First time against the grain

I am no longer an ATG Virgin. I have been shaving SR style for about 3 weeks now and just went for the larger ares of cheeks ATG. I shaved WTG, then at a very slight XTG and then re-lathered and went for it. I got my right cheek without problems, but the left cheek the blade wanted to skip a little bit. I have trouble with the proper pressure when crossing my face and the left hand feels terrible. Practice makes perfect.

Do you veterans find that you end up shaving twice? I always shave, clean up and then find missed spots so I re-lather and hit the entire face again and end up with a great shave. I usually got WTG on both cases though, I guess it's time to go ATG on that second shave.

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Originally Posted by Dirt4dinner

I am no longer an ATG Virgin. I have been shaving SR style for about 3 weeks now and just went for the larger ares of cheeks ATG. I shaved WTG, then at a very slight XTG and then re-lathered and went for it. I got my right cheek without problems, but the left cheek the blade wanted to skip a little bit. I have trouble with the proper pressure when crossing my face and the left hand feels terrible. Practice makes perfect.

Do you veterans find that you end up shaving twice? I always shave, clean up and then find missed spots so I re-lather and hit the entire face again and end up with a great shave. I usually got WTG on both cases though, I guess it's time to go ATG on that second shave.

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:fim: PERFECT PRACTICE MAKES PERFECT:rofl2:

SHAVING TWICE IS UP TO YOU. WHATEVER YOUR COMFORTABLE WITH AND WORKS FOR YOU:gl:

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Originally Posted by Dirt4dinner

Do you veterans find that you end up shaving twice?

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No. (Not that I'm a veteran.) Some people do a final touch-up after rinsing off the face and feeling for missed spots. The water and remnants of soap are enough for this phase.

But I wouldn't go to the trouble of mixing up new lather if you've noticed some stubble. In fact I found it very useful in the early days to make a point of accepting that some stubble will remain. It helps you learn where the trouble spots are, and at the next shave you know where to make improvement.

My beard grows downward on my cheeks. What works for me for ATG in that area is to use my opposite hand (right hand for the left cheeck, and left hand for the right cheek). I get a lot more control, and no contorting my body and wrist. YMMV... :gl:

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Originally Posted by Dirt4dinner

Do you veterans find that you end up shaving twice? I always shave, clean up and then find missed spots so I re-lather and hit the entire face again and end up with a great shave. I usually got WTG on both cases though, I guess it's time to go ATG on that second shave.

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No, I am a proponent of the once over shave and believe that this is what we should be striving for. When done correctly, there is no need for additional passes and in fact, additional passes will have no beneficial effects.

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

No, I am a proponent of the once over shave and believe that this is what we should be striving for. When done correctly, there is no need for additional passes and in fact, additional passes will have no beneficial effects.

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I prefer to aim for the same, yet I noticed some areas get quite a few passes + patch-ups. So as of tomorrow I am starting a testing regime to be very strict on the single pass and to think about the passes I need. In general going ATG works well for me, especially on the "easy" areas (cheeks for me). Now the neck, that'll be a BIG challenge. :D

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

No, I am a proponent of the once over shave and believe that this is what we should be striving for. When done correctly, there is no need for additional passes and in fact, additional passes will have no beneficial effects.

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I realize I'm not a seasoned vet, but I'm not sure how you can say "in fact", here. I would say "in fact" ATG will get you closer than WTG. If you run your hand ATG over your face after a WTG shave, you still feel stubble. If you run your hand over again after an ATG shave, the stubble is gone.

I realize some guys choose not to go for BBS, but in my case there's no other way to get it.

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

No, I am a proponent of the once over shave and believe that this is what we should be striving for. When done correctly, there is no need for additional passes and in fact, additional passes will have no beneficial effects.

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Striving to get a good, presentable shave with
a single WTG pass is a great way to work on
technique and sharpness/maintenance of your
straight.

That being said, some folks will experience
further reduction of the beard by shaving again.
In barbering, this is called a `close shave' and
was often done XTG and with light lather or
water only.

Is your statement based solely on personal
experience shaving your own beard, or do you
have a source that advocates this that you can
direct us to?

- Scott

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

No, I am a proponent of the once over shave and believe that this is what we should be striving for. When done correctly, there is no need for additional passes and in fact, additional passes will have no beneficial effects.

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You post this with some frequency. I've noticed you say this a few times, and it's always troubled me (and annoyed me to be honest) the way you put it across. I've made a point of saying 'what works for you, might not work for any one else'.

Personally, I do WTG then ATG, and that works for me. If you're doing two WTG passes than that works for you, then keep on rocking.

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Originally Posted by Oglethorpe

IIf you run your hand ATG over your face after a WTG shave, you still feel stubble. If you run your hand over again after an ATG shave, the stubble is gone.

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This happens not to be the case for me. I have done this test several times with the same results:

1 )There is no stubble WTG, XTG or ATG

2) Additional passes do not increase the smoothness of the shave

3) Additional passes, especially ATG passes, always cause irritation

Keep in mind that a proper once over shave is not the same thing as a single WTG stroke. There are multiple strokes over many areas, and the scything motion insures that the orientation of the edge relative to the direction of hair growth is highly variable both during each stroke as well as from stroke to stroke. Essentially, each stroke is a hybrid of WTG and XTG.

Also, my stretching hand is constantly being adjusted to maximize tension, this means that it is regularly in contact with just shaved portions of my face. This gives constant and immediate feedback as to the quality of the shave; allowing for adjustment and touch-up action in the middle of the pass.

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

This happens not to be the case for me. I have done this test several times with the same results:

1 )There is no stubble WTG, XTG or ATG

2) Additional passes do not increase the smoothness of the shave

3) Additional passes, especially ATG passes, always cause irritation

Keep in mind that a proper once over shave is not the same thing as a single WTG stroke. There are multiple strokes over many areas, and the scything motion insures that the orientation of the edge relative to the direction of hair growth is highly variable both during each stroke as well as from stroke to stroke. Essentially, each stroke is a hybrid of WTG and XTG.

Also, my stretching hand is constantly being adjusted to maximize tension, this means that it is regularly in contact with just shaved portions of my face. This gives constant and immediate feedback as to the quality of the shave; allowing for adjustment and touch-up action in the middle of the pass.

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This would make a great video -- if you don't mind your mug being posted on the 'net!

I do four passes (WTG, XTG, ATG and usually XTG in the other direction). I could probably get by with less; but straight shaving is my luxury time.

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Originally Posted by fccexpert

...There are multiple strokes over many areas, and the scything motion insures that ...

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I think the usefulness of a scything motion is often underestimated. Combined with multiple strokes over an area it should give good results.
But we're all different. People who can go ATG without it causing problems will benefit from it, even if it is not necessary. It's kind of spooky being BBS 24 hours after a shave, but it happens on a good day.

Depends on your facial hair. I could never be BBS for 24 hours after any shave ever. Been shaving since I was 12-13 and I look like Homer Simpson four hours in to a shave no matter what. I used to have a beard and I could put objects in it and they'd stay upright, that's how thick it was.

If you need an ATG to get the shave close, then go for it.
I need three passes, or two and then a touch up where I feel stubble with my hand. Just water on the touch up is okay .

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Originally Posted by Rajagra

I think the usefulness of a scything motion is often underestimated.

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Not by me! sything gets in to the hollows of my neck without the need for a strictly ATG pass. One area has a NW-SE growth pattern and I get it BBS with a S-N stroke with a scyth.

There are many ways to skin a cat for sure.

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Originally Posted by Rajagra

People who can go ATG without it causing problems will benefit from it, even if it is not necessary. It's kind of spooky being BBS 24 hours after a shave, but it happens on a good day.

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How long you can go BBS after a shave has nothing to do with ATG or not. Assuming you have reached the point where there is no noticable stubble after a shave by what ever approach you use, how long this feeling will last is entirely a function of how fast your hair grows. On average, this is about 0.4mm/day, but it does differ from person to person, and an 0.4 mm growth is very noticable to the touch.

The only way an ATG or other pass after achieving BBS would extend the time until hair growth was noticable is if you are somehow cutting the hair to below the skin surface. This is a very bad idea as you will end up with ingrown hairs.

I never go for a full face ATG pass for a couple reasons. A) I do not require it across my entire face as XTG seems to do the job (and I DON'T have a light whispy beard), and B) There are some area of my face that simply will not tolerate ATG whatsoever due to my skin type. Having said that I always do a third pass, ATG, below my chin to the adams apple to get truly BBS. The whiskers lay nearly flat and grow directly downwards, so WTG and XTG won't cut it there.

I think finding the balance of needing the ATG is some areas over others is key. Sometimes I'm too lazy to try to isolate those particular areas though, and I just do a full pass atg.

For me, two good passes gets 100% - 90% done, but since I am BBS obsessed, sometimes, a third pass is in order to clean up rough spots on the jaw line and the lower neck near the adams apple. The lower neck needs a slant N/S pass going a little east and west since these hairs grow east and west. My straight is just to big to go ATG. It takes a careful touch, but it cuts those hairs just right - BBS, but not too much to cause bumps or burns. When all goes well, two good passes gets it all done. Other times I need the third pass touch up.

Some areas of the face like XTG and ATG and some just like XTG/slants You just need to find what works for you and it is a bit of a trial and error effort.

Good Luck!:gl:

Pabster