Frustrated with "THE FAT"

I have become pretty competent with a shaving brush and soaps. I have several quality soaps and enjoy them all but MWF has become my nemesis as of late. The scent is an intoxicating addiction and the performance is hit and miss for me.

I have experimented with different brushes and settled on my Semogue 2000 boar because it burns through hard pucks with ease and holds a lot of lather. Living in Idaho, I know I have fairly soft water and have had no problem lathering the FAT. I have settled on a 90 second brush to puck lather time. Soak the 2000 in warm water and then shake it out. Face lather to a sticky paste and add water by dipping the brush until I get a bubble free, thick lather.

The results:

Sometimes slick and wonderful. Sometimes it's all show and no slickness.

I have had some fantastic shaves and some of the worst shaves ever. It is obvious that I need to dial in my procedure but am currently at a loss as to "HOW".

I want to love this soap but am at the end of my patience. Any suggestions?

Try loading the brush for only 60-70 seconds and add more water. When a cream/soap isn't as slick as it should be, the reason is usually a lack of water. IMO, lather is too wet only when it starts running down your face.

I agree with CZ. I sometimes do not get enough water to the soap and it goes on pasty. I know then I need to really add the water to get it up to that fluffy creamy texture it should be.

My MWF is a staple in my soap collection. Between that and Poraso I could be happy alone. I do have some artisan soaps that I like too but the MWF like I stated a real nice soap to have on hand. And yes, I too love that soft subtle scent it emits for sure. Almost smells like a baby powder to a degree and gives one that tranquil well being feel.

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Originally Posted by CZMark

Try loading the brush for only 60-70 seconds and add more water. When a cream/soap isn't as slick as it should be, the reason is usually a lack of water. IMO, lather is too wet only when it starts running down your face.

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I have used THE FAT for the last 3 shaves and I believe I have dialed it in. CZMARK, you called it! With every shave I started with a slightly wetter brush and last night's shave was awesome. Not quite as slick as my beloved Tabac, but slick enough and tons of cushion. Probably my favorite scent of all the soaps I have tried. I believe that a finicky soap such as Mitchell's Wool fat needs several consecutive uses to figure out. It is obvious to me that using it once a week in rotation has hampered my ability to dial it in.

Some people love it, whatever. I personally found MWF to both smell terrible and perform worse. With all the absolute soap/cream gems out there to choose from, I don't have the patience or the need to figure out the nuances of it. Besides, I can't stand the scent. Unless you are in love with the scent, I say dump it if you're having trouble with it. There's a lot of other stuff out there to choose from that won't test your patience.

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Originally Posted by OCDshaver

Some people love it, whatever. I personally found MWF to both smell terrible and perform worse. With all the absolute soap/cream gems out there to choose from, I don't have the patience or the need to figure out the nuances of it. Besides, I can't stand the scent. Unless you are in love with the scent, I say dump it if you're having trouble with it. There's a lot of other stuff out there to choose from that won't test your patience.

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I completely understand your view on the matter, although I personally like the scent. Fragrance is obviously a very personal matter. We are all different. As for figuring out the "nuances", that's part of the attraction for many of us. If I didn't appreciate a challenge I would not have gone through the trials and tribulations of learning how to shave with and maintain straight razors.

To each their own.

Had the same reaction to MWF and could not figure out what everybody saw in it, until I soaked it in water over night.

Filled the tub with water and put the lid on, the next morning it worked fine. After that just flooded with water as soon as it started to dry out and not perform as easily.

I am sure water hardness plays a big part, but soaking works for me. I don’t like the smell though, MCD is much better…

It's no secret MWF needs more water then most soaps. Once you realize that you shouldn't have any trouble getting a proper lather from it. As to the scent, it's no designer scent just a pleasant one unless you don't like it of course. I think what sets it apart from other soaps is it's a really good performer but it's scent doesn't match the performance.

MWF doesn't lather very good with hard water, but it needs lots of water to make lather. Swirl, add water, swirl, add water.

I just used the fat today. First off grate it like cheese and press it. That will help immensely.

Second, I have found that hot water is counterproductive. I use cold water but I am sure warm would still be fine. I think it has something to do with the lanolin not being able to handle the heat.

Third, it is a stiff soap so it needs a stiff brush. You can use a very soft awesome badger if you want but you should choke up on the knot to give it some backbone.

Fourth: Use less soap. I swirl for maybe 20 seconds with a somewhat moist brush. I will start to build lather in my bowl and then when I figure it has gotten as get as its going to get at the current water to soap ratio I add a few more drizzles from the tap. I repeat this process till I get it to where I want. Sometimes it takes forever to get a good lather sometimes it doesn't but regardless it is worth it. I never use MWF if I am in a hurry though so it has become my relaxation shave soap.

Remember test and experiment with the amount of soap you load and water you use because YMMV. Hope all works out.

I've never understood the concept of taking something homogenous, like soap, and grating it into small flakes and then pressing it back into something homogenous, like soap. After a couple of times adding water to it, it's going to go right back into the state it was before it was grated. I know a lot of people recommend doing it, but it makes no sense to me.

For the people who are having trouble with this, or any other soap, do you try it and fail and then go on to another soap for the next shave? I have a hard time believing that relatively competent latherers would not be able to figure out MWF after a couple of successive days of attempts. If you just gradually keep adding water you should be able to come up with at least a pretty good lather.

I was having trouble getting a good lather from a new puck of MWF. I filled it's container with water and let it soak overnight. It has worked perfectly ever since. It now lathers as easily as Tabac.

I have been using MWF for the past 8 years and for the past 4 years I grate the puck then press it back into the container. I don't understand why it works, but it does. I can make a good lather with a solid puck, but after grating and pressing it, I can make a GREAT thick creamy lather.

As was mention in another post, use either cold or warm water, but not hot water. I personally prefer warm water.

One thing about grating and pressing, there is no need to soak the soap in water. Just start with a medium wet brush and start building lather. MWF is my all time favorite soap and is the only soap I have, that I have backup for. Five spare pucks in the cabinet now.

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Originally Posted by Utopian

I've never understood the concept of taking something homogenous, like soap, and grating it into small flakes and then pressing it back into something homogenous, like soap. After a couple of times adding water to it, it's going to go right back into the state it was before it was grated. I know a lot of people recommend doing it, but it makes no sense to me.

For the people who are having trouble with this, or any other soap, do you try it and fail and then go on to another soap for the next shave? I have a hard time believing that relatively competent latherers would not be able to figure out MWF after a couple of successive days of attempts. If you just gradually keep adding water you should be able to come up with at least a pretty good lather.

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Honestly I don't know really why it works but can only offer up a theory. I think that being it is such a hard soap that grating and pressing it kinda softens it up and thus easier to pick up more lather. Also if you press it but leave it a little rough it creates more surface area for which the brush can touch at one time thus again making it easier to load. This is just a theory that I kinda just came up with. It was suggested to me to do when I was newer to the game and was first using MWF and I have been doing it ever since. It works for some kinda reason.

I'm really not arguing that, and completely understand the concept of increased surface area, but that effect is not going to last past a couple of latherings. Adding the usual amount of water onto the soap is going to make the soap fuse back into its original state very quickly.

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Originally Posted by Utopian

I'm really not arguing that, and completely understand the concept of increased surface area, but that effect is not going to last past a couple of latherings. Adding the usual amount of water onto the soap is going to make the soap fuse back into its original state very quickly.

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Yeah that parts true, but still I also think it makes the soap as a whole softer and that part of it I believe last throughout its use. I think of it like a rock. Rocks are pretty hard and homogenous (not all of course I know but just for sake of example) but when you grind it up it becomes sand which is softer. Just a theory. The act seems to work though I don't have a definite explanation. I was just offering it up to the OP because its what I do and works for me. And I have hard water too and still get good lathering.

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Originally Posted by Utopian

I'm really not arguing that, and completely understand the concept of increased surface area, but that effect is not going to last past a couple of latherings. Adding the usual amount of water onto the soap is going to make the soap fuse back into its original state very quickly.

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Actually, it never goes back to the hard state like the original puck. As cosperryan said, it makes it softer and it remains that way.

If you are familiar with the MWF ceramic dish, you know how the puck sets in there with space around the sides. If you grate and press a complete puck, you have wall to wall soap from top to bottom.

I remember my grandmother grating bars of Ivory soap to do the laundry to help the soap dissolve, and I think this works under the same principal.

This is what MWF will look like after not being used for a bit. Like the others, I let some water soak in before trying to lather

http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/...pse2d41f18.jpg

But you both are missing one simple thing. The soap is not impervious to the water.

Put a tablespoon of water onto that soap, take a shower, and come back to the sink. If you try to dump the water off of the soap into your lathering bowl you will likely find that you only get a few drops of soapy water poured out. The rest has soaked into the soap. This happens every time with MWF. This, for lack of a better term, "melts" the soap back together into a homogenous, and softer, puck of soap.

I do have the ceramic container and yes I do recall that the puck did not fill the entire diameter when I first got it, but it has long since swollen into that intervening gap by absorbing a lot of water. Also, my old puck is much softer than it was when it was new because of that absorbed water.

Some soaps take more time like MWF and Williams. The results make the time and effort worth it for me.

MWF takes more water and more whipping than any of the 15 or so soaps in my rotation. Williams is the close second. The rest use way less. Try adding what looks like too much water and whip it. Don't like it, dump it and add more water next try. ;)

As mentioned brush type and water hardness can add to the difficulty or ease of lather making. I've lived in areas of hard and soft waters. They require more or less effort. Today I'm lucky with good water.

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Originally Posted by Utopian

But you both are missing one simple thing. The soap is not impervious to the water.

Put a tablespoon of water onto that soap, take a shower, and come back to the sink. If you try to dump the water off of the soap into your lathering bowl you will likely find that you only get a few drops of soapy water poured out. The rest has soaked into the soap. This happens every time with MWF. This, for lack of a better term, "melts" the soap back together into a homogenous, and softer, puck of soap.

I do have the ceramic container and yes I do recall that the puck did not fill the entire diameter when I first got it, but it has long since swollen into that intervening gap by absorbing a lot of water. Also, my old puck is much softer than it was when it was new because of that absorbed water.

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I don't know man its just what seems to work for me. Cant explain it. Its not really necessary either though as I am able to lather a non grated puck too but just makes it easier. Maybe the MWF has grating activated fairies that help with the lather in it. Don't really know.

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Originally Posted by cosperryan

I don't know man its just what seems to work for me. Cant explain it. Its not really necessary either though as I am able to lather a non grated puck too but just makes it easier. Maybe the MWF has grating activated fairies that help with the lather in it. Don't really know.

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:rofl2::rofl2:

I am now going to grate my puck of MWF and see how it goes. Aces!

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Originally Posted by LeoK

I am now going to grate my puck of MWF and see how it goes. Aces!

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Worst you can do is try it. Plus when you wash the grater there will already be soap on it.

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Originally Posted by cosperryan

Worst you can do is try it. Plus when you wash the grater there will already be soap on it.

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Multitasking!........NICE!!!

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Originally Posted by cosperryan

I don't know man its just what seems to work for me. Cant explain it. Its not really necessary either though as I am able to lather a non grated puck too but just makes it easier. Maybe the MWF has grating activated fairies that help with the lather in it. Don't really know.

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Been doing the same for the last 3 pucks,,, I agree I don't know why it helps but it sure seems too :shrug:

Didn't even plan it, I grated my first puck to fit into a new Soap Bowl and realized the difference, been doing it that way since

Ok, looks like I'm going to have to do an experiment and buy two pucks of soap I don't need. One will be grated and one will not.

Now my pizza is going to taste funny.

Ron you can save a ton of money and buy 2 pucks of Williams to do the test, it pretty much works the same way :)

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Originally Posted by Straightandproud

I have become pretty competent with a shaving brush and soaps. I have several quality soaps and enjoy them all but MWF has become my nemesis as of late. The scent is an intoxicating addiction and the performance is hit and miss for me.

I have experimented with different brushes and settled on my Semogue 2000 boar because it burns through hard pucks with ease and holds a lot of lather. Living in Idaho, I know I have fairly soft water and have had no problem lathering the FAT. I have settled on a 90 second brush to puck lather time. Soak the 2000 in warm water and then shake it out. Face lather to a sticky paste and add water by dipping the brush until I get a bubble free, thick lather.

The results:

Sometimes slick and wonderful. Sometimes it's all show and no slickness.

I have had some fantastic shaves and some of the worst shaves ever. It is obvious that I need to dial in my procedure but am currently at a loss as to "HOW".

I want to love this soap but am at the end of my patience. Any suggestions?

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I don't know if it will help being a newbie whit the soap but, i used the same technic as Williams mug(modern) and it works fine for me. What i do first when the soap is new, i soak it over night in a mug. Just before i shave i dump the water and put warm(not hot) tap water in the mug and i let the brush soak whit it for about 10 to 15 min(got enough time for a shower or face prep). For the brush i use a stiff boar brush. I squeeze the water of my brush in my lathering bowl and i swirl on my soap and load heavely(load like i hate the soap). Usualy i took the puck in my hand and load it upside down. After i go whit the brush in my lathering bowl and make my lather i swirl for a min or 2 some times i ad water if needed and mix it again until the lather is ready. That method works for me and i got amazing results. Of course whe i use it for straight shave some times i have to relather but i have to do that for any other soaps or cream i use, i like to take my time when i straight shave.