Making my own soap.

So I have made several pucks of soap so far and wanting to know what I could add to it to make it any better. I just use melt and pour Goats milk soap and I add about a tsp. of shea butter, about a tsp of coconut oil, 30 drops of vegetable glycerin, about 15 drops of whatever essential oil scent I want, and I also add some african black soap which has a bunch of other stuff in it like jojoba oil and palm oil and african black seeds. I really just want to perfect the soap and what suggestions/ideas that you guys have. I've thought about clays like bentonite and kaolin clay but I can only find bulk amounts of it.

Oh yeah the measurement are for about 3 ounces of soap.

No suggs but keep at it.My grandparents used to make soap with fireplace ashes and god knows what else,was used for everything.

Cosperryan, you have a plethora of options regarding soap modification/manufacturing, so you should have fun. I'll start by saying that you are limited by using melt and pour base, especially if it is a non-tallow base; it's hard to beat the qualities tallow imparts if you're only vegetable soaps. If you have been hesitant about making your own soap from scratch because you think it's too complicated or costly, I say give it a try. First, it is extremely easy to do (both cold and hot process). Second, while the upfront cost of ingredients seems high, $60 can get you enough base oils (tallow, stearic acid, castor oil, coconut oil), lye (both sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide), and essential oils to make 7+ pounds of respectable shaving soap. It's hard to beat approx. $10 per pound of homebrewed soap using melt and pour, and you'd spend hundreds of dollars for that much manufactured quality shaving soap. If you brew in smaller 1 pound batches (I do), you can also experiment and refine your process and recipe. There are plenty of good books and websites out there on soapmaking, and check out this SRP thread for some more info too: HERE

As for adding ingredients to either your homebrewed or melt-and-pour soaps, take a look at these two website for information on ingredients and possibly for purchasing: Essential Depot and Making Cosmetics (I have no professional affiliation with either website but have purchased from Essential Depot with good results).

For additional oils often used in soap, you might consider avocado oil (great moisturizer to superfat with because it has many unsaponifiables), coconut oil, jojoba oil, and almond oil (in very low quantities). Stay away from olive oil because it harms good shaving lather. Many more oils exist than these few, so experiment away.

If you wish to use clay, you can purchase bentonite at Vitamin Shoppe and on Amazon (called Aztec Indian Healing Clay) and kaolin clay at the above Making Cosmetics website and on amazon, both in small quantities.

I agree with Annixter.

Try to make a real soap, not melt and pour.


You will find plenty of information here

In my opinion, a shaving soap or cream cannot be made like a "regular soap". It simply needs different characteristics and base oils and fats are different. The procedure is the same, though. You can use both cold or hot process, but - in my opinion - the base ingredients must be chosen according to different criteria.

I want to make shaving soap. First I figured I needed to learn to make soap. I bought a bunch of oil, butters, clays, lye, EO's & FO's. I've make some really good CP & HP soap. As a matter of fact, they are outstanding for the shower. I haven't gotten around to making any shaving soap yet. Maybe soon. But then I look in my cabinet and see 40 something commercial tubs of soap and cream, more that I could ever use, and I think " I need more soap like I need a whole in the head".

there has been quite a bit of forum traffic on homemade shave soap lately.

making very good shave soap at home is EASY.

a smart guy reverse engineered Martin de Candre, and modified the formula to make it a little easier to make at home.

the ingredients are stearic acid, coconut oil, water and potassium hydroxide. I used stearic 55%, coconut 45%.

it works better than any other shave soap I have tried previously.

use soapcalc to get the quantities right- and measure as accurately as you can.

a word of caution- potassium hydroxide is lye. it will burn you if it gets on your skin. (more accurately, it will try to convert all of the oils in your skin into soap. there isn't enough oil in your skin, so it attacks the rest of your skin...) when it is mixed with water it reacts, and the fumes are dangerous to breathe (trying to make your lungs into soap...). add the lye to the water, and slowly. if you add the water to the lye, it will react rapidly and violently, and probably splash out and get on you (see the bit about lye and skin).

make it hot process using a crockpot. do not use metal containers or implements for this process. put the stearic and coconut into the crockpot and melt them together. I got impatient and melted them in the microwave first. put the water in a heat resistant container- I used a coffeemaker carafe from the thrift store. add the potassium hydroxide slowly, letting it react and dissolve into the water. do this outdoors. add that mix to the oils, mixing vigorously. let it cook for a couple of hours, then scoop it out into a mug or bowl or mold or whatever you want. MdC uses a jar, although sometimes they do a special run and put it into a wooden bowl. let it cure for a few days to a few weeks. it is ready to use as soon as it solidifies, but it handles a bit better with some aging. it will never get as hard as a commercial bath soap, but doesn't need to, as you are not handling it like a bar of soap. after a couple of weeks mine is about the consistency of stiff putty- I can still dig it out of the mold with my fingers and press it into the soap bowl. it also has an odd soapy smell which fades with aging. you can scent it with whatever essential oils or fragrance oils you want. include the amount of essential oils or fragrance oils in soapcalc, but add them last thing, after it has cooled off, but before it is too stiff to mix.

some things to not put in your shave soap:
any oil high in oleic acid- ie olive oil.
clay. dries the skin and dulls your razor.
abrasive bits of stuff as exfoliant: ground up oatmeal, walnut shells, whatever. the razor does a great job exfoliating your skin as is, and bits of junk get between the razor and your skin and do nothing but mischief.

Making soap at home is easy as drinking a glass of water. Of course, everyone must follow some safety guidelines because lye could be dangerous and bridger explained this very well.
All the best shaving creams I tried have two main ingredients: stearic acid and coconut oil. It is now a long time I make shaving creams/soaps myself and all of the ones I made which I consider to be the best had these two ingredients in relevant quantity: stearic acid first and then coconut oil. I do agree on the quantity suggested by bridger (55% stearic acid, 45% coconut oil) and this seems to be a good formula ensuring a super lathering property and slickness.

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Originally Posted by bridger

the ingredients are stearic acid, coconut oil, water and potassium hydroxide. I used stearic 55%, coconut 45%.
. . . .

it will never get as hard as a commercial bath soap, but doesn't need to, as you are not handling it like a bar of soap. after a couple of weeks mine is about the consistency of stiff putty- I can still dig it out of the mold with my fingers and press it into the soap bowl.

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I think your recipe makes a shaving cream rather than a shaving soap. If you are only using potassium hydroxide, your finished product is about the consistency of hair styling gel (from my experience with liquid soapmaking). That's partially why people use potassium hydroxide as the lye in liquid soap recipes because they are able to take the finished cream and easily dilute it with water into a liquid soap. I think a shaving soap needs either sodium hydroxide or a mixture of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide (now my preference) to make it hard enough to be classified as soap and not cream. Essentially, from my understanding, if you can dig your finger into the cured product and remove a dollop, it's shaving cream and not soap.

On another note, have you considered using tallow in the recipe? A recipe using tallow will be superior in lather density/stability and moisturizing properties than one using only stearic acid and coconut oil. The addition of tallow might also firm up the finished product when using only potassium hydroxide to where it is more similar to shaving soap.

I made shaving soap first. now I'm thinking about branching out into regular soap. :)

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Originally Posted by RJD

I want to make shaving soap. First I figured I needed to learn to make soap. I bought a bunch of oil, butters, clays, lye, EO's & FO's. I've make some really good CP & HP soap. As a matter of fact, they are outstanding for the shower. I haven't gotten around to making any shaving soap yet. Maybe soon. But then I look in my cabinet and see 40 something commercial tubs of soap and cream, more that I could ever use, and I think " I need more soap like I need a whole in the head".

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nope. this is the basic italian soft soap recipe. to make cream out of it you'd need to add some stuff and whip it up.

what tallow brings to the recipe is stearic acid. it also brings oleic acid. for a bare bones recipe, straight stearic is better.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

I think your recipe makes a shaving cream rather than a shaving soap. If you are only using potassium hydroxide, your finished product is about the consistency of hair styling gel (from my experience with liquid soapmaking). That's partially why people use potassium hydroxide as the lye in liquid soap recipes because they are able to take the finished cream and easily dilute it with water into a liquid soap. I think a shaving soap needs either sodium hydroxide or a mixture of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide (now my preference) to make it hard enough to be classified as soap and not cream. Essentially, from my understanding, if you can dig your finger into the cured product and remove a dollop, it's shaving cream and not soap.

On another note, have you considered using tallow in the recipe? A recipe using tallow will be superior in lather density/stability and moisturizing properties than one using only stearic acid and coconut oil. The addition of tallow might also firm up the finished product when using only potassium hydroxide to where it is more similar to shaving soap.

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As for me, I use both potassium hydroxide and sodium hydroxide, the former in higher quantity. By doing so, I get a shaving cream of good consistency which can easily load a brush and make abundant lather.
I have never used tallow and, in my opinion, this is not fundamental in order to get a good lather with a moisturizing effect. There are plenty of shaving creams out there not using tallow while giving wonderful results.

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Originally Posted by bridger

nope. this is the basic italian soft soap recipe. to make cream out of it you'd need to add some stuff and whip it up.

what tallow brings to the recipe is stearic acid. it also brings oleic acid. for a bare bones recipe, straight stearic is better.

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While I am no soap chemist, my research leads me to a contrary understanding of terminology and the benefits of tallow. We are talking about semantics and splitting hairs to an extent, but I'm here to discuss things to further my own knowledge and for fun. The fundamental factor that separates a shaving cream from a shaving soap is the percentage of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide used. Soap equals a higher percentage of sodium hydroxide that results in a harder product; cream equals a higher percentage of potassium hydroxide that results in a softer product. A mixture of both creates differing degrees between the poles. Somewhere in that field of variants one crosses from soap into cream (I have no idea where), but we are talking about a pole if a recipe uses only potassium hydroxide. With this in mind, a batch using only sodium hydroxide makes hard soap and a batch using only potassium hydroxide makes a cream, whether whipped or not. Both go through saponification and can use the exact same ingredients, but one is hard soap and one is soft cream. From the ingredients lists on multiple commercial craft shaving soaps I've seen, there are no special ingredients that dictate what is soap and what is cream, aside possibly from some preservatives or thickeners to help with shelf life, packaging, and visual appeal of cream. Bridger (and others), if I'm mistaken in my understanding, I'd appreciate more information about soaps versus creams within the confines of our discussion.

As far as tallow goes, yes pure stearic acid has wonderful benefits for lather and stability, but tallow imparts more than just stearic acid and oleic acid. It also provides linoleic, myristic, and palmitic acids--none of which stearic acid provides. Compared to coconut oil, tallow provides 3 time more palmitic acid, and it has 24 times less lauric acid, which may be a better option for those who have dry skin. With the benefits of these added components over a strictly stearic acid and coconut oil recipe, I argue that a blend of all three is probably more beneficial.

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Originally Posted by razorguy

I have never used tallow and, in my opinion, this is not fundamental in order to get a good lather with a moisturizing effect. There are plenty of shaving creams out there not using tallow while giving wonderful results.

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I agree that tallow is not fundamental by any means. For my preference and dollar, tallow has benefits over non-tallow soaps I've used and is a cheap and readily available enough ingredient to make it very worthwhile in my recipes.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

While I am no soap chemist, my research leads me to a contrary understanding of terminology and the benefits of tallow. We are talking about semantics and splitting hairs to an extent, but I'm here to discuss things to further my own knowledge and for fun. The fundamental factor that separates a shaving cream from a shaving soap is the percentage of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide used.
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well, if you want to define martin de candre shaving soap as a cream be my guest. to me it looks like soap, smells like soap, lathers like soap and handles like soap. I'll continue to call it soap.

the high stearic acid content of this soap makes it come out pretty hard for an all- potassium soap. it's definitely not a cream.

it's funny how some things get repeated on the internet so many times that people start taking it as gospel despite the obvious.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

Bridger (and others), if I'm mistaken in my understanding, I'd appreciate more information about soaps versus creams within the confines of our discussion.

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I guess it is also a matter of personal definition. Some makers define their products as soaps while the density would suggest to call it a cream. In my opinion, a soap is something very hard, just like a soap bar or near to that hardness, whereas a cream is the rest. It is however clear that a dominant quantity of potassium hydroxide makes a cream and, by reading shaving creams and soaps INCIs, this element is always found before sodium hydroxide, meaning its percentage is higher than the latter.
I would also consider the percentage of water for the definition of cream and soap.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

I agree that tallow is not fundamental by any means. For my preference and dollar, tallow has benefits over non-tallow soaps I've used and is a cheap and readily available enough ingredient to make it very worthwhile in my recipes.

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Tallow goes rancid quicker than stearic acid or coconut oil, therefore shortening product's life. As far as I am concerned, I have found a lot of non tallow based creams or soaps providing excellent results as well as being very cheap in price. Tcheon Fung Sing creams are an example of a non tallow based shaving cream sold at a very low price. (the price for 125g in Italy is about 1.50 euros).

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Originally Posted by Annixter

The fundamental factor that separates a shaving cream from a shaving soap is the percentage of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide used.

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I'd say the fundamental factor separating soaps from creams is consistency.

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Originally Posted by bridger

I'd say the fundamental factor separating soaps from creams is consistency.

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Yes, of course, and consistency is determined by the quantity of sodium hydroxide and potassium hydroxide. It is quite impossible to make a cream from sodium hydroxide only.

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Originally Posted by bridger

well, if you want to define martin de candre shaving soap as a cream be my guest. to me it looks like soap, smells like soap, lathers like soap and handles like soap. I'll continue to call it soap.

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You confuse the intent of my posts. I've never used martin de candre shaving soap and was never trying to define it; rather, I am interested in furthering the discussion of how to make shaving soap at home--the thread topic. I simply wanted more chemistry details from you about using only potassium hydroxide in a shaving (bar) soap recipe because it is common soapmaking knowledge that sodium hydroxide is used to make bar soap that in the shaving world is shaving soap, and potassium hydroxide is used to make soft or liquid soap (before dilution) that in the shaving world is shaving cream (before whipping). I assumed you were a chemistry authority on the difference between shaving soap and shaving cream because of your comments about needing more ingredients in a recipe to make cream (post #11) and not using clays and not using oils high in oleic acid (post #7), but I am mistaken in my assumption. I won't waste our time asking you any more soapmaking chemistry questions.

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Originally Posted by bridger

it's funny how some things get repeated on the internet so many times that people start taking it as gospel despite the obvious.

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Unnecessary, ambiguous, cliche statements fall in that group of repeated thing too.

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Originally Posted by razorguy

I guess it is also a matter of personal definition. . . .

I would also consider the percentage of water for the definition of cream and soap. . . .

Tallow goes rancid quicker than stearic acid or coconut oil, therefore shortening product's life. As far as I am concerned, I have found a lot of non tallow based creams or soaps providing excellent results as well as being very cheap in price. Tcheon Fung Sing creams are an example of a non tallow based shaving cream sold at a very low price. (the price for 125g in Italy is about 1.50 euros).

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Well put. The water content would make a large difference, as would using softening oils in a cream I suppose.

With tallow, I'm concerned with small batches for personal use, so rancidity isn't a concern; however, I can see why manufacturers desiring shelf life might stay away from animal products. Before I stated making my own soap, I wished I could have found a good commercial shaving soap/cream for that price.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

Well put. The water content would make a large difference, as would using softening oils in a cream I suppose.

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Right.

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Originally Posted by Annixter

With tallow, I'm concerned with small batches for personal use, so rancidity isn't a concern; however, I can see why manufacturers desiring shelf life might stay away from animal products. Before I stated making my own soap, I wished I could have found a good commercial shaving soap/cream for that price.

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In my opinion, tallow based soaps/creams goes rancid quicker than non tallow based ones. As for animal products, we should consider stearic acid can be made from animal fats as well as from vegetable oils or fats only.
However, stearic acid made from animal fats is usually mixed with palmitic acid and it seems to have a longer life than tallow.

Well I will be trying all of the different ways you guys suggested. I will be making some more on tuesday or wednesday. I would like I can send some to you when its cured if you PM me and tell me how decent of a lather lather it makes and performs as a shave soap. I will keep it unscented so that if you use it and don't like the scents that I like or are allergic to it then there will be no problems. Again not selling just looking for feedback and constructive criticism.

I guess we all are here in order to look for feedback and constructive criticism, or at least this is how I see this forum: a place where we can share opinions and ideas while growing up all together.
It would be very interesting to try one of your soaps and if you believe I could be a tester, count me in. No problem in case you want to add your scents: I don't think they would kill me. :)
Moreover, in order to get a reliable test, I guess you should let us know the list of the ingredients you will use for your soap/cream, not necessarily the quantity of each element as I understand this could be an information you want to keep undisclosed.

Oh I wouldn't care about disclosing the ingredients. I do not plan on selling it. As far as the scents go, if you don't care then I will add some. I will be trying to do a leather and pipe tobacco scent but that will be an experiment and if I feel like it doesn't turn out well then I will do a different smell maybe vanilla and clove as I like that combo alot too.

cosperryan, I've been following this thread with interest, and have also followed the links throughout to other sites to get a feel for what is needed, as I plan to try my hand at making my own soap as well. That, and I've already purchased a jar of coconut oil at the supermarket for future use. :)

One recommendation on a place to purchase your scents would be The Perfumer's Apprentice. I thought of mentioning this one specifically for you since you mentioned a pipe tobacco and leather scent. The leather I'm not 100% sure they have, but I know they have Tobacco Absolute, which is in several popular tobacco scented soaps.

I use an electronic cigarette (and have since 2008) and have made many of my own liquids using flavor concentrates (which they also offer) purchased from there, and the service was top notch up to the last time I ordered. Their list of EO's and FO's for scents is pretty extensive, though I dunno how they compare price-wise to others. I haven't really looked because I was planning on ordering form them regardless since I've had such good experiences with them.

If you happen to come across some other good places for EO's and FO's, let me know... or any places selling stearic acid and potassium hydroxide for cheap, too. So far, I've really only been able to look on Amazon and a few other sites but haven't found super great pricing.

Also, definitely keep us in the loop with how your experiment goes! I'm always down to hear of others success! :)

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Originally Posted by crouton976

cosperryan, I've been following this thread with interest, and have also followed the links throughout to other sites to get a feel for what is needed, as I plan to try my hand at making my own soap as well. That, and I've already purchased a jar of coconut oil at the supermarket for future use. :)

One recommendation on a place to purchase your scents would be The Perfumer's Apprentice. I thought of mentioning this one specifically for you since you mentioned a pipe tobacco and leather scent. The leather I'm not 100% sure they have, but I know they have Tobacco Absolute, which is in several popular tobacco scented soaps.

I use an electronic cigarette (and have since 2008) and have made many of my own liquids using flavor concentrates (which they also offer) purchased from there, and the service was top notch up to the last time I ordered. Their list of EO's and FO's for scents is pretty extensive, though I dunno how they compare price-wise to others. I haven't really looked because I was planning on ordering form them regardless since I've had such good experiences with them.

If you happen to come across some other good places for EO's and FO's, let me know... or any places selling stearic acid and potassium hydroxide for cheap, too. So far, I've really only been able to look on Amazon and a few other sites but haven't found super great pricing.

Also, definitely keep us in the loop with how your experiment goes! I'm always down to hear of others success! :)

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Well I went to one of the links some one else posted (saveonscents.com) and they were pretty cheap and had EO's and FO's that were just ridiculous i.e. baby diaper and puppy breath. Also at brambleberry.com they have a leather scent that I bought and it is pretty good. I am looking for a cavendish smell for the pipe tobacco. I am going to be making some soap tomorrow and I will be doing three. One melt and pour that I am comfortable with and feel that I get really good results with, one cold process and one hot process. The melt and pour only takes a few hours before being ready for use, but the other ones will have to cure before I can post the results. I will compare the two process soaps to my melt and pour. If I do the process soaps right then they should better than the melt and pour, right/hopefully?

Yeah, cause you know... everyone likes puppy breath shave soap. :)

I'll definitely check those two out, thank you sir!

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Originally Posted by bridger

I made shaving soap first. now I'm thinking about branching out into regular soap. :)

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Is that your post on a soap forum w/all the cool pics?

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Originally Posted by RJD

Is that your post on a soap forum w/all the cool pics?

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the only soap pic I've posted is this one:
Attachment 137820

This is a GREAT thread...but reminds me of that movie "Ronin", where you never find out "what's in the box".

Bridger, et. al., could you all please post some recipes?