This is normal right?

Hello everyone.


This is about my third shave with a straight. I dulled the razor with bad stropping. (I was rolling the razor on the blade and not the spine because I am a newbie) I got my stropping corrected, but my razor was too far gone for a good shave at that point. I sent it out to Lynn, and I just got it back wednesday 8/2. It was perfect timing as I had some nice thick growth.

I took a balzing hot shower; and soaked my face awhile with a wash cloth. Got out of the shower and dried off everything but my face. Threw on some shorts and worked up some lather. (silver tip badger brush, sandalwood classic shaving soap) I brushed the lather on my face and then stropped the razor. I went very very slow making sure to keep the razor flat; and roll it on the spine at the end of the stroke. (30 passes) Rinsed off the dried up later from my face, and brushed on a new coat. The lather was good and wet, but still thick so I could not see through it.

I did a single pass that went fine on the cheeks, but went bad when I got to my neck. It barely even cut the hairs, and gave me some nice razor burn. I was sure to keep the razor almost flat to my face, but it seemed all I did was piss off my skin. I took a good look at the hair on my neck to determine the direction of the growth. I lathered up again and did a second pass on my neck, but instead of going straight up and down I went more at an angle to catch the hairs. It worked but by then my neck was too tender from the first pass. I had to give up half way through the second pass. My cheeks were able to take a second and third pass with no problems. Well except for the four or five cuts I gave myself. Nothing major just some interesting red lines here and there that did not bleed much.

I rinsed off and checked my work. Cheeks were pretty dam smooth I was very happy. My neck was shaved but still had the stubble feeling in a lot of places. My jaw line also had stubble that got more noticable the closer to my chin. I had to go back and finish up with my dam electric razor.

Please tell me this is because I am a straight razor rookie. I know my technique needs a lot of work. I would immagine my face needs to get used to it as well. Shaving straight down on my neck does not seem to work at all. Is it ok to play with the direction of the stroke to fit my hair growth better? Should I strop the razor more? I know my prep is good. I am confident I am stropping correctly and not dulling the razor. I will keep trying. I guess I am just looking for someone to tell me to hang in there. This has to get better. I hope it is just my technique.

Yes its because you are a razor rookie (I like that term btw lol). The neck is a major trouble spot and takes a while to really get a good technique going.

My advice to you would be to start shaving your neck with the balde almose flat, as in almost no angle and increase the angle very slowly until you start comfortably cutting hairs. Also, I make my lather more slick for my neck than any other part of my face, so you may want to try that (add more water to your brush).

I use about a 30 degree angle on my whole face BUT on my neck its probably closer to 10 degrees, my neck doesnt get irritated and I dont miss hair. I have very sensitive skin as well. On the bright side at lease all you have to worry about is technique and not the edge on your razor :)

Make sure you're stretching the skin nice and taught when you shave the neck.
Try lifting your jaw up and pulling your skin down with the other hand as if you're trying to strangle yourself.
Also, you may be using too much pressure if you get razor burn after one pass. Make sure you go with the grain on the first pass, everybody's hair grows differently.

The jawline and jaw/chin area is notoriously difficult, so it's just practice practice practice.

Redwoood

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Originally Posted by Redwoood

Make sure you're stretching the skin nice and taught when you shave the neck.
Try lifting your jaw up and pulling your skin down with the other hand as if you're trying to strangle yourself.
Also, you may be using too much pressure if you get razor burn after one pass. Make sure you go with the grain on the first pass, everybody's hair grows differently.

The jawline and jaw/chin area is notoriously difficult, so it's just practice practice practice.

Redwoood

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His answer sounds like what I was thinking. Try to make sure you stretch the skin. My first shave I forgot to and ended up cutting myself alot and got very raw.

You got good advice here. Let me see if I can add anything.

It's likely a rookie problem but not just for the reasons stated so far. Go to my gallery. i have a shot article I wrote on neck irritation from shaving. It may help.

The first thing that came to mind is that you were shaving the neck the same way as the cheeks (down your face). I assume you were trying to shave with the grain and you were shaving aggressively, trying to get as much of the whiskers as you could on each pass. For most men, the grain reverses on the lower neck, so on your first pass you could have been shaving long whiskers against the grain. That's a formula for irritation. If you're typical with the grain is up on your lower neck.

As the other guys said failing to stretch is a big problem on the neck, which is extra sensitive for most. But be aware of the direction of stretch. It makes a difference. The whikers most likely lean in one direction, which causes the grain. You want to pull against the grain, which stands the whiskers up. If the whiskers lean pull down. When you shave against the grain, that places the fingers i the path of the blade, so be extra careful.

Now let's talk about aggressive shaving. That's one of the major causes of irritation. If you try to take as much as you can with each opass that's agressive. It may be OK when you really know what you're doing, but for you it's just causing loss of control of the razor. THe easiest way to avoid aggressive shaving is to intentionally not try to take as much as you can with the early passes. If you do 3 passes the first two will be with and accross the grain. Do it gently and don't worry if you leave something on your face. The idea is to be down to a light stubble by the third pass. If you can, this would be against the grain and, if not, on an angle against or across.

In the first two passes don't shave over a spot after you've shaved off the lather. On the last pass you will try to shave with the minimum pressure that will cut, and you may go over a spot again lightly after you've shaved off the lather. If the spot is dry rub a little water on first with a wet hand, just to make it a little slippery.

Stretchind and non-aggressive shaving should take care of the problem, assuming your razor is sharp enough. Sometimes if the razor is just on the margin the problem will show up in the quality of the shave on you neck and/or your trouble spots.

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Originally Posted by Joe Lerch

As the other guys said failing to stretch is a big problem on the neck, which is extra sensitive for most. But be aware of the direction of stretch. It makes a difference. The whikers most likely lean in one direction, which causes the grain. You want to pull against the grain, which stands the whiskers up. If the whiskers lean pull down. When you shave against the grain, that places the fingers i the path of the blade, so be extra careful.

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See I didn't know this extra bit of info. I thought stretching the skin was to help keep from cutting yourself, not to lift the hairs. Now that I think about it, it does make sense :hmmm:

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Originally Posted by pitbulls20

I thought stretching the skin was to help keep from cutting yourself, not to lift the hairs. Now that I think about it, it does make sense :hmmm:

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You're right though. That's probably the main purpose. With a sharp razor, whatever protrudes gets cut.

Thanks Joe for your post yesterday. I'm a newbie as well and your explanation of how to stretch and why clarifies things a lot.

The grain of my beard on the neck is almost horizontal so it is a little problematic (at least at this stage of my skill) to go strictly in the direction of the grain but it's something to shoot for.

Bob

when i first started doing my neck i had to take many many short little choppy strokes to shave my neck. first week or so i only did 1 pass on my neck and finished with a shitty gillette sensor excel. it was uncomfortable and it pulled.

on week 2 it started to get a bit easier, i could do fewer short strokes and still get the job done. it wasn't very pleasant still and hurt (pulled) while doing it. i never got any irritation or razor burn / ingrown hairs from it though.

on week 3 i had it figured out which hand to use on what part of my neck. how i needed to go jaw down on the top 3/4 of my neck..and then S-N on the lower 1/4 of my neck in order to get the best passes with least irritation. also i found out that N-S passes with one hand might be uncomfortable while the same N-S pass with the other hand in the same location would be much better. so try different hands different places

on 4th week i could do my neck with very very little problem doing a couple long passes N-S would clear it all no problem. from this point onwards its very closer and more baby butt smooth each time.

SO, don't give up. understand it takes time to figure out all the little intricate parts of your beard growth. try differen't hands, understand that you AND your skin need to adjust. it will work out beautifully in the end, just keep with it!

~J

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Originally Posted by JAG

The grain of my beard on the neck is almost horizontal so it is a little problematic (at least at this stage of my skill) to go strictly in the direction of the grain but it's something to shoot for.

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I had the same problem. I have to go forward to go against the grain on my jaw and upper neck. I'm right handed and I do it on the left side of my face by using the lower heel of the blade and keep ing the rest of the blade up in the air. It takes a very sharp blade. I start with the flattest angle possible and when the whiskers get really short I increase the angle a bit and reduce the pressure. I also do the right side of my jaw and upper neck with the right hand (mostly I use both hands), in this case with the tip. I follow the same plan.

As my technique improved I foound that I could get most of the neck by shaving down and forward. I have an additional complication that the whiskers in the center of my neck are almost straight down and are pretty tough, so the last pass in that cener strip is straight up and over the chin.

JSCOTT, to me it sounds like your stropping and honing may have improved and had a lot to do with it. What makes me think that is the description of the pulling. Typically, that has to do with sharpness. What's really happening for most newbies is that they can't maintain a constant cut with the razor and end up skipping or not fully cutting all the spots. The short strokes allow for constant correction, but it takes a while to understand what the correction has to be.

As you improve you have a better feel for blade angle (flatness) and how the cut should feel. That allows for longer strokes because you're adjusting the razor to maintain the cut. See Lynn's video where he does the entire side of his face in one sweep, and watch the blade angle change as he goes around the jaw. That takes a lot of skill. It comes in time, but not quickly for most of us.

The only thing I'd add to all this good advice is the matter of unconscious improvement.

My neck was terribly sensitive when I started, even long after the rest of my face adjusted to the straight. I'm sure part of the problem was just the thinner skin of the neck getting adjusted, but also part of it was my difficulty in learning to treat my neck kindly with the blade.

I've come to think that over time, even if I think I'm repeating more or less the same techniques each shave, my hand and brain are making unconscious adjustments all the time. These days, I'm finding that I usually get a close and irritation-free shave on my neck, even though it feels to me like I'm shaving _exactly the same way_ I did when it was still very irritating.

A complicated way, I guess, of re-iterating the "practice, practice, practice" message. :^)

No matter how sharp your blade is and how softly you go over your face/neck, you are still removing skin with each pass. That's why you have to learn to save yourself. I only do 2 passes for regular shaving and save the 3 pass shaves only for special occasions. This is especially important if you have a sensitive skin like me.

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Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

No matter how sharp your blade is and how softly you go over your face/neck, you are still removing skin with each pass. That's why you have to learn to save yourself. I only do 2 passes for regular shaving and save the 3 pass shaves only for special occasions. This is especially important if you have a sensitive skin like me.

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I have extremely sensitive skin. I apply medication every day. I also need 3 passes to get an acceptable shave. So, that's what I do every day, without an irritation problem.

The bottom line is it's not the number of passes that matters, but the nature of the passes. I use rreduction, which is gentle progressive reduction of the beard, instead of trying to take as much as I can with each pass. I don't cut to clean skin until the last pass, when I have only a fine stubble left. That allows better control over the blade and avoids irritation. If you don't cut to the skin you can't irritate it. If you do so with a light stubble you can do it with better control and will learn not to shave off skin. You will get only a slight exfolliation, which may sting a little with some aftershaves, but no irritation.

Thank you everyone for all the advice. Every bit of it helped in one way or another. My last shave was much much better. I only cut myself once. I had much less irritation, and I was able to shave more of my face clean. I still had a little bit on my neck and chin that I had to get with my electric; but I definately improved. Being less aggressive really seemed to help out. It is also better for me to go diagonal on my neck instead of a straight down pull. I am confident I will continue to improve. I really appriciate everyone's help.

Two suggestions. Get rid of the electric. My skin is so sensitive that I have neve been able to use one for a clean shave. The passes over the skin really irritatte, and it takes time to recover. If you shave every day, it can affect your next shave.

If you need a razor to do touchups, try a diposable with a fixed (non-pivoting) head, something like a BIC Metal. It will let you get into the difficult spots easily and will not irritate if you keep the pressure light.

Don't worry about the nicks too much. They'll almost disappear in time. In fact, you'll only get them when your concentration lapses, or something like that. Do concentrate on avoiding irritation. Learn what has the most effect with your skin and beard and be careful to do it that way every time.

Joe,

That is very good advice. I agree 100%. Concentration lapses will happen and you will know it right away.:D

One more thing I found extemely useful.

Because the skin is a little slippery when trying to stretch the skin use a small flannel it will grip and make life easier.

Gary

ps Great advice about stretching in the correct direction. ;)

Each shave is progressivly getting better. Thanks again for the tips. I was able to shave my face with the straight completely. The non-aggressive approach was key for me. It really helped on my problem areas chin/neck. The less area I try to cover in one stroke for those areas seems to help me learn the technique more too. I really have to pay attention to make just the heel/tip/middle of the blade shave. I am still using my electric for touchups, but I have less to touch-up. I have to wait an hour or so after the shave to do this. My electric always did shave a little better if my face was dry. It caused less irritation that way too. I think I may get myself a DE in the future for touch-ups/quick shaves, but we will see how things go. I am hoping as I get better with the straight; I will have no need other inferrior shaving methods.

1adam12,

I predict that within one months if that long, you
won't need anything for touch ups.

A DE can definately be useful for say travel if you
don't want to go through the trouble of taking
along a strop.

Also it's kinda cool to bring a DE out from time to
time just for a change.

If you do get one - Use no added pressure. The weight
of the razor is more than enough to give you a super
close shave.


Terry

I had the same technique with electrics. The reason I started looking into straights was that last summer was coming up and I was going to start sweating. The hair becomes more difficult to cut and the sweat is an additional irritant. I don't use anything for touchups either, don't save much time in comparison to a DE and I find the straight shaving experience MUCH more satisfying.