Can I finish and maintain with a C12K stone?

Hello fellas.

I'm really doing my best to make this straight razor thing work. I like it for the cost, the environment, and just the enjoyment of the shave.

I'm trying to keep it minimalist. Two razors, one strop, and a hone.

I've tried honing on micro abrasives, and I've got my full hollow to a shaving state....although it pulls a fair bit.

Can I finish on the 12k after a 3 micron film? I tried to finish on a .5 micron, I just think its to fine to cover the gap.

I'd rather not get into a norton 3k/8k due to cost, and i'd be willing to send my gear out to be honed to get my shave ready, if I could maintain it indefinetely with the 12k, even if it meant a quick hone every few months.

Thanks for the help.

Ryan

Yes you can, as long as you find a good one they are more than capable of that.
I've done straight from 1k bevel set to finished edge too, lovely edges from mine.

Yes, with the right Ch12k (PHIG) +1 with Blix

Just a thought, why not a Barber's Hone??? that is exactly what they were designed to do...

Several members on this board have razors that have been maintained for YEARS with just a few quick laps on the barber's hone each week

Hi guys,

well, honestly, I was trying to duplicate the barbers hone with the 12k I figured itd do, just take a whlie longer.

Ryan

Well the plus side to the PHIG, is that it very well could be more versatile in the long run, even if only because of the size...
The downside is that it really is luck of the draw, some are very very good, some are not so hot...
Hence the PHIG designation People's Hone of Indeterminate Grit.. BTW they are not even 12k that is just what is stamped on some of the boxes..
Now we have some people claiming as high as 15k which honestly I giggle at, but that is another story...

Either way I bet you can make it work...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

BTW they are not even 12k that is just what is stamped on some of the boxes..

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But it at least has to be higher than, 8k right? I mean the 'PHIG' seems to do something more after my Norton 8k. At first I really did not like the C12K. I actually stopped using it for a bit. Left the edge as is after the Norton 8k. Last week I polished off a razor with it and got very good results. Of course that could be from a combination of factors. Who knows? I am still learning.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mephisto

But it at least has to be higher than, 8k right? I mean the 'PHIG' seems to do something more after my Norton 8k. At first I really did not like the C12K. I actually stopped using it for a bit. Left the edge as is after the Norton 8k. Last week I polished off a razor with it and got very good results. Of course that could be from a combination of factors. Who knows? I am still learning.

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Ahhhh, First, yes I think so too I do believe that the edge is improved from the Norton 8k with a good PHIG but that might not have to do with "Grit"
If I were to polish out to a Norton 8k then go to, say a Naniwa SS 8k, or a Shapton GS 8k there could be (I use could be here because some people can't feel the difference either way) differences in the feel of the shave too, we know there are differences in the scratch pattern yet all of these are 8k's :)

There is much more to it then just assigning numbers to stones, this is one of the reasons I hate seeing Grit #' assigned to Naturals

Keep in mind I only know for sure that a Naniwa SS 8k is higher in grit then a Naniwa SS 5k I cannot say for certain that it is higher in grit then a Shapton GS 6k IMHO those numbers only correlate to the same series of the same brand :) and have ZERO bearing on Naturals...


Edit: Here is the "Definative" chart, that thread was 2009,, here is the problem with these Charts, it is wrong :) since that was made, and everyone thought that the Norton 8k was the same as any JIS 4k, which anyone honing razors knows isn't true.. Somebody took the time to find out that Norton's are JIS rated..

http://straightrazorpalace.com/advan...n-sheet-2.html


Back to the simple way of looking at it, "Grit" ratings are there to compare hones of the same series from the same maker...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

There is much more to it then just assigning numbers to stones, this is one of the reasons I hate seeing Grit #' assigned to Naturals

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I see what you are saying. I mean I would like a coiticule but I need to do more research on that. It seems that people have mixed results from them too. I guess right now the Norton 4k/8k combo and C12k are working so why complicate it more.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mephisto

I see what you are saying. I mean I would like a coiticule but I need to do more research on that. It seems that people have mixed results from them too. I guess right now the Norton 4k/8k combo and C12k are working so why complicate it more.

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We tend to "complicate" it mostly because it is more than just shaving for us, personally I like the experimentation as much if not more than the shave..

Give me a few Kamisori and my Nakayama and I could shave comfortably for 100's of years :)

With buying any natural hone, there are variances between them,, The Vintage Graded hones are the safest buys ie: Thuringens (Escher) and Coticules but they are also the hardest to find :(

A quick point to add for the concept of "two razors, one strop, and a hone": I have a PHIG that I like a lot, but some of my razors seem to respond better to it than others. If your two razors were like those of mine that *don't* respond as well to it, you might not be very satisfied with your setup. Just based on my experience; could be in my hands. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

Edit: Here is the "Definative" chart, that thread was 2009,, here is the problem with these Charts, it is wrong :) since that was made, and everyone thought that the Norton 8k was the same as any JIS 4k, which anyone honing razors knows isn't true.. Somebody took the time to find out that Norton's are JIS rated..

http://straightrazorpalace.com/advan...n-sheet-2.html


Back to the simple way of looking at it, "Grit" ratings are there to compare hones of the same series from the same maker...

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Wow, a lot of technical stuff there. Well, techy for me. It would be nice to find some quantifiable way of determining what is what between stones. I guess it would still not matter since the end user will always have a subjective experience of a stone. Quantifying would also lose the mystery of each stone. I mean isn't that part of the mystique with naturals. It goes beyond a chart or gradiation, leaving the visceral component left. The exploration of steel and stone. The adaptation of skill and knowledge to an unidetifiable component that is found in each natural.

Honestly, if you're only going to have one stone, save your money and buy the Norton 4/8K. The C12K's are difficult to master, and for a newbie, good luck. I quit using mine because I always dulled the edge with it. But, the 4/8K is easy to learn for beginners and it will give you a great edge. It also gives you the lower grit in case you need to touch up a ding which will happen eventually. The Norton is also 3" wide which is what makes it so easy to master.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mephisto

Wow, a lot of technical stuff there. Well, techy for me. It would be nice to find some quantifiable way of determining what is what between stones. I guess it would still not matter since the end user will always have a subjective experience of a stone. Quantifying would also lose the mystery of each stone. I mean isn't that part of the mystique with naturals. It goes beyond a chart or gradiation, leaving the visceral component left. The exploration of steel and stone. The adaptation of skill and knowledge to an unidetifiable component that is found in each natural.

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Way simpler " Synthetics are an Exact Science, and Naturals are a Romance" :)

Hi Ryan,

Of course the c12k works. Its slow. Painfully slow. Can it work is usually less the issue than how does it work compared to alternatives. As Glen will attest, you might have to buy several before you get one whose edge you like. Is it really that cost effective then? Toss in how different blades respond to the natural stone, and I can't see it as a best bet - compared to a high grit synthetic. I've not found a more cost effective edge than the Naniwa 12k unless you go to pasted strops. I have stones from which I like the finish better, but not for the money. I think we have many guys who've begun honing that concluded the same. I used the c12k for my first 7 months of honing. For the money - it does give sharp. If you get lucky, I hear you can also get smooth. I've yet to be that lucky.