Newbie Shaver Needs help!!!PLEASE

So I thought that I would get into Straigt Razor Shaving and for the most part I like it. I've been shaving now for 3 weeks, and I'm starting to have my doubts. I'm sort of a dive head first and break my neck type guy, and try and figure things out later. I did a lot of research before I did anything, so that I wouldn't slit my throat (I've managed not to slit my throat...so far). My razor is a DOVO Solingen with a Bergischer Lowe blade. I also bought a Fromm razor as well for practice. When I first got the DOVO I was able to do the hanging hair test and I was amazed it actually work. Which leads me to my first question. Should I be able to do the hanging hair test before every shave? I haven't been able to do it in about 4 shaves now. I have made sure that when I strop I keep the blade flat with no pressure, but the wieght of the blade. I have been doing 15 strops on the nylon, and about 50 on the leather, and I still can't do the hanging hair test. I have been getting really nasty razor burn on my chin(only on one side of my chin), and around my mouth. I look like I have a nasty rash around my mouth. So I though that I would have to maybe give the razor a little update, a little refreshing. So true to myself, I went out and bought some pretty good honing stones. Again I did some research on honing and have watched coutless video on how to do it...blah, blah, blah. I went out and got a #4000 Grit King Super Deluxe Finish Stone, a #8000 Grit Takenoko Polishing Stone, a #10000 Ceramic Super Polishing Water Stone - Naniwa, and a #12000 Kitayama Super Polishing Water Stone. I tried to give the razo a little sharpen, and again could not get the hanging hair test to pass. Which leads me to my next questions. I shave about every other day. Roughly how often should I have to hone my razor(just a refresh)? The razor came honed. I know that honing depends on how damaged or dull the blade is, but if I am just giving the razor a refresh, how many round trip strokes do I need to make on my 4000, 8000, 10000, 12000? I don't want to over do it, but I just want to have a nice sharp blade so I don't rip my face apart. Like I said before, at first I was thrilled, now I'm thinking about going back. I don't want to because I've spent a fortune on razors, stones, badger hair brush, cream, shaving cup. I like it because it relaxs me, it set the pace of my day. But when I get razor burn, it hurts like all hell and all I can think about is everyone starring at my mouth. Like I said before I've done tons of research so I know that I am shaving correctly, the blade is flat on my face with a very shape angle, I'm not digging it into my face. I think I have the correct technique (but what the hell do I know), I've only been doing this for 3 weeks. I have a couple other questions as well. Everyone says a straight razo shave is sooooo smooth. Really how smooth is it? Right now I am led to believe that I can get a smoother shave with a mach 3 or a fusion. My other question is, once I start getting pretty good at straight razor shaving, How long should it take to shave? Right know it takes me a minimum of 20 - 30 min. Any help is much appreciated, and I hope I didn't come off as "complaining". Like I said before I do like it and it sets the pace of my day. I just don't want to give up because I am doing something wrong and have wasted $1000. Please, Please, Please HELP!!!!:shrug::cry:

Hi and welcome!

It sound to me like your razor isn't sharp enough, and since you already has the hones you should read trough the Progressive Honing Guide, it gives some ball park figures for lapcounts on different hones, but you really should learn the different tests used during honing.

You might consider sending your Dovo out to be honed, and practice honing your Fromm, that way you'll have a benchmark for sharpness in your Dovo, so you'll be able to tell when your Fromm is shave ready.

Intervals between touch ups is hard to guess, I find that I prefer touching up mine every 6-8 weeks.

The biggest factor in getting a smooth shave is a really sharp blade and a good prep.

And give straights a couple of moths after you get a "shave-ready" blade, it takes some time before you get good shaves, but the shaves improves with practice:)

Hope this helps

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Originally Posted by Jabo

the blade is flat on my face with a very shape angle

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:confused:Can you describe this a little better? If the blade flat against your face you are shaving at a low angle , I don't know what you mean by sharp angle . Either the angle is low or high , or somewhere in between .

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Originally Posted by dave5225

:confused:Can you describe this a little better? If the blade flat against your face you are shaving at a low angle , I don't know what you mean by sharp angle . Either the angle is low or high , or somewhere in between .

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a low angle

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Originally Posted by Jabo

a low angle

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Okay , tht's what I thought , but I wanted to be sure . First let me say , don't expect to get awesome shaves in only 3 weeks . You may want to make your shaving angle a tad higher , experiment a little with the angle . Also your razor my need to be honed by a pro (there are members here that can provide that service) , you can have the best hones in the world , but untill you gain the experience to hone a razor properly , they won't do you much good . Be patient and take things one step at a time . And remember , beard prep , and stretching the skin properly when you shave are very important factors for getting a good shave .

Also, watch out for pressure if you're experiencing razor burn. Any pressure of the razor against your skin is too much. All you need to do is ensure the edge is staying in contact with your face. Anything more than that will cause burn no matter how sharp your razor is.

It does sound like your razor may be dull, but while reading your post another thought came to mind. What soap/cream are you using? Some guys have sensitive skin. For example I can't use products containing bay rum, lime or menthol. A shame really because I love the scent of bay rum and many soaps containing lime. If I use products containing those ingredients I will, in a week or two start having irritation much like razor burn. This irritation makes me much more prone to razor burn and then the issue just gets worse. I almost gave up straight razor shaving 7 1/2 years ago because of it. Lucky for me I stumbled on the solution and changed the product I was using. Point being that although it sounds like it may be the razor, it might not. If it is the razor try a refresh with a pasted strop. Pasted strops are often easier to learn than honing with stones, and will refresh a blade very nicely. Good luck and don't give up.

Patrick

Here is the guide I used to learn honing. This is the honing pyramid a very simple and reliable way for a newbie or a experienced member to get a good edge on a blade. http://straightrazorpalace.com/basic...g-pyramid.html

I would do an conservative pyramid as per Alans instructions and give it a test shave, then do a few finishing laps with your 12000 OR 10000 the same way Lynn uses his Escher then use the razor again when you have more beard to feel the difference.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

Should I be able to do the hanging hair test before every shave?

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IDK, I've never done the HHT. I don't have any hair to do it with.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

Roughly how often should I have to hone my razor(just a refresh)?

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Depends on how tough your beard is. Some hone once a year, some before every shave. Average seems to be once every 3 months.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

The razor came honed.

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Unless you sent it out to a honemeister (or honed it yourself if you can), it's not shave-ready, no matter what the box says.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

how many round trip strokes do I need to make on my 4000, 8000, 10000, 12000?

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You will feel a slight suction when the razor is ready to go to the next hone. This is the feeling of one extremely flat surface sliding against another. It's subtle but unmistakable. Don't blindly do X strokes like a robot; learn to feel what's going on with the edge.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

Really how smooth is it?

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Smooth as a baby's ass.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

Right now I am led to believe that I can get a smoother shave with a mach 3 or a fusion.

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True, but you have to do 2 passes. One probably won't cut it. Getting the ultimate shave is a matter of coming at the hair from the right angle, getting the blade at the right angle to the skin, and 1090 other little feel things that you'll develop over time. Once you get it, though, there's no comparison. You will piss on your Mach 3. You will swagger around, a baby-butt-faced god among lesser-shaved men. OK, you get the point. Your shaves are going to suck in the beginning, though.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

How long should it take to shave?

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Don't try to get faster. Let the speed come on its own. 20 min sounds about right.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

I just don't want to give up because I am doing something wrong and have wasted $1000. Please, Please, Please HELP!!!!:shrug::cry:

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You haven't wasted anything. You can get this. I did, & so can you. It's not magic.

jabo, that was scary reading your post, although i haven't spent as much money as you. i went through exactly the same feelings. and it really gets on your nerves when your keen to use the razor but lack of knowledge means the razors blunt and all you succeed in doing is scraping your face. i've probably been using mine for 2 years and still mess it up sometimes. i wasn't aware of the various levels of honing stones and whatever and it just makes it all sound really complicated but it can be done and the lads on here are proof. the feeling you have once you've given yourself a good shave with a straight is unbelievable but also when you cant do it you feel like throwing the stuff in the bin and using the wifes leg razor. USE THE FORCE!! sorry couldn't resist

You're only 3 weeks into this.

Can you remember how long it took you to take your first shave with a cartridge razor and walk away nick free? I was about 16 years old and that took me a couple of weeks. (too much pressure....Doh!). Errr. That was 26 years ago though.

If you have read a lot of posts on this forum about starting off, then you will know that most recommend giving yourself 2 months to get comfortable and 8 months to a year to become reasonably proficient at BBS shaves.

I'm about a month in and loving it. I occasionally manage a complete BBS shave, but most of the time I just get pretty dammed close to it.

You have been given some excellent advice above.

Stick with it. I'm sure we'll come good in the end. :tu

I think you have failed completely. You should go back to mach 3. (and send me all your stuff instead of throwing it away):w

Really though, if you have invested that much consider sending the razor out to be re honed. its 20 bucks or something and you will KNOW that you have a shaveready razor. As sturdy as they are it is very possible that through incorrect stropping/technique the edge can be rolled/damaged. Patience is the key. Go slow, speed will come.

Just like shooting: Slow is fast, Fast is slow, Front sight focus, trigger squeeze.
shaving: Slow is fast, fast is blood, focus on angle, pressure is everything.

well not quite just like it but you get the point, speed comes with practice and time. Technique is more important than anything.

If your razor passed the HHT when it came new from Dovo, than it was shaveready. From what I understand, it didn't tug or gave you bad irritation during those first few shaves. They do hone those razors at Dovo, and the ones I've seen all were sharp enough to shave with. I am aware that contradicts the general believe here on SRP.

The only problem is: they don't allow the spine to touch the hone, at Dovo, because they don't want to send out a razor with hone wear on that spine. Because of that, these razors have slightly more obtuse bevel angles, and require more work and special attention when you first hone them. If you put them flat on the hone, the tip of the bevel won't be touching your hone, until you've done enough work to correct that bevel angle. (You can check for that with the Magic Marker Test) There's a great video series, that covers it all, contributed by Heavydutysg135: http://straightrazorpalace.com/video...eo-series.html

That said, I think your biggest problem right now is stropping. You need some draw while you drag the razor over the leather surface. That generally takes some pressure, depending on your strop and the condition of your razor. Some strops generate enough suction to have lots of drag, others don't and require more pressure to be put on the blade. But either way: you must feel a minimal degree of friction. It also takes some speed. You can turn the razor (always over the spine) as slow as you want, but the stroke needs some speed. Russel Baldridge compares it with giving the razor a "carpet burn" (remember playing on the carpet during childhood?) After 20 laps or so in that fashion, that could possibly -depending on the condition of your razor- re-awake that keen edge by literally dragging it out, it's good practice to do a few zero pressure strokes to finish things off. Keep the strop taut at all times. More pressure on the razor, ask for more tautening force at the same time. Don't overdo it: you need some draw, you don't need to fold the edge over. It's a good idea to test for sharpness during stropping, the TPT was originally thought to barbers as a stropping test, although it is mostly used nowadays as a honing test.

Allow you face a few days of regeneration while you figure out what that razor needs to be shaveready again.

Good luck,

Bart.

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Originally Posted by Jabo

So I thought that I would get into Straigt Razor Shaving and for the most part I like it. I've been shaving now for 3 weeks, and I'm starting to have my doubts. I'm sort of a dive head first and break my neck type guy, and try and figure things out later. I did a lot of research before I did anything, so that I wouldn't slit my throat (I've managed not to slit my throat...so far). My razor is a DOVO Solingen with a Bergischer Lowe blade. I also bought a Fromm razor as well for practice. When I first got the DOVO I was able to do the hanging hair test and I was amazed it actually work. Which leads me to my first question. Should I be able to do the hanging hair test before every shave? Many will say no, but really, think about it if the razor is honed and stropped to a fine sharp edge why wouldn't it pop a hanging hair..... I will say that the HHT is not an absolute but it is a fairly good indicator assuming that the edge is honed properly, you can get a hanging hair to pop off a 1k stone too, but I wouldn't shave with it, see the problem here????? as you progress, the HHT can tell you more from HOW it pops the hair, rather than if it pops the hair....... I haven't been able to do it in about 4 shaves now. I have made sure that when I strop I keep the blade flat with no pressure, but the wieght of the blade. I have been doing 15 strops on the nylon, and about 50 on the leather, and I still can't do the hanging hair test. I have been getting really nasty razor burn on my chin(only on one side of my chin), and around my mouth. I look like I have a nasty rash around my mouth. So I though that I would have to maybe give the razor a little update, a little refreshing. So true to myself, I went out and bought some pretty good honing stones. Again I did some research on honing and have watched coutless video on how to do it...blah, blah, blah. I went out and got a #4000 Grit King Super Deluxe Finish Stone, a #8000 Grit Takenoko Polishing Stone, a #10000 Ceramic Super Polishing Water Stone - Naniwa, and a #12000 Kitayama Super Polishing Water Stone. I tried to give the razo a little sharpen, and again could not get the hanging hair test to pass. Which leads me to my next questions. I shave about every other day. Roughly how often should I have to hone my razor(just a refresh)? Totally depends on you and the razor.... The razor came honed. I know that honing depends on how damaged or dull the blade is, but if I am just giving the razor a refresh, how many round trip strokes do I need to make on my 4000, 8000, 10000, 12000? Depends on the bevel that yer statrting with, and the stones yer using, and the smoothness and lightness of yer honing stroke.....You just have to figure out that with each razor that you hone, the more razors you do, the better you get.... I don't want to over do it, but I just want to have a nice sharp blade so I don't rip my face apart. Like I said before, at first I was thrilled, now I'm thinking about going back. I don't want to because I've spent a fortune on razors, stones, badger hair brush, cream, shaving cup. I like it because it relaxs me, it set the pace of my day. But when I get razor burn, it hurts like all hell and all I can think about is everyone starring at my mouth. Like I said before I've done tons of research so I know that I am shaving correctly, the blade is flat on my face with a very shape angle, I'm not digging it into my face. I think I have the correct technique (but what the hell do I know), I've only been doing this for 3 weeks. I have a couple other questions as well. Everyone says a straight razo shave is sooooo smooth. Really how smooth is it? Smoothness is the definition of a straight shave, pretty darn close if all the stars in the heavens align correctly with the Blade Gods that day.....Prep is a huge factor here the better the prep the closer the shave with the same razor... many of the older blades even have this saying etched on them "If you lather well, I'll shave well" Right now I am led to believe that I can get a smoother shave with a mach 3 or a fusion. My other question is, once I start getting pretty good at straight razor shaving, How long should it take to shave? Again a relative question, at the gym in the morning before work I can shave in 10 min, at home in the morning when relaxing and enjoying my shave time, I never shave in less than 30 min.... Right know it takes me a minimum of 20 - 30 min. Any help is much appreciated, and I hope I didn't come off as "complaining". Like I said before I do like it and it sets the pace of my day. I just don't want to give up because I am doing something wrong and have wasted $1000. Please, Please, Please HELP!!!!:shrug::cry:

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Hope some of that along with everyone elses answers helps..... You really should have one of us hone and strop a razor up for you so you can eliminate a lot of the variables from yer shave routine!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Jabo

I just don't want to give up because I am doing something wrong and have wasted $1000. Please, Please, Please HELP!!!!:shrug::cry:

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I don't think I can add anything to help solve your shaving issues, but rest assured that if it comes down to it you can recover your costs on the buy / sell / trade forum. Don't worry about the cost loss, just focus on your practice