Question about Scything...

So now that I am pretty confident with my blade angles and ZERO pressure technique (Alum hasn't even had a light sting for over a week now :) ) I am trying to add a scything motion to my normal shave routine as I read that this is easier on the blade

What I am doing is for now ONLY doing it with the WTG pass and only on the cheeks until I am comfortable with it,

How I am doing it is thus: as I bring the razor down in short strokes, I am "twisting" my wrist a bit so it almost pivots a little on the heel of the blade which I THINK is what I should be doing.... So far only 1 small nick when I accidentally went forward with the blade, but lucky realized it and pulled the blade away before I got cut badly (No blood whew...) The shave does feel a little bit smoother, but I am not sure....


Is how I am doing this correct? I've tried to read the Wiki and watch videos but they really aren't clear (to me) the exact motion..

Thanks

yea your doing it correct just keep your head in the game when doing this ive learnt the hard way not to look away from what you are doing when useing the described motions.

I think you'll get less benefit from scything on a WTG pass than you might from a XTG or an ATG pass. Personally, I never use this stroke intentionally and have never needed it. I tend to shave pretty quickly,
so scything would not be a good option for me. Also, I would choose strokes that get me a good shave
and not for the blade's longevity. That's why we have hones and strops.

To tell you the truth I never set out to actually do a scything motion it just sort of came by itself at some point. I could never actually tell you how to do it. I would have to really watch myself shave and that would be a mistake. In any event wtg is the only time I'd be using it.

I think sometimes folks fret about differing strokes and techniques and want to learn them all right away when in the end they just naturally happen as you get experience and confidence with the blade.

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Originally Posted by ace

I think you'll get less benefit from scything on a WTG pass than you might from a XTG or an ATG pass.

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Incorrect. Since the WTG is the "workhorse" pass you will actually get the most benefit from scything, shaving closer with minimal wear & tear on your razor. Scything is the most efficient shaving stroke, bar none.

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Originally Posted by ace

Also, I would choose strokes that get me a good shave and not for the blade's longevity. That's why we have hones and strops.

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Again, scything will do both. If you experiment (and I mean over the course of dozens of shaves with multiple razors) you will find that not only is this true, but edge longevity will increase almost exponentially. Yes, we have hones and strops and touch ups are easy to do, but when you think of wear/tear would you rather do 3 touch ups per year or 20?

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

To tell you the truth I never set out to actually do a scything motion it just sort of came by itself at some point. I could never actually tell you how to do it. I would have to really watch myself shave and that would be a mistake. In any event wtg is the only time I'd be using it.

I think sometimes folks fret about differing strokes and techniques and want to learn them all right away when in the end they just naturally happen as you get experience and confidence with the blade.

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I have to agree,its something thats hard to put into words,But Ill add this,when your doing it youll know,and I find that it works well on hard to get places.

I haven't done a lot of lately as I've been having some fun mucking about with a blade sampler for my DE but I find it an effective stroke around the Adam's apple and hollows of the neck.

M, You're shooting at the right target. Keep it up.

Thanks guys,

The adams apple I can get, it's the neck hollows that still give me a lot of trouble.... :(

After reading this thread and observing myself shave this morning, I do a lot of scything all the time, not even thinking about it... :)

I think telling Ace he was wrong about using advanced techniques to save the blade was a little harsh. I mean I think for most people the advanced techniques will come, but sometimes they're just not necessary. Some men are blessed with a beard that gets a DFS or even BBS without scything or buffing or anything.

I say more power to them. If you don't mind doing a little extra honing, so what? I can see how two separate schools of thought can exist for this and both would be right.

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Originally Posted by mcgyver74

Thanks guys,

The adams apple I can get, it's the neck hollows that still give me a lot of trouble.... :(

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I think most guys that have some angularity to their facial features would agree - always the biggest challenge. Those w/ full faces & no concave surfaces have it easy. Throw aging skin on top of that angularity & you have a challenge. Mostly, rather than taking the blade to the stubble, I try to make the stubble accessible to the blade via the stretch. Its still very much a challenge.

For new guys, it was very helpful to hear the experienced guys talk about what still remains difficult or impossible for them to do. One thread had pages of posts of experienced guys that still used a de or disposable to hit their 'problem' areas. I valued their honesty so I wasn't chasing the impossible. The problem areas get better, but very slowly.

I don't want new guys getting discouraged or feeling clumsy or dumb 'cause they think everyone else has this licked and they're the only ones who don't. That's why for now, true BBS, for me, is an impossible illusion. I'd spend 80% more time shaving if I still chased it over something between DFS and BBS. The shaves are wonderful. Savor that. The rest will come.

I enjoy the shaves very much actually :) Right now for me, I can get close to BBS with the SR, but I need to use the DE to touch up 2 VERY small spots on my neck, once I do that I am BBS :)

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Originally Posted by markdfhr

I think telling Ace he was wrong about using advanced techniques to save the blade was a little harsh. I mean I think for most people the advanced techniques will come, but sometimes they're just not necessary. Some men are blessed with a beard that gets a DFS or even BBS without scything or buffing or anything.

I say more power to them. If you don't mind doing a little extra honing, so what? I can see how two separate schools of thought can exist for this and both would be right.

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Perhaps, but that was not the intention. And I personally don't care whether someone employs the scything stroke or not. What I do care about is clearing up factual errors, especially if impressionable newbies are reading and getting conflicting information. You think I'm bad, you should get the scything lecture from Sham, he'll set you straight... ;)

If anyone, especially Ace, took offence then I do apologize.

No apologies necessary. I was attempting to make a point. That point, now perhaps better stated, is that the WTG pass is a beard reduction pass and that scything, while it may remove more whiskers, is still just reducing beard. On the later passes, XTG and ATG, aimed at getting a closer shave, scything can be more beneficial.

As for being more gentle on the blade's edge, I never scythe and can easily get from 40-60 shaves between touch-ups by merely stropping.

In the end, if I have to choose between my blade and my face, I know whose side I'm on.

If that is incorrect, I'm sorry. I've never actually made a mistake. I thought I had made a mistake once, but I was wrong. :D

As a couple have said, I started doing it without really realising. I mainly use this stroke for ATG on the jaw line, and as described by the OP, pivoting on the heel area...

I also find it most beneficial around the jaw line and chin, although I do it over my entire face. Saving the edge is just a bonus!

Wow, never realized how charged an issue this could be :)

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Originally Posted by carlmaloschneider

As a couple have said, I started doing it without really realising. I mainly use this stroke for ATG on the jaw line, and as described by the OP, pivoting on the heel area...

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Once again things don't come easy to me and straight shaving is one of them. I have had to actively pursue advanced techniques to even approach a DFS on areas of my face, like my chin and under it. Thankfully the wiki addresses this kind of thing in a very helpful way.

I'm still not expert at any of them, but I can apply them enough to where I can get a presentable shave. If anyone needed SRP and this fine community to make this even remotely possible, that man is me.

-Mark

I'm a slow learner too sometimes. I have found that the recommendations given to beginners is a safe starting point but doesn't give the complete story. For instance, I find that the very shallow angle is not very effective unless excessive pressure is used. Otherwise, as Dovo describes in their instructions the whiskers are shredded instead of cleanly cut. This is especially true in the hollow areas of the face and neck. What works very well for me is to use enough angle to feel the razor meet solid resistance from the whiskers. Keeping the edge of the razor just barely in contact with the skin I imagine gliding the razor over the surface, allowing the "butter knife on toast" sound to tell me that the razor is positively removing the whiskers. Doing that I get a very close shave and no razor burn with a single with-the-grain pass. Adapting a quote from hunting writer Robert Ruark, it's important to "use enough angle."

Yeah, you're right, I have less trouble with a straight around my adams apple than when I used a DE and before that a Gil. Sensor Excel.

Make sure you are wide awake and do not get distracted.
Good luck.

Actually, I put on my travel radio - with a little country music - close the bathroom door and just recede for a short while into my own world. I use the radio in case my dog barks. One time a while ago, while shaving, my dog went nuts barking after a squirrel outside my office window. I made my deepest cut to date when that happened. So, I use the radio as a 'buffer.'

Having just decided to add a slant DE to my overall mix, I can't help but see a correlation between the technique of "scything" and the different but related twist on a DE blade. The idea of slice rather that cut makes so much sense. Of course meat cuts better with a "slice" also, hence the added attention and caution, at least for me, as I continue the evolution of my shaving toolkit.