that is not long-lasting like vintage plated brass razors. New stainless DEs are durable, but costly. Many vintage DEs can be acquired in good shape at a cost that enables users to try many different models when searching for a blade/DE combo that is a good match for the users face. My vintage DEs are as old or older than I am and should be good for decades more use. I rinse them under hot water, remove the blade, wipe clean/dry, blow air into the cracks, then wipe and reinstall the blade. This takes about 1 minute to accomplish.I would like a stainless DE, but would not want to spend well over $100 to discover that it cannot equal the shave from an alloy new DE or vintage DE.
I use both vintage and new DEs. Vintage are still cheap to buy over here at yard/garage sales, even the Gillette Fat Boys. The Fat Boys have been talked up like some brands of straight razors so they can be pricey on the bay though. I get good shaves from either vintage or new but I like to use vintage stuff. Haven't had any trouble cleaning and maintaining vintage DEs either even the TTOs and adjustable TTOs. If you don't "get" the idea of liking to use vintage gear and are happy with the new DEs then you are not missing out on anything imho.
Bob
The older razors (in general) are made better but that doesn't mean they shave better. Many do however the best performing DE's (IMHO) are new ones. I know of no vintage piece that can shave as close as the R41 OC. Also there are new pieces like the Pils and feather AS series that are better made than any vintage razor.
To me it's just a preference thing like vintage straights and new straights.
For those of us old enough to remember, Gillette came up with a blade dispenser for their TTOs (twist to open) that made changing blades a breeze. The dispenser was metal, maybe later plastic, but you just pushed the blade with your thumbpad, hooked it over the raised portion in the center of the bottom plate, and pulled, Wallah ! The blade was loaded, no fuss, no fooling with a sharp blade between your fingers.
My main gripe with DE shaving now is fooling with the blades to load the razor. Next gripe is the propensity for companies to come out with three piece razors. It is true that we get to mix and match heads and handles, and I do like that, but having to manipulate all of these pieces is a PITA ...... AFAIC.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vWzo3raPuQ
Is that why there are notches on the bar? I bought some blades at the dollar store, Dorco I think, that came in a dispenser like that. It does make inserting a new blade a breeze.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
Yes, matter of fact, the two Aristocrats and the earliest Super Speed can be differentiated by not having the notch. IIRC it was 1948 that both models began having the notch. The earlier post war versions did not have it. On the bottom of the dispenser is a slot to store the used blades. A very nifty way to handle the whole thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leatherstockiings
Originally on the TTO Gillette razors the center bar was not notched. According to this site Razor Archive | Gillette Date Codes the notches started about July 1947 around the same time these new fangled blade dispensers appeared. Short answer, yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leatherstockiings
Bob
I have an Edwin Jagger DE89 and love it. It also cost me $45 including shipping. I also have 3 Gillette techs, same head, slightly different handles. My favorite is the basic 3 piece fat tech. I found it at an antique store for $8. It cleaned up easy and shaves almost identical to my Edwin Jagger. Maybe a bit more mild If anything. Like Hirlau said, go find a vintage Gillette and see what all the Vintage DE fuss is about. You won't regret it.
I should mention that I also have a Gillette fatboy. The fat tech is still my favorite.
I use several of both. I can get several older DEs for the price of a newer DE. (Disclaimer: I also use SEs and Straights, Kamisori, Shavettes, etc. )Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Different styles shave differently. Older DEs are cheap to try different styles. I can also find newer razors in Stainless. It's all about the experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
No problem taking care of my vintage razors. A toothbrush and toothpaste works wonders and is right there in the bathroom drawer. I've never broken or bent any of my vintage razors, but I have a few OCs that came to me with slightly bent teeth.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Yes!Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Until you have your first Razor Acquisition Disorder you won't understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Ive tried most DE razors new and vintage, some new ones I like some vintage ones I like also, my main DE razors are vintage British TV superspeed and Fatboy both from late 50's butterfly doors best part of 60 years old work perfectly and for me the shaves are fantastic.
I also use an Edwin Jagger DE89L
For me the vintage look great, hence a lot of new razors copying some of the designs.
But at the end of the day its what shaves the best for you regardless of age etc......
I have been DE shaving for 2 or 3 months. I have since purchased a Muhle R89, Feather AS-D2, Feather AC DX and have a Mongoose on the way. Does this qualify as RAD? I'm getting the itch for a vintage DE now, not quite there but you guys are pushing me there lol Only thing is I've just started with the AC DX a week ago and want to get the technique down before moving on to anything else. And I really want a real straight but that's going to have to wait. Next on my list is a quality brush, a Savile row or Thater.Quote:
Originally Posted by KindestCutOfAll
I would say that counts as RAD.
I have had ATT, Ikon Muhle and Plisson and Joris razors before I settled on vintage, I prefer a milder DE shaver so a lot of OC razor dont get kept with me.
Hows the AC DX working out for you?
In my opinion it's not officially RAD until your in double digits, but you are on your way. Mine was in triple digits before I got a handle on it. I've slowed down to a trickle on razors now.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
No pushing at all. Around here it's more like aiding and abetting! It is wise to start gradual and get to know what you like in the razors you already have. You picked up a good variety already. Once you know what you like you start looking for what you haven't tried yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Translated to mean 'After my RAD is in full gear I'll be ready for the SBAD'.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Welcome and good luck. Try to keep the cost down or you'll hate yourself in the morning.
I made a thread in the shavette forum about my ACDX experiences. Slowly getting there I believe. 8 shaves in. Still experimenting with grips, trying to find angles, left hand etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by alpla444
I'm not done with DE yet, I really enjoy DE shaving and want to try slants, open combs and I guess I'll have to try a few vintage now too xD
Right now I'm determined to stay away from the SBAD. I want 1 quality brush to go with my vulfix404 mixed badger/boar which I'll keep as a travel brush.Quote:
Originally Posted by KindestCutOfAll
Where have I heard that before? Brushes are like Lays potatoe chips, bet you can't buy just one.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
Bob
https://video.search.yahoo.com/video...&hsimp=yhs-001
Damn it, I feared as much.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
It's not that bad, I only have ten brushes now :(, with the last being an awesome Chubby 1 Super Badger, it's fantastic, like 3 brushes stuffed into one with lots of backbone, but then, I keep reading how nice the Thater brushes are as well......arghhhh! :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by RedGladiator
The first DE I used was one I bought this spring. It was a Parker. Not glamorous but I like having the longer handle. It serves me well and I like the end result.
This summer I went home and remembered that my dads DE was still in the medicine cabinet. I don't know when he last used it but he passed away in '82. It is as heavy as my new razor but the handle is almost an inch shorter. I was also able to get my grandfathers DE which is the same as my dads. I have no ides what make/model they are. I have only shaved with my dads razor.
Both new and vintage give me a quality shave. I like the extra weight of my dads but I like the longer handle of my new production. I have started using my dads razor just because it is a connection with him, not because the razor is so much better.
Play around. Try hard to stay in some kind of budget. Above all else, have fun shaving.. At the end of the day do you really need more than to have had fun???
Happy new year everyone!
I think the vintage DE razors are built with better material than modern razors, and I can get a good shave from either.
Modern razors seem more efficient though. I appreciate both for what they are and only own modern DE's at this time. I would be happy with any vintage razor over a cartridge razor as well...
I enjoy every aspect of shaving. I like being able to choose the tools I need to do this. I like the variety of razors that are available. Whether they be vintage or modern they represent a thrill just to use them. To be able to shave with a razor that someone may have used over 100 years ago is mind boggling. When I shave with a modern razor, I am thankful that someone thinks enough of shaving to continue to manufacture them. Maybe they are made just a little differently but still resemble the old tried and true ones.
We certainly are lucky to be experiencing all this in our lifetimes!!
I have Aristocrat adjustable, and a Super speed, both shave very well. However, I think my Mercur Futur and 39C are better shavers, more aggressive.
I am thinking of getting R41 to veryfy the claim that it is the most aggressive DE out there.
I don't know if the Muhle R41 is the most aggressive DE but it is more so than my Merkur 37c slant.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
Bob
I have Mühle's R89 and R41, Merkur's HD and Slant, a Schick Krona and an Old Type Gillette with the ball end handle.
I've spent a good amount of time with all these razors, but for my personal preference I prefer my Old Type the most, it's my daily shaver and my other razors don't see much use anymore.
I'm even thinking about getting rid of all my razors except for the Krona and the old type and eventually adding one or two more Old Types to the collection (the model with the thinner head), granted I find some without a crack in the handle.
I think others would get really good use out of the Mühles and Merkurs as they are outstanding shavers.
The Krona belonged to my grandfather and the old type to my great-grandfather, so a lot of emotional value accompanies shaving with these razors.
The Mühles and Merkurs are outstanding shavers as is the Krona, but I personally love and prefer the weight, balance and feel of the Old Type, I love the shaves.
Before I truly understood pressure, my R89 could give me irritation from time to time. My Tech, TV Special Super Speed, and Feather AS-D2 never did.
Once my technique evolved, I found it easier to get very close and comfortable shaves with 89s and a Progress set on 3.5.
The only DEs I still have and use are a pair of 89s (Mühle and EJ), and a NEW Long Comb. Modern wins for me in this case.
Incidental to this thread I shaved a 30-hour beard yesterday - shaved half my face with a GIllette Slim Adjustable and the other with a (new-ish) 2014 Muhle R41. The vintage Slim was set at #7 and both razors had new Personna Blue blades; I prepped with warm water and Noxema cream, lathered with Stirling soap - three passes and warm- then cold water rinses.
Conclusion? From first pass to last I couldn't tell a difference - the results seemed identical.
The Slim (in the photo below) is opened up to #9 and seen next to the R41 where blade exposure seems similar. If anything this test left me more impressed than ever with the 55-year old Gillette's quality and versatility. I think the Muhle R41 would be harder to clog than the old Gillette but I shave often enough that a clogged razor isn't a concern. Besides, I never clogged a straight razor so there's always that if I ever seriously beard-up and then decide it has to go. :D
With either the Muhle or the Slim I can easily get by with a single (ATG) or double pass at 24-hours - about the same as a straight. Neither of the safety razors provoked redness or irritation nor would I reccomend the R41 or the Slim (set above #5) for rookies.
Attachment 190377
Yes, the shave from my Gillette Fat Boy @9 with a feather blade is pretty close to what I get from the Muhle R41 with a feather blade. Close enough that it is hard to really tell if there is any difference. I can see the Gillette slim adjustable being the same as the Fat Boy. Couldn't agree more that Gillette adjustables set too high or an R41 are really not for beginners.
Bob
Forgot to ad that the Gillette Open Comb DEs seem the most clog proof that I have tried.
I do not know either, just what I have seen described by reviews.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
If you have a Gillette adjustable handy set her to 9 with a feather blade and you can get a pretty close idea of what the Muhle R41 is like. Personally I think the R41 might be a tad more aggressive than that.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
Bob
Don't have feather but I'll try with Super Iridium and see how it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
The 2013 R41 is an excellent razor, though I certainly didn't like the 2011 version, which was much harsher. Even a Gillette adjustable on 9 would not match the R41 for aggressiveness. The only razors I've tried that match its aggressiveness are the Merkur Vision and perhaps the Futur.
To answer the OP's question: I also have some vintage razors and some new ones. The best of the vintage ones are the SE's and the Gladweg pushbutton. The new ones I have are the 2013 R41, the Standard, Futur, Vision, and some cheaper ones. They're all pretty good, but I'd give them all up before I parted with my SE's and the Gladweg.
