I'd like my straight razor to be as sharp as...

I'd like my straight razor to be as sharp as my disposable 2-blade Gillette razor. I shaved last night and around my lower lip and upper lip, as well as chin, there is a lot of pulling like they are not wanting to get "cut". After I got all done, and my face was basically dry, I noticed some straggler whiskers on my upper lip and the corner of my mouth. I grabbed up my 2-blade Gillette and simply whacked them off, quick and easy. In fact, with my wet shaving with a disposable, the only time I notice this much pull or discomfort shaving is after I have used that blade for about 10 or so shaves when it is getting past it's prime.

Why can't the straight razor edges be as sharp as those that are commercially made for these disposable?:rant::confused:

They can and they should be. Its either the blade, the prep or the technique.

First of all, how many SR shaves do you have under your belt? I'm guessing that if it's only a handful (as in a month or two) then it is likely due to a few factors, such as beginner shaving technique, mediocre stropping, poor prep etc. Sorry, I don't want to sound like I'm coming down on you, but it does take a while to get to the point when you get excellent shaves consistantly, the type that make you question why you ever liked your Gillette disposable.

The sharpness issue is separate. Was it ever pro-honed? Even if it, was a great honemeister edge can be made a sub-par (or dull) edge by the hands of a newb. If it wasn't I'd suggest sending it out to a pro near you ASAP.

A straight should cut and feel better then a new blade everytime. If it doesn't there is a problem. When I was first learning it was not like that all the time, but as I got better with the razor things improved.

I have recently been wandering if I had gotten used to my straight razor so much that I didn't know that it was getting dull. It always feels good. Then I got a razor from ebay that was NOS from Filarmonica. Thought that it being from a good company that maybe the edge would be better than the straight I have been using. Well, I now know what a razor feels like that is not sharp enough. A little while on the hones and its now a great shaver.

Any way, if the razor doesn't feel right there is something wrong. How long have you been shaving with a straight and was the razor professionally honed?

I agree that a straight should be at least as sharp as a DE or similar blade. If anything they can take a better edge as the steel is so good..!

More than likely if you are new to SR shaving its a prep and/or technique issue more than anything. It certainly was for me..! :)

Was the razor pro honed? If not, its definately worth sending the razor out for a honing.

Really make sure you focus on the prep though, that makes such a difference. Try applying a layer of lather, stropping your razor, then putting a hot towel on, then relathering. Only then start shaving and see how that works for you.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Sorry to say i would be a little disagree.
straight edge razor has been made for shaving for a long time.(sharpening when it gets dull etc)
DE is different story.
they have addition 2 more coating on the blade and it is disposable.
Try sharpen them and use it? you will hate that edge.will not get even close to straight blade edge/.
Now question is can you get same shave as DE from straight razor?
Answer is yes?
Why?
at first when you use straight razor you have fully control of the blade.
you can change angle ,strokes etc.
while you use DE you are going up and down that is it.
By using straight razor you could use scything motion and you will have a lot easy and fine shave .
hope this wont confuse instead will help.
gl

All good responses! Lynn has my Dovo and I await it's retun so I have a "yardstick" by which to measure. I wash up my face, hot towel, lather, do WAY WAY more prep than I ever did for the disposable and yet the disposable always feel better even if I have not prepped my face for it as well. Even dry. I keep a disposable in my brief case and at work I'd take my break time sometimes and go to the bathroom, use liquid hand soap, and thier luke warm water, put on the soap on my face and shave. 3 minutes or so later I'm done. Razor felt 100% better than some of the SR shave's I have had recently.

Now.. I stop following the regimen taugh to me on this forum Not too hard, don't push the razor into the strop, flip it over on it's spine and the go back the other direction. UP-DOWN is on count. I generally strop 40-60 rounds before shaving. I'm holding at at a 30 deg angle to my face, and shave WTG to start and ATG on a second pass. Very few nicks. I'm new, and have practiced a lot with a dull razor and can get all the face shaved clean with no nicks now, nor cuts.

I have hones. Norton slip stones of 1K, 4K, 8K 2 Belgian Coticule stones for slurry, a Franz Swaty barber hone and a Pike Emerald razor hone. I'm dilegent at the honing to get the right amount of light pressure and keep the edge even on both sides. Under a 20X loup it looks very nice will little marks on the bevel and edge straight. HHT (FWIW) also goes fairly well after honing/stropping.

I'm not trying to bitch, I'm trying to find out if you all really feel a smooth comfortable shave next to the disposable, or is / are my razors really that dull?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gibbs

I'm holding at at a 30 deg angle to my face, and shave WTG to start and ATG on a second pass.

---

this is the mistake you are making it.
30 deg angle is not must. it has been said to you just guide when you start to learn using straight razor.
Angle of the blade will be different.
The best way to find out is make small strokes and see in which angle blade shaves better . After finding correct angle use that angle.
Never shave ATG.
lastly
i like to add angle will depend how your blade honed taped not. etc.
hope this helps.

Thanks, gl, and others.
For the sake of curiosity I took apart the head of one of my 2 blade disposables, not DE, but disposable. The blade is only 0.0025" thick, or like we used at Boeing it is 25/10,000 thick. And they have a nice bevel on both sides of a piece of metal that is only 2 1/2 thousandth thick. Ya really gotta give them some credit to mass produce so many blades that can shave without first being honed or stropped.

I do adjust the angle. I've tried flatter to the face and more straight up, near 60-80 deg. An "aggressive" angle it has been said on here.

I thought that maybe it was because the width was a wider cut on the beard, yet if you just do little "trims" of missed whiskers, they seem to be just as difficult to cut with my straights as the full blade. The 2 blade disposable just whacks them off, as I posted earlier.

I told my boss today that I was shaving with a straight edge and he thought I was crazy. Asked me why I was doing it. Nostalgia, I told him. I could not, with honesty, tell him it was to get a closer, more comfortable shave. But, I do have hopes and will continue to preserve.

You may have sharpness problem too. wait for the blade come back from Lynn and shave test.
See how much difference you have.
don't use pressure while you shave .
let us know how it will go.
As long as you have patience you will get there.
it just takes time.
for me was 6 months for some people it is less then a month .
gl

You can't compare the two cause they are apples and oranges. The DE blade is commercially made, mass produced, very thin and has coatings which is really why they are so sharp. remove the coatings and you wouldn't want to use one.

The only thing I would be comparing is the final result DE vs Straight and in the hands of an experienced shaver the straight will outperform the DE by quite a margin.

I don't think you can expect to immediately get better shaves with a straight razor than you have been with a DE or even disposables. There are too many variables and a lot of things to learn.

I'm 70 shaves in with my straights, and I know they are shave ready. They don't out-perform what I can get with a DE yet, although they are getting closer.

It isn't just a straight razor. It's the person using it and how he goes about it in terms of preparation and technique. My shaves are getting better, and they are certainly better than they were when I started. For me, it took 10 shaves before the bloodletting subsided, and then it took 20-30 shaves before I was getting a passable shave. Now, if I take my time, I can get pretty close to BBS, but it takes work, patience and improvement of my technique. I'm probably one of those people who will take 6 months to get it right, but I'm willing to put in the time. The shaves may not yet be as good, but the shaving itself is much more enjoyable.

Yes, blade coming back from honing will give you a better base to compare.

I may have missed how long you have been doing this, sorry if so.

I remember reading comments that it takes time for your skin to become conditioned to the straight. Deep down thought that was silly, as if it was a way to say "hang in there". I was wrong.

Then i started straight razor shaving my head, after many years of DE on it. The shave quality felt like I was starting all over. Even just above side burns I wasn't getting as smooth as my face. I seem to recall it was a month or two before I had similar results on my head, as my face. That was with being a seasoned straight shaver on my face.

There are so many small details that contribute, and they all are to be adjusted as you learn. At some point you get it, your face gets it, and it is all second nature.

I'm only a few shaves into straight razor shaving, but I'll add my two cents. Last night I did get a very, very smooth shave on my sideburns and across my face, my 3 blade razor can no longer compete.
However, I'm having issues with my neck, chin and upper lip. My 3 blade continues to save the day and offer a very smooth shave. I can't wait for the scrapping and burning to stop.

My advice is to give it some time. I'm convinced that a SR can outperform a DE razor if properly used. The other benefits of a SR is the user experience, sustainability, savings over time and relaxation - none of which a disposable can ever compete with - IMHO

Since you've already tried steeper and flatter angles, I think you need to work on your stretching technique and the direction you approach the wiskers from. Not pulling the skin taught doesn't get the wiskers to stand straight up, so the razor slides along the hair a tiny bit before cutting and shave is not as close. Also, if the wiskers grow in a swirly pattern, you may have to shave from a different direction to catch them without the blade sliding down a tiny bit (and shaving less close). Both issues are compounded by having a dull blade.

On my face, I have to shave the mustache area nearest the corners of the mouth with a flatter angle since my face bends inward there. It's like the necessity to change the angle of the razor when shaving top-to-bottom over the point of the chin (only in miniture).

Also, on my face, I have to shave the mustache area above my canines XTG to catch about 25% of the hairs there well.

I'm still looking for the stretching direction, tension, razor path and blade angle that will result in a 2 pass BBS on my neck. It's only been a year and bit though...

ps: I think the multi-blade razor DOES do a better job catching hairs no matter which path / direction the razor takes, or how well you stretched the skin. The first blade pulls, the second blade "cuts" (ie: rips) the wisker. The shave is more irritating due to the pull, and not nearly as close once you get the hang of the straight razor.

Took me about 2 months to get an OK shave, 6 months to get a good shave, and at 9 months it was always perfect except for one side of my neck, whose side-ways growing hairs I'm still working on...

Hang in there !

Gibbster,
Lynn honed both of my str8s and I can tell that they're at least as sharp as my DEs--sharper I think. I'll bet when you get yours back you'll notice a difference. My 2 cents.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ace

... For me, it took 10 shaves before the bloodletting subsided, and then it took 20-30 shaves before I was getting a passable shave. Now, if I take my time, I can get pretty close to BBS, but it takes work, patience and improvement of my technique. I'm probably one of those people who will take 6 months to get it right, but I'm willing to put in the time. The shaves may not yet be as good, but the shaving itself is much more enjoyable.

---

Thanks Ace! I shaved tonight, after light honing and some stropping and although it wasn't wonderful it wasn't entirely "gut wrenching" either. It was improved. I have had close shaves for the last 5 shaves no. Close! I practiced with my dulled "Pakistani" razor to get down hold and technique and "imagined" myself getting good shaves without nicks. I'm only into it a little bit more than 2 weeks. I looked back and the first 2 razors I actually bought were at the local antique store on the 10th of Feb., and I didn't shave with them for a little while. They cost me about 16.00 each and are the Wadsworth and WISS. Then I got an ebay win of a J.A. Henckels, which is a beautiful razor of condition, but it's about a 4/8 or 3/8 and I even shaved with it tonight, but it handles a lot differently. Nice for under the nose. Then I bought some cheap razors at another antique store, a 2 for $7.00 thing, and one of them, the Gold Bug by A. Witte (Germany) is one I used tonight and seems to have a fairly decent edge.

No blood letting since the first 2 times (THANK GOD), so I guess I have nothing to be discouraged about. Just was hoping that I could get it down so that I can tell my boss that the shaves are close and more comfortable than the disposables. It takes me about 15 minutes I guess to shave, so someday I'll probably shave that down a bit (pun intended).

Is there much variability between the steels of the razor manufactures? Dovo, Thiers-Issard, Böker, Revisors and some of the older vintages? In other words, are there some that are just better at getting and holding a keen edge? Are the very thin "singing" razors close to the comfort of the disposables in their ability to get and keep an edge?

Learn by asking, doing, and practice.

GRAB YOUR GEAR!

It's challenging isn't it? I think your doing fine. Just hang in there a bit. A nice freshly honed razor can be wicked sharp.

You can do the same thing for yourself. Try it out and don't do any stropping at all, first shave. Then on the second shave do super, super light stropping. Keep that up for a while, essentially so that it feels like you are not even stropping at all. Do that for like 4-6 shaves, first time, if possible. Then start adding a touch of pressure, only as needed.

So, ultimate sharpness is built from thinness of the steel. But, the real trick is stropping it.

Here is the problem, stropping is a lot like surfing. You gotta catch the edge just right and shape the edge with the strop. It takes several iterations to catch the edge just right.

If you use too much pressure, you'll "blow" the edge and it'll never get sharp. You'll start out by dulling the edge. Just like the surfer that "jumps" too hard to get onto the surf board, the strop can apply too much pressure and dull the edge.

But, you have to also shape the edge with the strop. You just have to slooooooooooooowly work into it.

Let me put it this way, at some point, eventually, you'll be using a little pressure and stropping away, but getting to that point is incredibly frustratingly, and unbelieveably slow. It's probably at least 4-6 shaves in, before you can really start stropping. And maybe you should go for like 10 to 12.

Until then the only common effect is dulling.

Here is another way to think of it. Your going to be sharpening the razor with the strop. So, any pressure applied too soon, or any deflection applied too soon, is seriously detrimental. But once you "catch" the edge and start properly shaping it, the strop will continue to sharpen, and sharpen and sharpen.

But, it only takes the slightest miss stroke off a freshly honed blade (and at least another 10 shaves in) when the strop is more likely to tear at the edge instead of shape it.

So, fresh off the hone, no stropping. Second to 10th shave, only the weight of the blade and use very, very light and slow stropping. After about 10 shaves you can start adding just a touch of pressure and try "catching" the edge. As you can imagine, even stropping pressure is PARAMOUNT!

During this transitional period, guess what the effect is of any uneven stropping. A dulling sensation and a poor shave.

If that happens, re-hone, and start over again.

If you really have a hard time "catching" the edge, start stropping on something easier, like your hand (if your comfortable with this) or Levi's on your upper thigh. There is a lot less tearing from these other methods. Save the strop for a few shaves in. You'll find that even shaving produces enough of a skin stropping effect to be effective for the first few hyper delicate shaves.

You might be onto something of my frustrations. I have a tendency to strop straight away from honing, and will put some pressure on the blade on both the down and up strokes. I bend the strop with the razor doing this. I might be rolling the edge over and actually shaving with a less than sharp razor, or as sharp as it "should" be.
Willi Peters, of that youtube fame, said he only hones once a year and it does not seem like he spends an overt amount of time at the strop.

Not trying to feed the RAD, but...

I have found sometimes I will shave a razor that's new to me, thinking it's not for me. After using other razors, i come back and try that diasapointing blade. When I come back to it later, just plain suprised how well it works

Feed RAD is good. How about some eye candy for your appetite? This is a 6/8 size Revisor at their website Revisor Home Page

http://www.revisor-solingen.de/asset...ges/db_227.jpg

This is a NEW razor for 146 euros + shipping. Their designation is 1/1 and the ones that say "EXTRA HOLLOW" on the blade have that 1/1 in the description, where the others just say hohl. = HOLLOW.

I think this one is sharp enough to cut the hairs on an frog. Any finer edge and you can shave eyelashes with it..LOL I have heard that "singing" razors, such as the Dovo Prima Klang, have the ability to not only be sharp but be flexible to give great shaves. I think this one, being shoulderless, might be a "Singing" blade as well.

Does this help with the RAD??

I don't think the best honed edges are as sharp as commercial blades. That wasn't good news for me when learning. Now that I have better technique, I prefer the straight razor edge, even though it isn't as sharp.

Human hair, images, showing the hair outer cuticle that when we wet and get soapy have a tendency to flare out letting the razor edge grab and cut: 284075.jpg | Visuals Unlimited
and here: HAIR HEALTH FROM INSIDE OUT « ADRIANA SASSOON

I don't think I can post these imgages here, but may be ok to link to their images at the above website. Moderators, if it can be "image" posted, by all means go ahead and show the image. BUT, it does give an excellent illustration as to what we are cutting and why we need the pre-shave ritual to get an easier shave.